What Evidence Shows Estrogen To Be A Cause Of Hair Loss?

[Elephanto]

You also said Nw 2.5 to Nw 1-.5

Yeah but I meant from the supps only, regrowth became more noticeable when I was consistent for a few months with regular topical acv, scalp massaging, scalp exercices (triggering the occipitalis muscle) and daily cardio. I think there was already good regrowth after a few months of being consistent with the supps and topical acv only but I wasn't examining my hairline often at the time since I believed it was a slow process. Also I remember around this time my mom noticing that the sides near the temples grew further toward the forehead than she had ever seen. I think months of high dose Magnesium Citrate and Bicarbonate/CO2 reduced calcification to a lower point than it was even as a child (always had a large forehead too, and the sides growing further made it more normal-sized) though bone structural changes from K2, Boron, PTH inhibition, lower estro/higher andro may have participated.

 

[Arrade]

Yeah but I meant from the supps only, regrowth became more noticeable when I was consistent for a few months with regular topical acv, scalp massaging, scalp exercices (triggering the occipitalis muscle) and daily cardio. I think there was already good regrowth after a few months of being consistent with the supps and topical acv only but I wasn't examining my hairline often at the time since I believed it was a slow process. Also I remember around this time my mom noticing that the sides near the temples grew further toward the forehead than she had ever seen. I think months of high dose Magnesium Citrate and Bicarbonate/CO2 reduced calcification to a lower point than it was even as a child (always had a large forehead too, and the sides growing further made it more normal-sized) though bone structural changes from K2, Boron, PTH inhibition, lower estro/higher andro may have participated.

TBH I’ve seen people like Jay Bilas with great jaw development but balding.
That’s awesome tho, I hope can get my juvenile hairline and be mistaken for Mexican like in high school!

 

[GorillaHead]

It's the issue of estrogen in men causing inflammation. DHT then tends to the inflammation and creates fibrosis --> reducing blood supply --> less oxygen for hair follicle --> baldness.[/QUOTE

Yeah but I meant from the supps only, regrowth became more noticeable when I was consistent for a few months with regular topical acv, scalp massaging, scalp exercices (triggering the occipitalis muscle) and daily cardio. I think there was already good regrowth after a few months of being consistent with the supps and topical acv only but I wasn't examining my hairline often at the time since I believed it was a slow process. Also I remember around this time my mom noticing that the sides near the temples grew further toward the forehead than she had ever seen. I think months of high dose Magnesium Citrate and Bicarbonate/CO2 reduced calcification to a lower point than it was even as a child (always had a large forehead too, and the sides growing further made it more normal-sized) though bone structural changes from K2, Boron, PTH inhibition, lower estro/higher andro may have participated.

Is magnesiums by itself not enough do i need the citrate form?

I am dermarolling lightly. Of i could get half of your results ill be very happy. One thing u noticed is my crown area started to get thicker and filling in.

 

[Arrade]

So dermarolling is working?
Btw, from my understanding dermastamping should be better as instead of tearing at the skin and just inserts. Also way less painful.

I always heard magnesium absorbed better topically but elephanto has a reason for his megadose magnesium

 

[Arrade]

Guys here is a good article by ray peat that discusses inflammation.
Regeneration and degeneration - Types of inflammation change with aging

 

[GorillaHead]

So dermarolling is working?
Btw, from my understanding dermastamping should be better as instead of tearing at the skin and just inserts. Also way less painful.

I always heard magnesium absorbed better topically but elephanto has a reason for his megadose magnesium

Megadose. How much? Well its too early to tell if dermarolling is working. But i am also massaging. I do expext it to work. The whole point is to increase igf. One i get about a half inch back on my hairline. Maintaining should be way easier

 

[Elephanto]

Is magnesiums by itself not enough do i need the citrate form?

I am dermarolling lightly. Of i could get half of your results ill be very happy. One thing u noticed is my crown area started to get thicker and filling in.

Citric Acid is also decalcifying. I advice this one as it worked for me and other forms seem less effective in short term results. Another outcome of ingesting citric acid daily is that Aluminium levels in the body will decrease over time. Al has estrogenic and fibrotic properties so it likely promotes mpb. Citric Acid is also considered the most effective chelator of Al compared to Succinic Acid and Malic Acid.

Comparative effects of several chelating agents on the toxicity, distribution and excretion of aluminium. - PubMed - NCBI

 

[GorillaHead]

Citric Acid is also decalcifying. I advice this one as it worked for me and other forms seem less effective in short term results. Another outcome of ingesting citric acid daily is that Aluminium levels in the body will decrease over time. Al has estrogenic and fibrotic properties so it likely promotes mpb. Citric Acid is also considered the most effective chelator of Al compared to Succinic Acid and Malic Acid.

Comparative effects of several chelating agents on the toxicity, distribution and excretion of aluminium. - PubMed - NCBI

I got my magnesium cirtrate!

Any other suggestions for tempal hair growth. Mainly for vellus hairs to go terminal. You have some great insight Elephanto!

 

[Zigzag]

Citric Acid is also decalcifying. I advice this one as it worked for me and other forms seem less effective in short term results. Another outcome of ingesting citric acid daily is that Aluminium levels in the body will decrease over time. Al has estrogenic and fibrotic properties so it likely promotes mpb. Citric Acid is also considered the most effective chelator of Al compared to Succinic Acid and Malic Acid.

Comparative effects of several chelating agents on the toxicity, distribution and excretion of aluminium. - PubMed - NCBI

How much magnesium citrate and/or citric acid would you recommend?

 

[Elephanto]

How much magnesium citrate and/or citric acid would you recommend?

The guide I followed at first adviced between 1 to 2 grams of elemental Magnesium from Mag Citrate, so I've played with dosages within, probably averaging 1400mg a day during several months. Always taken with a lot of water to avoid concentrating the citric acid in a small area of the gut, and ideally separated in 2 doses and away from meals. It's a lot but I suspect it's part of what made the stack so effective, Magnesium being so fundamentally opposing to Calcium harmful signals, I'd expect it to be very decalcifying when levels are chronically high for months. Now as a maintenance dose, I take around 700mg a few times a week. Also when we consider how intracellular calcium increase resulting in cell death is the hallmark of aging and aging-related diseases, I think that simply maintaining high Magnesium levels for most of your life could significantly increase lifespan.

@GorillaHead

Any other suggestions for tempal hair growth.

Maybe try this exercise, it's about taking control of your occipitalis muscle and triggering it casually during the day and in short sesssions. As explained it helps to develop control of all the scalp muscles which some are close to the temples and I don't know if on its own it's effective as I was doing the other stuff too but it seems to have an effect of forcing blood flow all over the head which is at the root of the calcification issue.
Exercise Five - Shape Your Face

 

[GorillaHead]

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1517/14656561003752730

page 1297 says The cytochrome p450 alpha-aromatase enzyme has also been found to contribute to androgenetic alopecia.
This could be part of why miconazole works well on hair from many reports it is a aromatase inhibitor

 

[Sourdoughbanana]

"Estrogen" is too broad of a term.

ERb activation is the best thing we can do for hair and health in general. Conversely ERa may cause all sorts of problems. It is a balance that is achieved through proper thyroid function. Estriol is the best estrogen for this. Estrone and Estradiol are meh at best.

Taeian Clarke recommends biEstro and for low estrogen males, it seems to deliver greatly.

 

[schultz]

"Estrogen" is too broad of a term.

ERb activation is the best thing we can do for hair and health in general. Conversely ERa may cause all sorts of problems. It is a balance that is achieved through proper thyroid function. Estriol is the best estrogen for this. Estrone and Estradiol are meh at best.

Taeian Clarke recommends biEstro and for low estrogen males, it seems to deliver greatly.

Regarding receptors:

"I don’t want to imply that the receptor theory is wrong just because it allows for the introduction of innumerable experimental artifacts; it is primarily wrong because it is tied to the profoundly irrelevant “membrane theory” of cell regulation." - Ray Peat; article

Nobody should be taking supplemental estrogen.

 

[Sourdoughbanana]

Regarding receptors:

"I don’t want to imply that the receptor theory is wrong just because it allows for the introduction of innumerable experimental artifacts; it is primarily wrong because it is tied to the profoundly irrelevant “membrane theory” of cell regulation." - Ray Peat; article

Nobody should be taking supplemental estrogen.

Yeah, nobody, except the guys with MPB who actually want to reverse it and regrow hair.

Looks like Peat shouldn’t be quoted on that matter. The article was probably misunderstood on your end.

 

[Scenes]

"Estrogen" is too broad of a term.

ERb activation is the best thing we can do for hair and health in general. Conversely ERa may cause all sorts of problems. It is a balance that is achieved through proper thyroid function. Estriol is the best estrogen for this. Estrone and Estradiol are meh at best.

Taeian Clarke recommends biEstro and for low estrogen males, it seems to deliver greatly.

You really think that bi-estro cream is doing all the work? Taeian only started recommending it in the last 6 months or so, and prior to that he always said it was the oils and the diet and the Nizoral doing work...2 or 3 guys jumped on bi-estro topical immediately and I know from private message that at least 2 of them either dropped it real fast, or realised it wasn’t doing anything and added other stuff.

The most recent hair post in there was from a dude who’s been following Taeian’s protocol for years and claims most of his regrowth (not impressive) is from scalp massage as the topicals did nothing.

The dude who most recently posted huge regrowth is on oral spiro and oral minox...nothing to do with the bi-Estro. He also uses AAS regularly which counterbalances the feminization effects of Spiro.

 

[Sourdoughbanana]

@Scenes yeah Clarke is a bit late on the estrogen = regrowth protocol.

Take a look at this: Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

As they say it well in there:

Estrogen is almost the only thing that brings any kind of results actually worth mentioning when it comes to this damn disease. When someone comes up with a non-hormonal treatment that delivers the same regrowth as high-dose estrogen with very few side effects then you can color me impressed. Otherwise we're just talking about toys.
**** a 2-3% improvement in hair density when as a balding man you have 25-30% hair density of a healthy head of hair.

>99% of the things you can use against your hair loss are so ******* worthless, and so far from being any kind of decent treatment (let alone the cure) that they are hardly worth talking about. That goes for Finasteride, Minoxidil, and almost everything we have. If we could apply estrogen and CPA locally without them going systemic, we would begin to approach something worthy of being called a hair loss treatment. Everything else is, as we would say around these parts, "******* the wind sideways".

I'm convinced proper thyroid function is far upstream and ought to be the long term goal, however just like any critical situation using pharmaceuticals isn't bothering me at all. Get the hair growing asap, fix the underlying issue (more fruit, no junk), stop the medication when your thyroid is in check.

 

[Pablo Cruise]

Don't forget about SHBG...