EstroBan - Liquid Vitamin (K, A, D, E) Mix

[Deleted member 5487]

Yeah neck and fatigue. I think it will get better as thyroid kicks in to replace it. Could be either estrogen or cortisol or both. What are you temps and pulse? What are you taking for supplements?

I keep pretty warm most of the day now. As for Pulse it sits in the low 70s. Only getting it to 90s after a 1L of Mexican coke. Which I can get for 1$ so I am starting to add them to breakfast. It use to sit in the 40s 6 months ago since I have been an athlete forever, So I think that's pretty good.

 

[haidut]

Apologies if this is a very novice question as I'm quite new to biochemistry / hormones:

Not specific to this product, but if pulse/temp increase with ADEK (or simply a few of these), does that mean the reduction in stress hormones of themselves has automatically improved metabolism? I'm curious, because stress hormones are sometimes talked about here as compensating for reduced thyroid functioning. Presumably if stress hormones were lowered, it can sometimes reveal impaired thyroid function they were propping up. E.g. there are several forum reports of anti cortisol drugs lowering pulse here.

Or do high stress hormones sometimes also impair thyroid function by themselves? (E.g. if there's a feedback loop of stress hormone release over time, even if the thyroid has potential to function well or regenerate function, it's locked into low functioning until that stress hormone loop is broken. I believe somewhere you talked about potentially interrupting any of high estrogen/cortisol/prolactin/etc could help restore metabolism?)


On another note, topical administration was absolutely fine

Stress hormones typically inhibit thyroid function. I know this is true for cortisol and serotonin (a neurotransmitter, not a hormone, but still stress-related) and adrenaline raises FFA which then inhibit both the synthesis of thyroid and the effects of thyroid hormone in the cell. So, lower these hormones sometimes helps thyroid function recover on its own. I would say if pulse/temps increase and extremities are NOT cold then it is a good sign.

 

[haidut]

To follow up on this, took 2 drops (1/4 dose) topically today and it seemed to trigger a stress reaction within 20 minutes. Usual pulse is 50-60, this has been around 80-90 for the past 2 hours since dosing. Temperature also possibly a little higher. Should be better on paper, but feeling considerable anxiety (impending doom type feelings) and heaviness.

It is probably related to my situation - quite high TSH 4~. And quite suppressed cortisol, if it had been a little lower, the endocrinologist said he would have put my on hydrocortisone.

But still, curious as to what the mechanisms of this might be? If cortisol blunting had been behind it, I would have expected a drop in pulse. This is the effect cyproheptadine gave me.

If cortisol is low then it could cause problems by pushing it even lower. Have you tried some pregnenolone? It may help "fill in" for cortisol where it is needed.

 

[Johnson Bagfoot]

Stress hormones typically inhibit thyroid function. I know this is true for cortisol and serotonin (a neurotransmitter, not a hormone, but still stress-related) and adrenaline raises FFA which then inhibit both the synthesis of thyroid and the effects of thyroid hormone in the cell. So, lower these hormones sometimes helps thyroid function recover on its own. I would say if pulse/temps increase and extremities are NOT cold then it is a good sign.

Interesting, thank you. I did not realise stress hormones had an inhibitory rather than compensatory effect. I read today one of Peat's articles about shifting the balance too. I can see how the body can get stuck in a suboptimal homeostasis loop. Will monitor temperature of extremities.

If cortisol is low then it could cause problems by pushing it even lower. Have you tried some pregnenolone? It may help "fill in" for cortisol where it is needed.

Interesting data point for you here. I had previously had 9am cortisol measured on 6 occasions. All of which were low. 5 days into estroban (only 2 drops), I had it measured again this morning and it's up 50% higher than I've ever seen it. This could be down to diurnal rhythms or fluke, but it's certainly reassuring that it's higher than normal, and that it hasn't been strongly suppressed. Maybe there's a regulatory effect here and it doesn't simply diminish cortisol in all cases.

Not tried pregnenolone yet, but might do next. I've seen Vitamin b5 Pantothenic Acid - talked about in similar ways as a precursor to cortisol, do you see this as a valid alternative to pregnenolone?

 

[Johnson Bagfoot]

Also, what do you consider the best time of day to take Estroban, based on reports?

 

[haidut]

Interesting, thank you. I did not realise stress hormones had an inhibitory rather than compensatory effect. I read today one of Peat's articles about shifting the balance too. I can see how the body can get stuck in a suboptimal homeostasis loop. Will monitor temperature of extremities.



Interesting data point for you here. I had previously had 9am cortisol measured on 6 occasions. All of which were low. 5 days into estroban (only 2 drops), I had it measured again this morning and it's up 50% higher than I've ever seen it. This could be down to diurnal rhythms or fluke, but it's certainly reassuring that it's higher than normal, and that it hasn't been strongly suppressed. Maybe there's a regulatory effect here and it doesn't simply diminish cortisol in all cases.

Not tried pregnenolone yet, but might do next. I've seen Vitamin b5 Pantothenic Acid - talked about in similar ways as a precursor to cortisol, do you see this as a valid alternative to pregnenolone?

I think pregnenolone alone is enough to try first, no need for B5. A little biotin may with pregnenolone conversion into cortisol. As far as stress hormones and thyroid the easiest way to think about them is in relation to the Randle cycle - i.e. just like fat and sugar block each other's oxidation, stress hormones (which promote fat oxidation) and thyroid (which promoted sugar oxidation) tend to oppose each other's effects and are usually inversely proportional in both release and effects.
As far as EstroBan - I think trying in the morning would be best as it can stimulate some people too much and interfere with sleep. But only trial and error would show, as it also promoted sleep in others.

 

[mujuro]

First time trying Estroban. Wow. It feels like Lapodin. It crushes cortisol and estrogen. I get waves of what feels like adrenaline that send me into a brief anxiety, similar to what Lapodin did. I am coming out of a majorly stressful 2 months and clearly I was relying on stress hormones to sustain me, as was the case with the Lapodin. Going to lower the dose and take it slow but I'm damn impressed.

 

[haidut]

First time trying Estroban. Wow. It feels like Lapodin. It crushes cortisol and estrogen. I get waves of what feels like adrenaline that send me into a brief anxiety, similar to what Lapodin did. I am coming out of a majorly stressful 2 months and clearly I was relying on stress hormones to sustain me, as was the case with the Lapodin. Going to lower the dose and take it slow but I'm damn impressed.

Great, thanks for the feedback! How much are you using and through what route?

 

[mujuro]

Great, thanks for the feedback! How much are you using and through what route?

Topical on the wrist, 8 drops.

 

[Lucenzo01]

Maybe talking taurine with estroban would make a great combo:


Taurine Enhances Bioavailability Of Vitamins K, A, D, E

 

[ladyhawke]

Could it possibly be better for a female to vary estroban dosage through the monthly cycle as oppose to a consistent dose? :)

 

[Johnson Bagfoot]

Hi Haidut, thanks for the usefully insights above.

Can you think of any mechanism by which Estroban could lower potassium and/or sodium plasma levels?

One factor I'm contending with is low potassium so I don't want to push this down further

 

[Johnson Bagfoot]

Also, are there any vitamins/minerals you recommend in conjunction with estroban?

I read a study recently where life expectancy was reduced with high dose vitamin e, but this effect was nullified when selenium was also added.

 

[Owen B]

Apparently I'm the last person to be giving advice to anyone and in doing so I ended up getting to the bottom of the problems that I thought had to do with Estroban and Gonadin.

I stupidly confused quinolones (e.g., Cipro) with quinones in some "advice" I gave to someone with SIBO. Dhair caught it and corrected me and when I saw his description of his symptoms my blood ran cold. Cipro is neurotoxic, myopathic and tendonipathic. All the aches and pains, the crippling irritation in my hips and knees after exercising, the incredible soreness in some tendons in my feet making it very hard to walk, the wipeout of any feeling in the gonads: all Cipro. I had it prescribed for a UTI. 14 day program.

I thought it had to hormonal, too much AI effect. But T was normal. Then I got the news from the Forum.

Everybody's taken it. Does it have long term, cumulative effects? Probably not. But then.... Continuous use not good. IV in the hospital the worst.

Just search the site for "fluoroquinolones" if you're unaware of it. There's a lot there.

 

[Deleted member 5487]

First time trying Estroban. Wow. It feels like Lapodin. It crushes cortisol and estrogen. I get waves of what feels like adrenaline that send me into a brief anxiety, similar to what Lapodin did. I am coming out of a majorly stressful 2 months and clearly I was relying on stress hormones to sustain me, as was the case with the Lapodin. Going to lower the dose and take it slow but I'm damn impressed.

Is that what I am feeling? A Wave of adrenaline

When I take it under my tongue I get these weird "impending doom" feeling in waves. I guess it would be considering anxiety.

Glad I'm not the only one.

 

[mujuro]

Is that what I am feeling? A Wave of adrenaline

When I take it under my tongue I get these weird "impending doom" feeling in waves. I guess it would be considering anxiety.

Glad I'm not the only one.

Definitely adrenaline, mixed with low blood sugar and sodium loss. As haidut said, when you take away those stress hormones and the thyroid isn't ready to pick up the slack, you will crash. Don't forget salt intake too. You will be losing more if you're suppressing cortisol.

 

[Johnson Bagfoot]

Definitely adrenaline, mixed with low blood sugar and sodium loss. As haidut said, when you take away those stress hormones and the thyroid isn't ready to pick up the slack, you will crash. Don't forget salt intake too. You will be losing more if you're suppressing cortisol.

How long does thyroid typically take to regenerate functioning over time as stress hormones are lowered?

Curious how this works. Stress hormones impair thyroid function, yet if they're lowered too much there's an adrenaline reaction, also a stress hormone. So slower changes seem appropriate. How does one know whether the thyroid is kicking in?

 

[haidut]

Could it possibly be better for a female to vary estroban dosage through the monthly cycle as oppose to a consistent dose? :)

If you wan to oppose estrogen them maybe you can take more around ovulation. Not sure, as I am not a woman but some women have reported using it this way.

 

[haidut]

Hi Haidut, thanks for the usefully insights above.

Can you think of any mechanism by which Estroban could lower potassium and/or sodium plasma levels?

One factor I'm contending with is low potassium so I don't want to push this down further

Well, vitamin E increases sodium requirements. Search the forum for "tocopherol sodium".

 

[haidut]

Also, are there any vitamins/minerals you recommend in conjunction with estroban?

I read a study recently where life expectancy was reduced with high dose vitamin e, but this effect was nullified when selenium was also added.

The vitamin E dose in EstroBan is not high, so I don't think it needs to be balanced by anything else but getting more selenium is always a good idea as it is highly protective against cancer and CVD.