The Cause Of Baldness

[Broco6679]

good find, thanks. Overall peat does have fantastic hair. Do you believe his use of thyroid and keeping pufa low is the main reason?

I listened to a podcast with Peat today where he said he didn't start taking thyroid until he was 38. I imagine a lot of his hairloss came before this considering his hair has held strong over the past thirty years or so.

 

[mrchibbs]

I listened to a podcast with Peat today where he said he didn't start taking thyroid until the age of 38. I would imagine a lot of his hairloss came before his use of thyroid, since his hair has held strong over the past thirty years or so.

And even then, many of his ideas on CO2, serotonin, etc. only began to take form in the 1990s, when he was in his early 60s. It's like his speech, many people say he sounds "old" or frail on the phone, but he sounded exactly the same in 1996.

If you read Nutrition for Women, a lot of it is still good stuff, but you can see how dated it is in some parts. Ray wrote a preamble to the book explaining that he'd rather not rewrite what we wrote then, but instead leave it as it was. This little intro is an amazing read btw, everyone should read it.

His hair is clearly thinner than it was when he was young, but it's still a reasonably full head of hair for an 80+ year old man. I suspect anyone who takes active steps to correct their life environment earlier say in their 20s or 30s, could get even better results. In the end however, it's undeniable that the process of early development and hormonal imprinting can make some people more resilient, and others, seemingly always at the short end of the stick.

 

[Broco6679]

And even then, many of his ideas on CO2, serotonin, etc. only began to take form in the 1990s, when he was in his early 60s. It's like his speech, many people say he sounds "old" or frail on the phone, but he sounded exactly the same in 1996.

If you read Nutrition for Women, a lot of it is still good stuff, but you can see how dated it is in some parts. Ray wrote a preamble to the book explaining that he'd rather not rewrite what we wrote then, but instead leave it as it was. This little intro is an amazing read btw, everyone should read it.

His hair is clearly thinner than it was when he was young, but it's still a reasonably full head of hair for an 80+ year old man. I suspect anyone who takes active steps to correct their life environment earlier say in their 20s or 30s, could get even better results. In the end however, it's undeniable that the process of early development and hormonal imprinting can make some people more resilient, and others, seemingly always at the short end of the stick.

Very good point.

People love to reject Ray's ideas because he's not jacked with an NW1 hairline at 87. The ironic thing is they don't apply that same logic to the obese, bald, hypertensive and insulin resistant mid-forties physician who's prescribing them finasteride, metformin and prozac. Ray's work is often misinterpreted as a way to live forever, to prevent/reverse all forms of aging, as a fix all for every disease, etc, and whenever reality deviates from that, they use it as a way to reject him entirely. Acknowledging and addressing the underlying energetic deficiency of degenerative disease is not the same as promising the fountain of youth. Regardless, it's their loss.

As a side note: is nutrition for women worth the read? I've never sought it out since it has so much content Ray no longer supports, but since you speak highly of it, I may give it a chance.

 

[mrchibbs]

People love to reject Ray's ideas because he's not jacked with an NW1 hairline at 87. The ironic thing is they don't apply that same logic to the obese, bald, hypertensive and insulin resistant general practitioner who's prescribing them finasteride, metformin and prozac. Ray's work is often misinterpreted as a way to live forever, to prevent/reverse all forms of aging, as a fix all for every disease, etc, and whenever reality deviates from that, they use it as a way to reject him entirely. Acknowledging and addressing the underlying energetic deficiency of degenerate disease is not the same as promising the fountain of youth. Regardless, it's their loss.

As a side note: is nutrition for women worth the read? I've never sought it out since it has so much content Ray no longer supports, but since you speak highly of it, I may give it a chance.

Absolutely! I had the same impression at first, but it's honestly a marvellous book. He explains certain concepts in a very different way to what he does today, and I found it very enlightening, and easy to discard what was indeed outdated. (Most of it is still top notch)

 

[Broco6679]

Absolutely! I had the same impression at first, but it's honestly a marvellous book. He explains certain concepts in a very different way to what he does today, and I found it very enlightening, and easy to discard what was indeed outdated. (Most of it is still top notch)

Cheers, dude -- will pick it up soon :)

 

[mrchibbs]

Cheers, dude -- will pick it up soon :)

Do you want the PDF copy?

 

[wavelength123]

People love to reject Ray's ideas because he's not jacked with an NW1 hairline at 87. The ironic thing is they don't apply that same logic to the obese, bald, hypertensive and insulin resistant mid-forties physician who's prescribing them finasteride, metformin and prozac. Ray's work is often misinterpreted as a way to live forever, to prevent/reverse all forms of aging, as a fix all for every disease, etc, and whenever reality deviates from that, they use it as a way to reject him entirely. Acknowledging and addressing the underlying energetic deficiency of degenerative disease is not the same as promising the fountain of youth. Regardless, it's their loss.

couldn’t phrase it better! Oh well, people on the internet are massively self centered. Can’t think beyond what’s happening to their own precious snowflake life right here right now. Tons of OCD behavior.

what’s ironic is that this quest for absolute perfection is such a stress that I’ve come to think that the whole anti aging movement is in and of itself pro aging. Like I’ve said elsewhere, I know guys who are 150lbs soaking wet, with all of 200 hairs left on their skull, act knowledgeable because of hitting the gym 6 days a week and eating 7 times a day... yet we all know that’s being neurotic. It actually becomes amusing to me. If I share pictures of what I looked like on TRT and turinabol preworkout back in 2017 “you must’ve been on grams o’ gear and train and eat like it’s a full time job!!!” ... no. When friends ask me how hard it is to maintain during a pandemic with no gym accessible “you‘re good with pushups and bands only?? No way man”. Hair regrowth routine? 2 pills a week and some plant based shampoo. How many supplements? A b complex and vitamin D for winter months. No caffeine taurine coQ10 ashwagandha thyroid what have you.

I sincerely doubt Ray Peat is on an intricate elaborate plan with 15 alarms a day to remind him he has some magic pill he needs to take. His vibe is one that doesn’t give too many f**ks.

preserve your f**ks, keep it basic, no need to try so hard chasing results, and results shall come.

 

[b555]

couldn’t phrase it better! Oh well, people on the internet are massively self centered. Can’t think beyond what’s happening to their own precious snowflake life right here right now. Tons of OCD behavior.

what’s ironic is that this quest for absolute perfection is such a stress that I’ve come to think that the whole anti aging movement is in and of itself pro aging. Like I’ve said elsewhere, I know guys who are 150lbs soaking wet, with all of 200 hairs left on their skull, act knowledgeable because of hitting the gym 6 days a week and eating 7 times a day... yet we all know that’s being neurotic. It actually becomes amusing to me. If I share pictures of what I looked like on TRT and turinabol preworkout back in 2017 “you must’ve been on grams o’ gear and train and eat like it’s a full time job!!!” ... no. When friends ask me how hard it is to maintain during a pandemic with no gym accessible “you‘re good with pushups and bands only?? No way man”. Hair regrowth routine? 2 pills a week and some plant based shampoo. How many supplements? A b complex and vitamin D for winter months. No caffeine taurine coQ10 ashwagandha thyroid what have you.

I sincerely doubt Ray Peat is on an intricate elaborate plan with 15 alarms a day to remind him he has some magic pill he needs to take. His vibe is one that doesn’t give too many f**ks.

preserve your f**ks, keep it basic, no need to try so hard chasing results, and results shall come.

how long were you on TRT and how did you manage to get off?

 

[wavelength123]

Was on for over 2 years straight with oral anabolics on and off because it’s so tempting to cross that small yellow line. I hopped off using serms which was a big mistake. Then did an HCG restart for about a month, then did a couple shots of Triptorelin.

- April 2016 natural: total T 800 free T 8 LOW estradiol 10 (felt like absolute trash)
- this is on test 125 mg/wk + Tbol. Total T was mid range, albeit free T was close to 30 pg/mL... DA7-D4-E02-C7-F5-4-FD3-A47-D-1-EF1-FB324215
- late 2018 post SERM use: total T 400 free T 10 E2 20
- May 2019 on HCG: total T 630 free T 20 E2 35 (but cortisol was high, as expected since LH increases all enzymes across the board)
- July 2019 2 weeks post Triptorelin: total T 600 free T 12 E2 15. All in all very similar to 2016 bloodworks. I wish I had tracked shbg when off drugs. It was low while on. Physique as of last summer 0098-C5-D6-2507-4303-9-E30-35-F111-C54055

My most recent testing is one of those saliva tests from amazon (tyvm NYC laws), Dhea and progesterone are mid range, T and E2 are borderline low just like in serum, cortisol still over range. I know it’s all been a cortisol issue even back in 2016, and T doesn’t address the root cause. That’s why I hopped off...

 

[Broco6679]

Do you want the PDF copy?

I'd really appreciate that, my dude.

 

[Inaut]

I'd really appreciate that, my dude.

Me too please

 

[mrchibbs]

Here you go. I'm sure Ray doesn't mind. I'm only spreading the gospel so to speak.

 

[Broco6679]

Here you go. I'm sure Ray doesn't mind. I'm only spreading the gospel so to speak.

Much appreciated! Based upon the context page, the book is vastly different than I anticipated.

 

[mrchibbs]

Much appreciated! Based upon the context page, the book is vastly different than I anticipated.

Generative Energy is his masterpiece. But PMS to Menopause and Nutrition for Women are also amazing. Mind and Tissue is a bit different, and was written earlier (more technical).

 

[johnwester130]

I appreciate the clarification and additional information -- especially the safety concerns about spironolactone.

Of the items on your cocktail list, I must confess, I'm apprehensive to use synthetics, and would prefer a natural alternative, if available. I realize natural is not always safer, and that nature can produce some pretty damaging substances, but for starters I'd like to use this approach. I may venture into synthetics as I gain confidence through my understanding of them.

So, from this perspective, my thought is to use licorice root extract (glychyrrizic acid) as an alternative to enoxolone. I am using this simply because I already have it, and it's a natural substance I feel pretty safe with. Beyond this, I don't have any reason to know that it's a viable alternative to enoxolone -- you're welcome to set me straight on this. I'll use coconut oil as well, which is of no safety concern. Instead of olive oil, I'll use emu oil to promote absorption of all the substances -- at least it's my understanding that it will. For Cholecalciferol, I'll use liquid Thorne D/K2. This covers all on this list but the remaining two synthetics (at least I think they are). Once again, if you, or anyone else, sees an issue with any of this, I welcome any input.

Thanks again for sharing your findings.

did you ever try topical licorice

it's a shame travis doesn't post anymore and i ignored his posts when did

 

[johnwester130]

Enoxolone is the aglycone of glycyrrhizic acid.
The only study on hair growth with this was actually done with ethanolic licorice extract, but you would expect enoxolone to be slightly more effective. Enoxolone is also more oil-soluble.

It wouldn't be unreasonable to assume that the glycosidic bond gets cleaved by an enzyme in the skin; both compounds should work to inhibit 11βHSD₁.

is this the study?

https://www.researchgate.net/public...l_extract_of_licorice_Glycyrrhiza_glabra_Linn

 

[Mossy]

did you ever try topical licorice

it's a shame travis doesn't post anymore and i ignored his posts when did

Funny you ask. I had responded to your mention of this on the other thread yesterday, but forgot to hit “post reply”.

I had an adverse reaction, but I was in quite poor health then. I’m doing better now. I may try again. I’m a little concerned about getting too much glycyrrhizic acid, though.

 

[Mossy]

it's a shame travis doesn't post anymore and i ignored his posts when did

It seems Travis has passed on.

 

[Inaut]

Isn’t licorice root extract also used for hair removal???

 

[johnwester130]

Isn’t licorice root extract also used for hair removal???

there is a study showing that

I am not sure what to make of it.

Funny you ask. I had responded to your mention of this on the other thread yesterday, but forgot to hit “post reply”.

I had an adverse reaction, but I was in quite poor health then. I’m doing better now. I may try again. I’m a little concerned about getting too much glycyrrhizic acid, though.

shame he passed on

the glycyrrhizic acid won't go systematic from my understanding of his posts

would spironoalctone powder in alcohol be a bad idea?