SolBan - Liquid Aspirin/Caffeine/Niacinamide Mix

[haidut]

Haidut, not sure how transparent you want to be but can you discuss the pricing of your supplements, namely the mark up? I'm just curious because I notice a trend of $20 for 2oz (30 day supply or less for most?) Instead of a price based on ingredients.

Thanks!

The facility we use to bottle the supplements, the labor cost, the prices of bottles, and the organic fillers (olive oil, coconut oil, vitamin E, ethanol) make the bulk of the cost. Since these are largely the same across the various supplements I decided to keep the cost flat for simplicity. StressNon is the only supplement where the actual raw material (pregnenolone) is significantly more expensive as a ratio of the total cost, so the supplement is also more expensive. Also, I did a survey almost a year ago and most people stated that the price of $20 a month is the sweet spot for them.

 

[Zachs]

Thanks for the quick response. $20 a month is not bad but most of the people who order your products are probably interested in using a few if not all of them. That adds up quick.

In the future maybe think about bigger bottles at a reduced price point!

 

[haidut]

Thanks for the quick response. $20 a month is not bad but most of the people who order your products are probably interested in using a few if not all of them. That adds up quick.

In the future maybe think about bigger bottles at a reduced price point!

Yep, definitely keeping that in mind. Eventually, if this scales it can be produced more cheaply. Right now, being a small family venture, you have two biochemistry Ph.D. scientists doing most of the actual supplement production, so the cost adds up
On the other hand, I think there is an inherent benefit of having a person knowledgeable in the matters of the supplements doing the mixing, bottling and purity testing. And the people working on those supplements kind of "care" about this since it's close to their hearts and what they did in school. Outsourcing it eventually will kill all of that, but maybe the lower price would be a good enough justification for most people. I may do another survey if we get to that point and ask directly.
Thanks for asking though!

 

[Zachs]

Oh I agree, the fact that knowledgeable people are making it and actually posting and responding to questions and comments make a huge difference when it comes to price point. Plus the purity is a huge issue for me When it comes to supplements so that's another plus.

another question. With your estroban, do you have any idea the % of vitamins that get absorbed through the skin? I see that you post the amount per dose in the bottle but I'm guessing it's not a 100% efficiency rate when applied topically. So trying to figure out a certain dose, any thoughts on how to factor that in?

 

[gummybear]

I have a new supplement (SolBan) for people interested in improving skin health or management of issues like hair loss, wrinkles, aging spots, cellulite, or simply protection from the sun.
It can be ordered from the links below:
http://mkt.com/idealabs-llc/solban-liquid (US orders)
http://haidut.dyndns.org/idealabs_international.html (International orders)

Another great product from haidut

Haidut is love
haidut is life

 

[haidut]

Oh I agree, the fact that knowledgeable people are making it and actually posting and responding to questions and comments make a huge difference when it comes to price point. Plus the purity is a huge issue for me When it comes to supplements so that's another plus.

another question. With your estroban, do you have any idea the % of vitamins that get absorbed through the skin? I see that you post the amount per dose in the bottle but I'm guessing it's not a 100% efficiency rate when applied topically. So trying to figure out a certain dose, any thoughts on how to factor that in?

Ray has apparently said that topical absorption is 1/4 of oral. However, I have not seen this in writing and there are other factors to consider. With topical absorption, even if the plasma concentration is lower, half-life is much much longer. This is shown for caffeine and aspirin and is even more true for fat-soluble vitamins. So, for things like vitamin K2 (MK-4), which have a half-life of 3-4 hours you want to prolong the half-life as much as possible. With topical absorption, vitamin K2 (MK-4) probably stays in your blood for several days. Given that the major selling point for other vitamin K analogs like MK-7 is their long half-life (but largely unproven efficacy), having a long half-life of vitamin K2 (MK-4) at least removes the advertised advantage of other K analogs. Most studies with MK-4 had people take the vitamin 3-4 times daily due to its short half-life. With topical absorption, you probably get the same AVERAGE plasma concentrations by using less than 10% of the oral daily dose, and by using it only once daily.

 

[haidut]

I have a new supplement (SolBan) for people interested in improving skin health or management of issues like hair loss, wrinkles, aging spots, cellulite, or simply protection from the sun.
It can be ordered from the links below:
http://mkt.com/idealabs-llc/solban-liquid (US orders)
http://haidut.dyndns.org/idealabs_international.html (International orders)

Another great product from haidut

Haidut is love
haidut is life

Thanks! I love Denzel btw, he is a smooth playa.

 

[Zachs]

Thanks for the reply, that's some good news!

Also Denzel is still a badass, the Equilizer was great!

 

[oxidation_is_normal]

It is not correct to call this "sunscreen" - it does not block UV like sunscreen. It blocks the effects of UV. This is good because we want the UV-cholestrol reaction from the sun to produce vitamin D (which traditional sunscreen blocks). Simultaneously, we want to decrease the damage that UV radiation has on the skin (which is why most people use traditional sunscreen). These substances are not "screens" as the substances in traditional sunscreen are, though. Correct labeling will increase understanding.

 

[haidut]

It is not correct to call this "sunscreen" - it does not block UV like sunscreen. It blocks the effects of UV. This is good because we want the UV-cholestrol reaction from the sun to produce vitamin D (which traditional sunscreen blocks). Simultaneously, we want to decrease the damage that UV radiation has on the skin (which is why most people use traditional sunscreen). These substances are not "screens" as the substances in traditional sunscreen are, though. Correct labeling will increase understanding.

I am sorry but I believe you are incorrect - SolBan is in fact a sunscreen. There are two types of "sunscreens", and I explained this in some of my other posts - a physical sunscreen and chemical sunscreen.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/chemical-vs ... 1402354797

Maybe this is a misnomer and only physical sunscreens should be called sunscreens, but for better or worse the convention is to call both types sunscreens. Physical sunscreen like zinc oxide will prevent the actual UV light from reaching the skin by reflecting it away. Chemical sunscreens prevent the damage caused by sunlight by absorbing the light or redirecting its energy in a way that prevents an increase in local inflammation and immunosuppression. SolBan does the second one, and one of the studies I posted at the beginning of this thread itself calls caffeine a sunscreen precisely b/c it absorbed the light like chemical sunscreen and also prevented most of the skin damage.
Thoughts?

 

[Philomath]

Ray Peat on lipofuscin (email):

Yes, the body can clear lipofuscin gradually when it stops reforming, and vitamin E helps.
Some skin pigmentation is neither melanin nor lipofuscin. Ordinary alcohol, such as vodka, can have an effect similar to vitamin E, if it's lipofuscin. Niacinamide is effective if it's melanin. Caffeine and aspirin help with other types of skin discoloration.

 

[Such_Saturation]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/8765578/

 

[Adnada]

Haidut, why do you recommend spraying Solban on the skin without rubbing it in? Is it ok to spread it around with your hands just enough to get an even distribution? Thanks!

 

[haidut]

Haidut, why do you recommend spraying Solban on the skin without rubbing it in? Is it ok to spread it around with your hands just enough to get an even distribution? Thanks!

Well, some people are probably going to use it on a mole and I would not recommend rubbing the mole since it may irritate it and even break the skin. But if the skin is clear then you can rub it if you want. Not sure if this will improve absorption in any way though...

 

[oxidation_is_normal]

It is not correct to call this "sunscreen" - it does not block UV like sunscreen. It blocks the effects of UV. This is good because we want the UV-cholestrol reaction from the sun to produce vitamin D (which traditional sunscreen blocks). Simultaneously, we want to decrease the damage that UV radiation has on the skin (which is why most people use traditional sunscreen). These substances are not "screens" as the substances in traditional sunscreen are, though. Correct labeling will increase understanding.

I am sorry but I believe you are incorrect - SolBan is in fact a sunscreen. There are two types of "sunscreens", and I explained this in some of my other posts - a physical sunscreen and chemical sunscreen.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/chemical-vs ... 1402354797

Maybe this is a misnomer and only physical sunscreens should be called sunscreens, but for better or worse the convention is to call both types sunscreens. Physical sunscreen like zinc oxide will prevent the actual UV light from reaching the skin by reflecting it away. Chemical sunscreens prevent the damage caused by sunlight by absorbing the light or redirecting its energy in a way that prevents an increase in local inflammation and immunosuppression. SolBan does the second one, and one of the studies I posted at the beginning of this thread itself calls caffeine a sunscreen precisely b/c it absorbed the light like chemical sunscreen and also prevented most of the skin damage.
Thoughts?

So you're saying caffeine is the UV filter in SolBan? How is it blocking the UV? Especially @ 4% of the substance?

 

[Philomath]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/8765578/

Thanks Such, this study is very interesting. It certainly begs a few questions:

1. Is the "Vitamin E deficiency" really estrogen excess?
2. Are they implying a "cure" for celieacs disease?
3. Is supplementation through oral or rectal means nearly useless?
"Bolus supplementiation of 2g vit e (per day) were ineffective at raising serum levels. Parenteral vitamin E administration (900 mg/day) was able to normalize the plasma values only after 6 months of chronic administration"

 

[haidut]

It is not correct to call this "sunscreen" - it does not block UV like sunscreen. It blocks the effects of UV. This is good because we want the UV-cholestrol reaction from the sun to produce vitamin D (which traditional sunscreen blocks). Simultaneously, we want to decrease the damage that UV radiation has on the skin (which is why most people use traditional sunscreen). These substances are not "screens" as the substances in traditional sunscreen are, though. Correct labeling will increase understanding.

I am sorry but I believe you are incorrect - SolBan is in fact a sunscreen. There are two types of "sunscreens", and I explained this in some of my other posts - a physical sunscreen and chemical sunscreen.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/chemical-vs ... 1402354797

Maybe this is a misnomer and only physical sunscreens should be called sunscreens, but for better or worse the convention is to call both types sunscreens. Physical sunscreen like zinc oxide will prevent the actual UV light from reaching the skin by reflecting it away. Chemical sunscreens prevent the damage caused by sunlight by absorbing the light or redirecting its energy in a way that prevents an increase in local inflammation and immunosuppression. SolBan does the second one, and one of the studies I posted at the beginning of this thread itself calls caffeine a sunscreen precisely b/c it absorbed the light like chemical sunscreen and also prevented most of the skin damage.
Thoughts?

So you're saying caffeine is the UV filter in SolBan? How is it blocking the UV? Especially @ 4% of the substance?

Some more info:
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2011 ... kin-cancer
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=3692

 

[Such_Saturation]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/8765578/

Thanks Such, this study is very interesting. It certainly begs a few questions:

1. Is the "Vitamin E deficiency" really estrogen excess?
2. Are they implying a "cure" for celieacs disease?
3. Is supplementation through oral or rectal means nearly useless?
"Bolus supplementiation of 2g vit e (per day) were ineffective at raising serum levels. Parenteral vitamin E administration (900 mg/day) was able to normalize the plasma values only after 6 months of chronic administration"

I think that guy had a hard time digesting anything at all!

 

[oxidation_is_normal]

It is not correct to call this "sunscreen" - it does not block UV like sunscreen. It blocks the effects of UV. This is good because we want the UV-cholestrol reaction from the sun to produce vitamin D (which traditional sunscreen blocks). Simultaneously, we want to decrease the damage that UV radiation has on the skin (which is why most people use traditional sunscreen). These substances are not "screens" as the substances in traditional sunscreen are, though. Correct labeling will increase understanding.

I am sorry but I believe you are incorrect - SolBan is in fact a sunscreen. There are two types of "sunscreens", and I explained this in some of my other posts - a physical sunscreen and chemical sunscreen.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/chemical-vs ... 1402354797

Maybe this is a misnomer and only physical sunscreens should be called sunscreens, but for better or worse the convention is to call both types sunscreens. Physical sunscreen like zinc oxide will prevent the actual UV light from reaching the skin by reflecting it away. Chemical sunscreens prevent the damage caused by sunlight by absorbing the light or redirecting its energy in a way that prevents an increase in local inflammation and immunosuppression. SolBan does the second one, and one of the studies I posted at the beginning of this thread itself calls caffeine a sunscreen precisely b/c it absorbed the light like chemical sunscreen and also prevented most of the skin damage.
Thoughts?

So you're saying caffeine is the UV filter in SolBan? How is it blocking the UV? Especially @ 4% of the substance?

Some more info:
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2011 ... kin-cancer
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=3692

Again, I realize that, but it isn't via the mechanism of "blocking" the UV. Any evidence that it blocks or absorbs UV? Then it isn't a screen - it is a "tanning oil" or something. Again, I'm not saying it isn't better than sunscreen - just that it shouldn't be called sunscreen.

 

[Such_Saturation]

But what if it produces carbon dioxide which is protecting the protein, I mean where do we draw the line?