The Cause Of Baldness

[REOSIRENS]

Because we know that DHT is the culprit in the AGA pathway and estrogen topically, or systemically reverses it.

And what lowers high blood levels of dht?
Answer: Progesterone Triiodothyronine Co2

Estrogen on short term lowers blood sugars and seems to help stop hair loss on very short term...but after that phase ask any one on high estrogenic drugs what happened to their hair after some time...

Drugs or nutrients that are estrogenic and help with hair most of them mimic some of Progesterone actions as well

 

[REOSIRENS]

Dht only rises high if body is lacking protective Triiodothyronine (thyroid)...thyroid is first defence against stress/estrogen after that comes other physiological mechanisms like cholesterol/dht but both without Triiodothyronine will cause hairloss

 

[Mossy]

@Mossy
Sounds uncomfortable, glad you're getting better. I've used minoxidil in the past, so been through the tachychardia and the stress related.
Ha I figured 1.5 weren't childsplay :p I can bleed from 0.5mm.. I might look into a stampler/dermapen too.
I use this one.
https://www.amazon.com/Mount-Plus-Shiatsu-Massager-Shoulder/dp/B015JJFFMY

As for your posture: Posterior pelvic tilt is related to flatback posture, so you might want to check if you have some of that going on. If the case, You have a "hidden" forward head posture and rounded shoulders. You can find lots of info online, a good starting place is fixtheneck.com, I can recommend more in pms.
Yeah, I try to "force" a good posture too, but at the end, stretching and strengthening is probably the way to go. "Athlean-x - Rounded shoulders" and other videos, he is very competent.

I hate that I might have a slight scoliosis too, but mainly I think twisting of the spine is an issue for me. If you're right leg is longer than left, it's a classical stance we assume, but in extreme cases it can create asymmetry in the face, shoulder, pelvis. I have some previous posts about it, but you can search for "postural restoration institute" "Zac Cupples" "Right Torsion" "Left Sidebend" "Right TMCC" and combinations of those, there are some very specific stretches to combat, if you can identify your misalignment.

That's a relatively cheap massager, I may purchase that.

Thanks for the fixtheneck.com address -- I'll look into that. If needed, I can PM you, but I'm doing so many things, I wouldn't have any time to add a single thing more.

Definitely, stretching and strengthening would be very beneficial. I do some yoga, and I hope to get back to doing Pilates, which are both beneficial. I also workout with weights and do some light HIT training. I do an exercise with a sports band, from Athlean-x, as a counter to the pelvic tilt -- it's pretty beneficial.

Haha, yeah, dermarolling is a little medieval. As a matter of fact, I'm procrastinating doing it today .

Thanks for all the input!

 

[ivy]

@Luckytype, thanks for having stated the obvious. Numerous people, myself included, start shedding before they've even fully matured! At 15, when my thinning became noticeable, two years had gone by after my first menses. I was hardly used to having breasts or hips! So if any of you wants to stick to a notion of "gradual decline" or "aging" or "deteriotation", than it'll have to include the expected - and very welcome by all biological accounts - puberty.

(The first dermatologist who saw me never fully explained what he thought the problem was. But he decided to address it by lowering androgens and ignoring the now seemingly obvious rise in estrogen that might have triggered it. I had to stop Spiro before I even saw any benefits, as I began to have my period every 15 days.)

It breaks my heart that a few desperate folks have to spend their lives coming up with a solid narrative and viable applications when the experts haven't nailed it, or won't disclose it. So thanks, @CLASH, for yet another effort.

 

[inmyhead]

Yes, with the onset of my hypothyroid state, my heart has become very sensitive and what I'd call weak -- occasional tachycardia and bradycardia, which can be frighting if they're strong. Thankfully, I haven't had an episode in a while. In addition, I'll get heart palpitations, and sometimes heart pain. All-in-all, I think I have to contribute most episodes to supplements interfering somehow, but I can't pinpoint the specific supplements. I do feel like I've become better as a whole, but definitely not healthy. Funny enough, I'm as strong as ever, but I avoid cardiovascular exercise, because of my heart. I do plan on slowly working it back in as my span of zero heart-episodes grows.

Funny you mention posture. I do have minor scoliosis, and as a result, I battle some posterior tilt with my pelvis, along with other imbalances; such as, an inclination to have my right shoulder roll forward and create a slight concave shape in my chest. It's not major, and during the day I'm normally pretty conscious about it and can counter it. It's normally an issue when I sleep, though; when I wake, I can pull my shoulders back and my sternum cracks. I've been looking into this the last 12 months or so. I'll have to do some more research. The obvious would be to go to chiropractor, but I know there are some self-treatments as well.

I've read conflicting thoughts on dermarolling immediately before topicals. I have done .25 right before, but now I only do it the day after doing 1.5. Maybe this is being too cautious. I can tell you this, 1.5 is murder! It used to not be an issue for me, but now I'm much more conscious of applying consistent pressure. Also, I'm using a Dermanator, which confirms that I'm actually puncturing the skin to the full 1.5 depth. Because of this, I don't do it consistently every week at 1.5. Sometimes I feel like I need more of a break. Oh, by the way, I do a large surface area -- pain.

Hhmm, I think I know the massager you're talking about. Do you have a reference link? Is it manual or electric?

Are you derminating whole scalp or just temples only? I'm diffuse thinner ( balding all over my head ) so I wonder if it would be possible to user derminator. So far i'm just using dermaroller as a stamp ( so i don't pull out hair )

 

[Mossy]

I have the typical recession, which causes the window's peak, as well as a small balding spot starting on the crown. And, in addition to that, I would say I am a diffused thinner on top and crown. So, I am dermanating a large surface area: the temples, all the top, and the crown. Lot's of fun!

I would highly reccomend the Dermanator over a dermaroller or stamp. It makes it much easier, and much less hair-pulling. Normally, I don't get any hair pulling.

Hope that helps.

 

[Mossy]

stemoxydine inhibits P4H an enzyme that controls collagen synthesis. It also induces Hypoxia inducible factor 1. Both of these support my hypothesis very nicely. Inhibiting P4H should inhibit fibrosis by inhibiting collagen formation. Hypoxia inducible factor 1 is beneficial because it up regulates processes such as angiogenesis and erythropoiesis to increase blood flow and oxygenation to hypoxic tissues. I don't see how baldness can't be a hypoxic issue. Also, Stemoxydine doesn't create hypoxia, it signals hypoxia, very different concepts. It is essentially signaling hypoxia thus increasing oxygenation.

"A potent P4H competitive inhibitor, Stemoxydine, was tested for its ability to induce hypoxia-like signaling. Transcriptomic studies show that treatment of hair follicles with Stemoxydine in normoxic conditions modifies the expression of a panel of genes in the same manner as culturing under hypoxic conditions."
Poster Presentations

I've been using Stemoxydine shampoo for almost 2 years now. I used the straight solution for about 3 months. I didn't see any growth, but your conviction in it may have me add it back to my large anti-hair-loss arsenal.

 

[CLASH]

@Mossy
Doing too much may be counterproductive IMO.
I would personally stick with and have been sticking with solban topically 2x per day, red light therapy a few minutes a day in the morning (i use halogens so theyre bright and stimulate circadian rhythm), and dietary manipulation (milk, kefir, honey, specific animal products already mentioned) with some basic nutrient support (fat solubles, b vitamins, vit c). Its about the long term, fibrosis takes time to reverse in the scalp and so does reversing the inflammation and gut situation. I would say with red light therapy, massage and diet, it will take 6 months or more to see lasting improvement. The solban is to just protect the hair for now, eventually it may not be needed. Doing too much may burn you out from being consistent with your approach. (I have learned the hard way many times with this in other areas of life. My dad always tells me: evolution not revolution. He also tells me "p***y is the cure to everything" so take it for what its worth).

 

[CLASH]

@ivy
Do you have PCOS or fibroids by any chance, if thats not too personal to ask (im not sure the line here, Im trained as a nurse so these private topics for me arent so private haha)??

 

[ivy]

@ivy
Do you have PCOS or fibroids by any chance, if thats not too personal to ask (im not sure the line here, Im trained as a nurse so these private topics for me arent so private haha)??

Oh, feel free to cross any lines :P
No PCOS; uterus and breasts were checked consistently and last February were ok. I have three small thyroid nodules, one of them thought to be benign but under the radar.

My worse condition is IBS, which showed up in my late 20s but maybe had been brewing all along. Mid thirties I was diagnosed with psoriasis, which also seems to point to a sensitive gut. Mind you, I think my hormonal landscape changed a year ago, had temporary enlargement of the breasts, terrible piercing pain, cycles got longer and heavy (up to 31 days) AND I went from IBS-D to IBS-C. All other symptoms have waned except for this gut change, from 7+ bowel movements to 2, 3 if I'm lucky. I feel like I've been on a crazy serotonin ride and now am a much slower animal. And while my hair was far from good before, it has gotten worse, it seems. What role serotonin might play exactly, if any, I can't tell...

There is an element I would like to add to the discussion: seasonal variation. In my case, it's quite disastrous -- no amount of Spring growth can compensate the absurd shedding between late July and December. It's a rather mysterious pattern and it brings me such instability I'm considering shaving once and for all. Do you have any insights on that?

 

[CLASH]

@ivy
For a basic disclaimer, I am not a doctor so the information is at your own risk. This is all my personal understanding/ perspective/ opinion and I may be wrong so keep this in mind.

Have you seen this post:
Clinical Context To Ray's Theoretical Context

Also whats your diet like?

Where you breastfed as a baby?

Ever do any rounds of antibiotics?

Any medications/ supps?

 

[Mossy]

@Mossy
Doing too much may be counterproductive IMO.
I would personally stick with and have been sticking with solban topically 2x per day, red light therapy a few minutes a day in the morning (i use halogens so theyre bright and stimulate circadian rhythm), and dietary manipulation (milk, kefir, honey, specific animal products already mentioned) with some basic nutrient support (fat solubles, b vitamins, vit c). Its about the long term, fibrosis takes time to reverse in the scalp and so does reversing the inflammation and gut situation. I would say with red light therapy, massage and diet, it will take 6 months or more to see lasting improvement. The solban is to just protect the hair for now, eventually it may not be needed. Doing too much may burn you out from being consistent with your approach. (I have learned the hard way many times with this in other areas of life. My dad always tells me: evolution not revolution. He also tells me "p***y is the cure to everything" so take it for what its worth).

I definitely get the anti-kitchen sink perspective, and I have followed that for the most part. I'll attempt to work it in after I have a pretty good feel for what I'm currently using is doing. I can't argue with the evolution philosophy, for most things; but, sometimes a revolution is needed.

My regimen is pretty close to what you list. I do the red light every other day, with more intense sessions, versus every day at less time. I'm attempting to match the Joules dose suggested by RedLightMan. I'm just past the 3 month mark of this; so, as a test, I may try a daily approach. But, I'm kind of convinced longer sessions are better with red light, being that they're not as powerful as laser. I used to use laser at 20 minutes a session, 3x a week.

I do agree with what you have listed. The few other additions to my topical are taurine, which has good reports for hair loss; castor oil, which has just as many; emu oil, to assist with penetration; and lastly, polysorbate 80, as an emulsifier of the ingredients. I know poly 80 is a cleaner and declogger of the pores/follicle beds, but I would imagine with all these other contents, it's not effective at achieving that. I haven't added it yet, but I could see a benefit to using the poly 80 separately as well-- before shampoo, or with it.

 

[ivy]

@ivy
For a basic disclaimer, I am not a doctor so the information is at your own risk. This is all my personal understanding/ perspective/ opinion and I may be wrong so keep this in mind.

Have you seen this post:
Clinical Context To Ray's Theoretical Context

Also whats your diet like?

Where you breastfed as a baby?

Ever do any rounds of antibiotics?

Any medications/ supps?

I hadn't seen that post, I'll dive into it.

You can find a pretty detailed account of my case in this thread:
Slow Metabolism Or Simple Estrogen Dominance?

I was breastfed, yes. I have taken antibiotics, absolutely, for minor teeth/skin infections. I've taken a variety of anti-fungal drugs (from Sporanox to caprylic acid, oregano oil) along with probiotics (Ergyphilus and Bio-Kult, sheep kefir, etc).

I'm currently taking nothing and my diet is a sort of Peaty Mediterranean diet. No milk, most times gluten free and easy on the starch, low fat from olive oil and coconut, but I might indulge in some nuts. Some veal, occasional eggs, daily raw carrot, often cucumber and cooked greens or arugula salada. Some cheese, if possible goat or sheep made from raw milk. Rice cakes and corn cakes. Black coffee. High in non-starchy fruits such as orange, pinneaple and grapes. Dark chocolate if i'm stressed or needy.

 

[CLASH]

@ivy
To me it seems like a gut problem.
Have u tried doing a elemental diet of sorts of just:

-raw light colored honey
-raw goat or sheep milk or A2 cow milk
-raw kefir
-liver, kidney, heart, ground meat
-shrimp, scallops, oysters, mussels
- maybe some fresh squeezed juices (you squeeze them yourself)

This diet would eliminate all fermentation in the colon besides milk components, basically simulating breast feeding to rebuild the colonic environment and lower serotonin endotoxin etc. This would also provide a very dense source of nutrients and energy and with very minimal toxins. Maybe try it for 2 weeks to a month and see if it makes a difference for you, to really hone in on ruling out the gut issue unless u want to do a stool test.

I would shoot for macro wise:
-Atleast 80g of protein, up to maybe 120 depending on your lean mass and hunger (im 6'2" 195lbs for reference and i eat about 130-150g a day, sometimes more.)
-atleast 150g sugars (i would do alot more, but if thats alot build up. i eat about 400-600g of sugars a day from honey and milk)
-atleast .4g of fat per lb of bodyweight from mostly dairy sources. ( i find more is better for me, better sex drive, less joint cracking, less brain fog, less adrenaline rushes. I eat around 120g per day all from goat dairy. Sometimes i use beef tallow to cook my liver or kidney.)

Other things I would keep in mind are going to bed around 10 and waking up early, getting sun exposure or red light if the winter and maybe some walking just for fresh air and some circulation ( i personally weight train but initially it could be more stressful than helpful).

I posted what I ate today for you for some ideas if ur interested.

 

[Luckytype]

@CLASH what would you be using as a marker of successful progress with this kind of setup? Im nearly there myself ...ill just pm me you IF youre not overloaded. I need some analytical insight

EDIT: added a word

 

[EIRE24]

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@ivy
To me it seems like a gut problem.
Have u tried doing a elemental diet of sorts of just:

-raw light colored honey
-raw goat or sheep milk or A2 cow milk
-raw kefir
-liver, kidney, heart, ground meat
-shrimp, scallops, oysters, mussels
- maybe some fresh squeezed juices (you squeeze them yourself)

This diet would eliminate all fermentation in the colon besides milk components, basically simulating breast feeding to rebuild the colonic environment and lower serotonin endotoxin etc. This would also provide a very dense source of nutrients and energy and with very minimal toxins. Maybe try it for 2 weeks to a month and see if it makes a difference for you, to really hone in on ruling out the gut issue unless u want to do a stool test.

I would shoot for macro wise:
-Atleast 80g of protein, up to maybe 120 depending on your lean mass and hunger (im 6'2" 195lbs for reference and i eat about 130-150g a day, sometimes more.)
-atleast 150g sugars (i would do alot more, but if thats alot build up. i eat about 400-600g of sugars a day from honey and milk)
-atleast .4g of fat per lb of bodyweight from mostly dairy sources. ( i find more is better for me, better sex drive, less joint cracking, less brain fog, less adrenaline rushes. I eat around 120g per day all from goat dairy. Sometimes i use beef tallow to cook my liver or kidney.)

Other things I would keep in mind are going to bed around 10 and waking up early, getting sun exposure or red light if the winter and maybe some walking just for fresh air and some circulation ( i personally weight train but initially it could be more stressful than helpful).

I posted what I ate today for you for some ideas if ur interested.

I read something somewhere yesterday about goats milk and that how it can be more problematic because of the casein component or the protein in it? I'm just wondering about your thoughts on this as other times i've seen people say it is generally tolerated better?

 

[ivy]

@CLASH, @EIRE24,

Dairy is perhaps one of the keys, although the right source and the best components of milk might be hard to isolate.
There is a Danish clinic working on customized growth products using "a proprietary Extract based on ingredients derived from plants and cow’s milk." If I have enough income for a round of 9 months, I might give them a try:

Harklinikken's customized topical extract treatment

On a slightly different note, I've also used a very good serum post FUE procedure. Among zinc, B vitamins and other foreseeable ingredients, it featured ovine placenta. It's a bit oily, expensive and impossible to find unless you buy it via clinic. It's an option I'm also considering if I go for a temporary shave or short hairstyle.

 

[CLASH]

@Luckytype
If its not too private I'd prefer if you ask here so that if the info applies to other people maybe it could help them out. But if its more private your welcome to PM me.

@EIRE24
Are you sure it was goats milk? The component in casein is often from cows milk and its called A1 casein. I have some post about this unless your refering to something different. In that case please if you have the info I'd like to see it.

@ivy
I dont think any topical approach is really going to solve the issue. I think its a systemic issue. Hairloss is a symptom, it is often associatef with heart disease, prostate cancer, PCOS.

 

[EIRE24]

@Luckytype
If its not too private I'd prefer if you ask here so that if the info applies to other people maybe it could help them out. But if its more private your welcome to PM me.

@EIRE24
Are you sure it was goats milk? The component in casein is often from cows milk and its called A1 casein. I have some post about this unless your refering to something different. In that case please if you have the info I'd like to see it.

@ivy
I dont think any topical approach is really going to solve the issue. I think its a systemic issue. Hairloss is a symptom, it is often associatef with heart disease, prostate cancer, PCOS.

I'm going to have to try and have a look for it but I will, I always was in the same thought process as yourself in that goats milk was better than cows milk

 

[ivy]

@Luckytype
If its not too private I'd prefer if you ask here so that if the info applies to other people maybe it could help them out. But if its more private your welcome to PM me.

@EIRE24
Are you sure it was goats milk? The component in casein is often from cows milk and its called A1 casein. I have some post about this unless your refering to something different. In that case please if you have the info I'd like to see it.

@ivy
I dont think any topical approach is really going to solve the issue. I think its a systemic issue. Hairloss is a symptom, it is often associatef with heart disease, prostate cancer, PCOS.

@CLASH, I didn't imply that topical treatment would ever suffice, I was adding to the discussion by showing that certain animal derivatives might help on both ends.

I've never tried an elemental diet such as you propose. I suppose it would be a last resort for me, as I suffer if I don't chew enough and my mood sinks when I remove too much carb. It's hard to find raw milk where I live. If i relied on storebought yogurt and kefir would it be lacking, from your point of view?