The Most OVERLOOKED Peat Quote

[opson123]

My bad, I somehow thought this was about protein. No wonder I thought 250g protein would be way too much. I also can't remember ever reading Ray recommending that much.

 

[yashi]

@Maljam So what's your diet like? Are you shredded? Clear mind and focus? Any health issues? Things you want to improve or experiment with?

 

[Maljam]

@Maljam So what's your diet like? Are you shredded? Clear mind and focus? Any health issues? Things you want to improve or experiment with?

Moderate carb, moderate fat, moderate protein. (People gravitate towards extreme diets, either thinking you need 0 carbs or 1000 carbs, a balance is the key IMO as "boring" as it sounds) Potatoes makes up the bulk of my day to day carb source when I'm at home, but if I am out and need to eat something else my digestion is absolutely fine. Fatty meat, steaks, lamb chops, egg yolks, whole goat milk, goat cheese make up the vast majority of my protein. Beef dripping chips are a favourite but time consuming to make. I rotate with fish, chicken, pork to cover all bases but they arent staples. Rotating through as many vegetables and fruits as I enjoy alongside meals. Everything cooked in butter, beef dripping.

I was probably around 30% body fat at the start of the year, sitting somewhere around 15 now (with many months of largely sedentary with covid lockdown)

Mind is fine, I've picked up hobbies again I used to neglect (writing, reading) and enjoying them.

I think it would be fun to get lower body fat and have a beach bod but for all the health benefits I've had, I'm happy if I dont.

Issues I have completely resolved are insomnia, anxiety, gut issues (proven with inflammation stool samples, inflammation was above reference range, it is now within range), weight gain, fatty liver (diagnosed by ultrasound) I will probably do a big post about it all.

 

[yashi]

So did you restrict calories to achieve the fat loss and do you do so with discipline to overcome more hunger? Or do your meals satisfy you in a way that no will power is needed? Did you come from a lot of junk food or some fad diet that got you to 30% bodyfat ?

 

[Underlyingbody]

"I think a person of average size should have at least 180 grams per day, maybe an average of about 250 grams."

In my opinion this is the most overlooked and important of Peat quotes for people on this forum to read. Many people here experiencing health problems, or even creating new health problems for themselves are eating many hundreds of grams from carbs, I have seen members attempting to reach 1000g of carbs. This ISN'T in line with what Peat thinks.

On a typical 2500 calorie diet, 180g of carbs is around 30%. This is very reasonable and a moderate amount of carbs. I truly believe many of the health problems on here are created or are fuelled by an excessive amount of carbs.

With protein at 150g of the diet and 24% calories, this leaves 127g of fat and at 46% of the diet, all within fairly moderate and sensible amounts.

People get sucked into the trap of going to extreme lengths with things Peat praises, he says around 2000IU vitamin D is good, people take 50,000 for example. If people actually read Peats guidelines and stuck to closer than 180 than 250 I bet many people would feel better.

I am pretty sure if people are getting 300 g / 400g of carbs they’re eating in a decent ratio to protein / fat and in a caloric surplus...

 

[Maljam]

So did you restrict calories to achieve the fat loss and do you do so with discipline to overcome more hunger? Or do your meals satisfy you in a way that no will power is needed? Did you come from a lot of junk food or some fad diet that got you to 30% bodyfat ?

I came from a high sugar Peat diet where I was feeling like I was going to pass out if didn't eat every 2 hours and my weight was ballooning.

I don't know the exact answers to your questions, but I eat when I'm hungry, if I'm not hungry, I don't eat. I follow cravings, if my body fancies bacon, I eat bacon.

When I was eating very high carb, high sugar, I wouldnt be satiated for very long, and need to eat soon or I'd be very uncomfortable. Raising fat and lowering carbs prevent these wild blood sugar fluctuations and I am able to go about my day without constantly thinking about food and taking juice with me too sip on etc. I eat quite large meals and they are generous with fat, so I would imagine I am similar calories wise.

I can assure you there is no discipline involved. When I was younger and relied on "discipline" to lose weight, I would have mad cravings, big cheat days etc

I dont particularly restrict anything, so there is nothing to really crave that is "bad". Restriction and avoidance breeds orthorexia and eating disorders.

Perhaps I am lower in calories through delaying meals through lack of hunger? If that's true I've not noticed any negatives and only improvements (bowel inflammation, fatty liver both resolved)

 

[Maljam]

I am pretty sure if people are getting 300 g / 400g of carbs they’re eating in a decent ratio to protein / fat and in a caloric surplus...

Of course and they should lower the carbs to drop the calories.

 

[damngoodcoffee]

Talking about getting too much of something...150g of protein is insane for an average person. The average person's protein intake is around 50-70g (a little more for men), or 12-14%. Getting 25% protein is certainly not beneficial unless your are a true metabolic beast.

Also, I wouldn't enjoy 127g of fat a day. Yuck. Been there done that and a lot higher too. I like low-fat way better.

(People gravitate towards extreme diets, either thinking you need 0 carbs or 1000 carbs, a balance is the key IMO as "boring" as it sounds)

Restriction and avoidance breeds orthorexia and eating disorders.

I love the freedom of trying out all sorts of different "crazy" and "restrictive" dietary things. Lets not judge experimentation and the making of mistakes. This is the RPF. You live, you learn. I wanna live my life, not a life someone (other then the Most High) planned for me. You'll never get people to agree with you with "THIS IS THE TRUTH IDIOTS, STOP YOUR MISTAKES". The balance will come eventually. And what's balance for you now, may not be balance for you tomorrow. I'm glad you're enjoying what you're doing.

 

[Underlyingbody]

Of course and they should lower the carbs to drop the calories.

Um... it’s a personal thing? The post is pointless

 

[B___Danny]

I’m guessing you didn’t read what I sent. There is no need to be emotional about this topic. They state in the article how rations were commonly looked at as times of starvation. Meanwhile, sedentary people were given 3000 calories to eat. This was during a time where food wasn’t abundant. You mentioned how a 2500 calorie diet is normal, and I gave proof to debunk you. Anyone who promotes a 2500 calorie diet, especially for a man, is giving deadly advice.
Obviously on a high carb diet you will need to eat more often/eat more fat/eat a lot more calories. Carbs stimulate the metabolism. 5 meals a day is normal. Even on a high fat (85%) diet, Aajonus Vonderplanitz recommended eating at least every 5 hours (He ate 6000+ calories per day and is one of the healthiest humans I’ve seen).
Also, do you feel high/perpetual euphoria everyday? If not then you should not be giving health advice, because you would clearly not be healthy. There is no way you can be high on a 2500 calorie diet.

 

[Jessie]

It's more like 2 grams.

This suggests otherwise, 13.8 grams of fiber per 100 gram serving: Insoluble Fiber: Foods High in Insoluble Fiber Content

 

[Jessie]

I feel like you are agreeing with me but trying to wrap it up in a way so it looks like you've come up with it. Of course if someone is eating an excessive amount of carbs they will be getting more calories than they need.

People eating maintenance calories won't gain weight, the clue is the word before the word calories.

I mean, not really. I can't very well agree with someone who puts greater emphasis on carbohydrate consumption then calories. That's just the standard low-carb dogma talking points. And it's not my idea either. Ray Peat specifically says people shouldn't eat hypercaloric diets if they want to lose weight.

But he does favor making dietary fat the most expendable macro, probably for several reasons. For one, it just has more calories per gram then protein or carbohydrate. And two, carbohydrate restriction will reduce the amount of active thyroid hormone (T3) by inhibiting the liver to convert T4. Additionally, restricting protein also leads to a decrease in the metabolic rate.

This leaves only dietary fat, which seems to play the smallest and least important role and thus is the most expendable. High-fat diets also increase the amount of serotonin synthesized. So there's little upside to jacking up fat consumption. 100+ grams of fat daily seems very high if the subject is trying to burn glucose for energy. Realistically most people's upper limit will be around 50-60 grams. But for many people even less would be ideal.

I keep mine around 25 grams daily. If I go too much higher then this I get leptin problems, food doesn't fill me up and I tend to overeat.

 

[B___Danny]

I mean, not really. I can't very well agree with someone who puts greater emphasis on carbohydrate consumption then calories. That's just the standard low-carb dogma talking points. And it's not my idea either. Ray Peat specifically says people shouldn't eat hypercaloric diets if they want to lose weight.

But he does favor making dietary fat the most expendable macro, probably for several reasons. For one, it just has more calories per gram then protein or carbohydrate. And two, carbohydrate restriction will reduce the amount of active thyroid hormone (T3) by inhibiting the liver to convert T4. Additionally, restricting protein also leads to a decrease in the metabolic rate.

This leaves only dietary fat, which seems to play the smallest and least important role and thus is the most expendable. High-fat diets also increase the amount of serotonin synthesized. So there's little upside to jacking up fat consumption. 100+ grams of fat daily seems very high if the subject is trying to burn glucose for energy. Realistically most people's upper limit will be around 50-60 grams. But for many people even less would be ideal.

I keep mine around 25 grams daily. If I go too much higher then this I get leptin problems, food doesn't fill me up and I tend to overeat.

True overeating is painful and difficult. I doubt you are overeating.

 

[lampofred]

I’m guessing you didn’t read what I sent. There is no need to be emotional about this topic. They state in the article how rations were commonly looked at as times of starvation. Meanwhile, sedentary people were given 3000 calories to eat. This was during a time where food wasn’t abundant. You mentioned how a 2500 calorie diet is normal, and I gave proof to debunk you. Anyone who promotes a 2500 calorie diet, especially for a man, is giving deadly advice.
Obviously on a high carb diet you will need to eat more often/eat more fat/eat a lot more calories. Carbs stimulate the metabolism. 5 meals a day is normal. Even on a high fat (85%) diet, Aajonus Vonderplanitz recommended eating at least every 5 hours (He ate 6000+ calories per day and is one of the healthiest humans I’ve seen).
Also, do you feel high/perpetual euphoria everyday? If not then you should not be giving health advice, because you would clearly not be healthy. There is no way you can be high on a 2500 calorie diet.

I made a post several months ago saying the same but turns out those 3000 calorie rations were for soldiers, not normal citizens

 

[B___Danny]

I made a post several months ago saying the same but turns out those 3000 calorie rations were for soldiers, not normal citizens

Don’t dismiss the data: a fatter Britain really is consuming fewer calories | Spectator Life

 

[Jessie]

True overeating is painful and difficult. I doubt you are overeating.

Yeah I'm not overeating. I clock in somewhere around 2,500-2,700 calories daily and I'm fairly active. I do a 1 mile slow walk everyday (mainly for increased gut motility then exercise) and 100 pushups 3 times weekly. Pushups are really the perfect exercise imo. They work the chest, back, shoulders, and even the legs to a lesser extent. Squats are the only other compound movement that can even begin to compare. Deadlifts and benchpress is overrated.

I digress, but anyways I can certainly see how it's possible to overeat. If someone is drinking a liter of whole milk and a liter of OJ daily, you're already over 1000 calories. This is why Peat recommended 1% milk and low-fat cheeses to people wanting to lose weight. It's easy to overdo the calories when you're sedentary and eating full-fat foods.

 

[Tristan Loscha]

Sensible approach. On the subject of vitamin D, hes more commonly prescribing a blood level of 40 ng/mL which can take any dose necessary to reach (and lower doses to maintain)

Wasnt it 60ng/ml?

 

[yashi]

High-fat diets also increase the amount of serotonin synthesized.

What's the mechanism for this? I heard about tryptophane turning into serotonin, but how do fats play a role in serotonin synthesis ?

 

[yashi]

This suggests otherwise, 13.8 grams of fiber per 100 gram serving: Insoluble Fiber: Foods High in Insoluble Fiber Content

This states dried carrot. Cronometer has 2.8g of fiber for 100g of fresh, raw carrot.

 

[gaze]

Wasnt it 60ng/ml?

he recommends 50 ng/ml