1. Cocoa Butter - Organic & Fair Trade Certified
    CLICK HERE!
    Dismiss Notice
  2. **NEW** BL11 - Orange, Red & Infrared Therapy Body Light
    CLICK HERE!
    Dismiss Notice
  3. Orange & Red Light Therapy Device - LGS1
    CLICK HERE!
    Dismiss Notice

Magnoil - Liquid Magnesium

Discussion in 'IdeaLabs' started by haidut, Apr 13, 2018.

  1. haidut

    haidut Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2013
    Messages:
    12,734
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA / Europe
    As many forum users know, magnesium (Mg) is one of the most important minerals for proper metabolic function. It is a required cofactor for hundreds of metabolic enzymes, including the crucial mitochondrial enzyme pyruvate dehydrogenase (PDH), ATP synthesis, and ATP transport in the bloodstream (as a Mg-ATP complex). In addition, Mg plays an important role in various signalling mechanisms within the nervous system including GABA, NMDA, HPA, calcium channels, and so on. Peat has written a lot on the topic of Mg and sodium and their deficiencies in hypothyroidism. One recent metareview study concluded that 80%+ of people in the Western world suffer from some level of Mg deficiency. With that in mind, a lot of people are supplementing with oral Mg in an effort to raise both serum and tissue levels. However, there are a number of problems with that approach. The first one is that almost all of the Mg salts commonly sold as supplements have poor absorption from the GI tract. For most salts, the reported absorption is usually less than 40%. Out of that absorbed portion, an even smaller proportion is retained since Mg retention depends on thyroid and ATP (as mentioned above). According to several studies, only about 10%-15% of the absorbed Mg is retained within tissues. Finally, virtually all of the Mg salts sold as supplements tend to irritate the GI tract and/or easily cause diarrhea, and this is something Peat has reported first-hand. The combination of all of these factors makes Mg replenishment a VERY challenging tasks unless somebody is admitted to the ER/hospital and receives an IV drip of Mg. Clearly the latter is not a practical or desirable option for most people.

    Some vendors have realized the issue with oral Mg supplementation and have tried to come up with transdermal products, which in principle should avoid the issues of GI irritation and poor absorption/retention. In addition, raising magnesium levels has been shown to reverse the age-associated decline in DHEA levels, and likely has similar beneficial effects on pregnenolone levels as well. However, the only commercially viable product that I have seen so far uses a concentrated magnesium chloride (Mg-Cl) solution (in water). Not only is that solution irritating to the skin but several studies that looked at blood and tissue biomarkers of Mg stores claimed that very little (if anything) gets absorbed from that product. This is not surprising, considering that water is a very poor carrier of chemicals through the skin (which has been confirmed in countless human trials) unless it is combined with a penetration enhancer of some sort. Some other vendors have tried to improve the transdermal effectiveness of Mg-Cl by adding ethanol, polyethylene glycol, propylene glycol, etc. The issue with that approach is that most magnesium salts are very poorly soluble in alcohols/glycols, which results in very little Mg being present in the product and thus the overall Mg delivery into the system is possibly even lower than the plain Mg-Cl + water combination.

    If somebody could resolve the issue of getting Mg through the skin it could provide a very desirable method for Mg supplementation that avoids most of the issues mentioned previously. We believe that our product described in this thread resolves many of these issues. After more than 10 months of testing with more than 30 different magnesium salts and pretty much every commercially available solvent, we finally found a combination that appears to work well. As a result, we are pleased to present our product Magnoil. It uses Magnesium L-pidolate as the Mg source and DMSO as a solvent. Magnesium L-pidolate is simply the salt of magnesium with L-pyroglutamic acid (L-PGA). I have posted about L-PGA before and it is one of the ingredients in our product Cardenosine. It just so happens that Magnesium L-pidolate is perhaps the only Mg salt that is soluble in good transdermal carriers like DMSO in amounts that makes transdermal supplementation practical. It has been used clinically for years and is available as an OTC magnesium supplement. The combination of Mg and L-PGA seems to have some unique neurotrophic effects, which are likely due to the effects of L-PGA on the brain. Some of those effects, including increasing dopamine synthesis and improving glucose metabolism, are discussed in studies posted in the Cardenosine thread.
    Now, this brings us to the choice of solvent - DMSO. I know DMSO has acquired a bit of bad rep here but after running tests on several of our human volunteers (including yours truly) I suspect a lot of that bad rep can be reversed. It appears that not only does DMSO allow for full absorption of the dissolved Mg L-pidolate through the skin, but the combination of the two has some unique effects not seen in other products using DMSO as a solvent. First of all, for some reason there is no visible skin irritation/redness/itching when using the solution on the skin. At least not in the 3 volunteers that tried Magnoil on their skin for several days in a row. This is a notable difference compared to other DMSO solutions such as the older version of our steroid products, which caused skin irritation in some people. Second, there seems to be no skin drying or peeling, which DMSO is also known to cause sometimes. Finally, after application of the solution and allowing for about 20min to achieve complete absorption, the skin is left very smooth and feels quite rejuvenated. The solution is viscous and feels very much like a gel. It is sticky after initial application, which is something people noticed with Cardenosine. This is likely due to the L-PGA component, as it is known to acquire a sticky texture when in solution. However, that mild stickiness and gel-like consistency makes the solution very suitable for skin application because stays on the skin almost like a cream, and it does not run down or drip on the ground as it often happens with more liquid solutions. In addition, another cool property of the product is that L-PGA is itself a transdermal penetration enhancer, as I also mentioned in the Cardenosine thread. As such, it likely synergizes with the transdermal effectiveness of DMSO to improve absorption even more.

    Our informal tests show that within a few minutes after application the typical effects of increased magnesium levels are observed - i.e. increased temps, pink color of previously pale/blue skin, calmness, anxiolytic effect, and even sedation when higher dose are used. One of the people who tried it has chronic constipation due to IBS-C and reported increased bowel movements - from 1 every 2 days to 2 per day. So, it does look like Magnoil is capable of delivering magnesium systemically and to tissues, but the ultimate test would be more people using it and reporting their results. We are really excited about it, because we don't know of any other product on the market (or in development) that has these features.

    The name Magnoil is an acronym composed of portion of the words magnesium and oil. Of course, it does not contain any oils but the name is a reference to the gel-like and oily consistence of the solution due to the high amount of magnesium dissolved in it. The product can be ordered from the page below.
    www.idealabsdc.com

    Note: This product contains raw material(s) meant for external use only, in cosmetic or other formulations designed for such external use.

    *******************************************************************************
    Magnoil is a liquid magnesium supplement suitable for skin application. Magnesium has a unique and highly important role in human health. The mineral is a required cofactor for over 300 enzymes in the organism, including the crucial enzyme PDH. In addition, it has a well-recognized role in the CNS and various other systems including GABA/glycine receptors, NMDA, calcium channels, inflammation (CRP, NF-kB, TNFa, etc).

    Serving size: 20 drops
    Servings per container: about 30
    Each serving contains the following ingredients:

    Magnesium L-pidolate: 333mg

    Other ingredients: DMSO
    *******************************************************************************

    References:

    CNS/mood/cognition
    [Molecular mechanisms of pidolate magnesium action and its neurotropic affects]. - PubMed - NCBI
    "...RESULTS: Neurotropic effects of magnesium pyroglutamate are due to an influence on the synthesis of neuropeptides containing pyroglutamate (orexin, thyroliberin, neurotensin etc) and due to the similarity between pyroglutamate-anion with some neuroactive components (L-theanine, 2-pirrolydinone, piracetam). CONCLUSION: The results of the study suggest neuroprotective, sedative and antidepressive properties of magnesium pyroglutamate which are realized by pyroglutamate-anion in the synergism with magnesium cation."

    Magnesium as a preventive treatment for paediatric episodic tension-type headache: results at 1-year follow-up. - PubMed - NCBI
    Magnesium as a treatment for paediatric tension-type headache: a clinical replication series. - PubMed - NCBI
    Visual evoked potentials and serum magnesium levels in juvenile migraine patients. - PubMed - NCBI
    Reversible model of magnesium depletion induced by systemic kainic acid injection in magnesium-deficient rats: I--Comparative study of various magn... - PubMed - NCBI
    Inhibition of mouse-killing behaviour in magnesium-deficient rats: effect of pharmacological doses of magnesium pidolate, magnesium aspartate, magn... - PubMed - NCBI
    [Psychopharmacological properties of three magnesium salts: pidolate, lactate and aspartate]. - PubMed - NCBI
    [Magnesium in the prophylaxis of primary headache and other periodic disorders in children]. - PubMed - NCBI


    CVD/circulation/blood pressure/anemia
    [Effects of magnesium pidolate on cardiovascular hemodynamics]. - PubMed - NCBI
    [Effects of magnesium pidolate on cardiovascular hemodynamics]. - PubMed - NCBI

    Magnesium for treating sickle cell disease. - PubMed - NCBI
    Late outcome of a randomized study on oral magnesium for premature complexes. - PubMed - NCBI
    Late Outcome of a Randomized Study on Oral Magnesium for Premature Complexes. - PubMed - NCBI
    Successful improvement of frequency and symptoms of premature complexes after oral magnesium administration. - PubMed - NCBI
    Oral magnesium supplementation reduces ambulatory blood pressure in patients with mild hypertension. - PubMed - NCBI
    Promising therapies in sickle cell disease. - PubMed - NCBI
    Phase I study of magnesium pidolate in combination with hydroxycarbamide for children with sickle cell anaemia. - PubMed - NCBI
    [Clinical trials of new therapeutic pharmacology for sickle cell disease]. - PubMed - NCBI
    Oral magnesium pidolate: effects of long-term administration in patients with sickle cell disease. - PubMed - NCBI
    The effect of dietary magnesium supplementation on the cellular abnormalities of erythrocytes in patients with beta thalassemia intermedia. - PubMed - NCBI
    Oral magnesium supplements reduce erythrocyte dehydration in patients with sickle cell disease. - PubMed - NCBI


    Metabolism/diabetes
    Effects of oral magnesium supplementation on plasma lipid concentrations in patients with non-insulin-dependent diabetes mellitus. - PubMed - NCBI
    Effects of magnesium supplements on blood pressure, endothelial function and metabolic parameters in healthy young men with a family history of met... - PubMed - NCBI
    Oral magnesium supplementation improves vascular function in elderly diabetic patients. - PubMed - NCBI
    Beneficial effects of oral magnesium supplementation on insulin sensitivity and serum lipid profile. - PubMed - NCBI
    [Comparative study of the short-term acceptability and tolerance of a new oral formulation of magnesium (TX 1341) and a reference magnesium]. - PubMed - NCBI
    Intravenous and oral magnesium supplementations in the prophylaxis of cisplatin-induced hypomagnesemia. Results of a controlled trial. - PubMed - NCBI


    Reproductive
    Effectiveness of magnesium pidolate in the prophylactic treatment of primary dysmenorrhea. - PubMed - NCBI


    Allergies
    Magnesium pidolate in the treatment of seasonal allergic rhinitis. Preliminary data. - PubMed - NCBI
     
  2. Lee Simeon

    Lee Simeon Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2017
    Messages:
    127
    Gender:
    Male
    Holy moly, and I thought christmas came once a year! As always asked on your threads, what experiences did you get from using this, as if I do recall correctly you said that you use it for 30 days when starting a new product?
     
  3. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2013
    Messages:
    12,734
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA / Europe
    I mentioned some of the effects in the threads, but they are the typical magnesium effects - increase frequency of bowel movement (but no diarrhea), calmness in lower doses (20 drops) and sedation in doses of 40 drops of higher, better muscle tone, intense body heat to the point of people sitting nearby commenting on me looking like a furnace, better digestion and no blood sugar swings from starchy meals, less urination, better look&feel of hair/nail/skin, disappearance of a few wrinkles, seemingly disappearing grey hair ( have only like 3-4 in my hair but still nice to see them gone), etc. The list can probably go on if I spend more time observing myself.
     
  4. Vinero

    Vinero Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2013
    Messages:
    623
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Do you plan to offer this product with SFA ester as solvent also? DMSO doesn't agree with me at all so I can't use this.
    I have tried many times to make DMSO-based supplements work but my body does not like it.
     
  5. raypeatclips

    raypeatclips Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2016
    Messages:
    2,103
    +1 request on a SFA ester magnesium please, DMSO doesn't work for me either.
     
  6. theLaw

    theLaw Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2017
    Messages:
    890
    Gender:
    Male
    Any change in the grey hairs in your beard?
     
  7. tastyfood

    tastyfood Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2016
    Messages:
    26
    Were Epsom salts one of the magnesium salts that you experienced with? Epsom salt baths are rrallr beneficial for me.
     
  8. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2013
    Messages:
    12,734
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA / Europe
    Unfortunately, no magnesium salt dissolves well in SFA esters of any kind, oils, or ethanol. I also had doubt about the DMSO but in this product it seems to have remarkably different effects - i.e. almost none of the common side effects attributed to DMSO.
     
  9. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2013
    Messages:
    12,734
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA / Europe
    Decrease in those, yes. It should be visible on the next Danny Roddy podcast.
     
  10. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2013
    Messages:
    12,734
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA / Europe
    See my response above. I hear you about the DMSO, but the L-PGA really seems to somehow neutralize the side effects of DMSO. I gave it to people who normally get nausea and joint pain from DMSO and none of these occurred with this product. I would have gladly used a different solvent but unfortunately, no magnesium salt dissolves well in anything that counts as good solvent for transdermal application. But the search continues, I just thought it would be good to start with something at least for the people who can tolerate DMSO.
     
  11. ubiety

    ubiety Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2017
    Messages:
    31
    Gender:
    Male
    A timely release. Been taking some Mag carbonate lately with noticeably better effects than other types of Mag I've tried, so looking forward to trying this now.
    Should anything else be taken with it to balance or improve the benefits?
     
  12. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2013
    Messages:
    12,734
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA / Europe
    I would try on its own first just to see how it affects you. If the suggested dose makes you too sleepy or causes too many bowel movements daily then adding some calcium may balance those effects. Other than that, magnesium is supposed to be just fine to take on its own.
     
  13. Oniyogini

    Oniyogini Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2015
    Messages:
    25
    Gender:
    Female
    Location:
    Australia
    This sounds wonderful.
    I have sprayed DMSO first then Mag oil when I had some acute muscle strain and cramps, and the relief- meaning pain disappears- occurs within the hour.
    Would this Magnoil be superior then?
     
  14. mirc12354

    mirc12354 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2016
    Messages:
    261
    what abut the magnesium salicylate topocal absorbtion?? as per in Solban???
     
  15. Amazoniac

    Amazoniac Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2014
    Messages:
    3,844
    Gender:
    Male
  16. Lee Simeon

    Lee Simeon Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2017
    Messages:
    127
    Gender:
    Male
    I see that this does not contain alcohol. Does that mean that we should wash the skin before using this?
     
  17. Dhair

    Dhair Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2015
    Messages:
    764
    Gender:
    Male
    Have you tried this with a thyroid supplement to see how they work together? Peat often talks about how they are synergistic.
     
  18. DaveFoster

    DaveFoster Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2015
    Messages:
    4,399
    Gender:
    Male
    @haidut
    Why the high dosage for Magnoil? Wouldn't one drop be sufficient for correcting a magnesium deficiency for most?
     
  19. Bobber Anderson

    Bobber Anderson Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2017
    Messages:
    168
    Gender:
    Male
    In his OP, it says one drop = 333mg. This is a typo I assume.

    If you go into the idea labs store and look at the bottle, it says one serving (20 drops) = 333mg.
     
  20. DaveFoster

    DaveFoster Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2015
    Messages:
    4,399
    Gender:
    Male
    It must be, as he wouldn't even break-even with ~200 grams per bottle (not to mention that's a ridiculous amount of solute.) It's around a 1400% mark-up including the cost of DMSO but not including the cost of labor, shipping and holding costs for the raw material, and lastly the time invested into R&D.

    Of course, haidut's always so helpful when it comes to advice maybe we should all be paying his salary as a doctor by now.
     
Loading...