Vegetarians Look So Young

[MatheusPN]

Donald watson is a liar, if "true" means nothing but vegan food (no supps). Vegetarian is doable.

No, true vegan don't mean nothing close to that. Actually you would be quite surprised how non-radical he was and how far off, mainstream vegans are from veganism.
If you think only vegetarianism is doable you can still say you're/ like veganism tranquilaly

 

[schultz]

@schultz Wow I really liked your comment, thanks, this was something I was interested. What you can do with the goatling besides butchering them? That is sustainable economically wise? I think it's something difficult to do or solve...

Thank you! Aside from milking and butchering, you can breed and sell the kids. In Canada goats fetch a decent price at the moment. There are a lot of hobbyists who want specialty goats like the "Nigerian Dwarf" breed. We had these as our first goats and bred and sold them for approx. $500 each. We were registered, had the animals tested, papered, tattooed, disbursed, etc. Eventually though I purchased a different breed called Saanens because I wanted more milk. I bred the two breeds together and after this stopped selling because I no longer had pure Nigerians. The hybrid breed makes a decent meat goat though as it's stockier than a pure Saanen. I also traded some goats for some sheep and now have sheep as well. If I were to start all over with goats I would buy Saanens and Boer goats and breed them for milk and meat. I'd also buy a good cream separator right off the bat (they are about $1000 for a decent one). The goat milk tastes fine, just like cow's milk (most of the time), but it doesn't separate in the fridge like cow's milk so you basically have to consume it as is. It would be nicer if I could separate it quickly and then use the cream for making things and use the skimmed milk for drinking. Also once in a while the milk tastes funny and I never figured out what was causing it. I assumed it was either something they were eating, or something they were not eating (like a nutrient deficiency, or not enough calories). I thought maybe it was from going into ketosis or something. Hard to explain what it tastes like when it's off. Sort of like goat breath lol. Like when they are chewing cud and burp in your face when you're near them. Anyway, most of the time the milk tastes just like cow's milk.

 

[baccheion]

Being vegetarian or not doesn’t make a difference. High calcium and adequate protein will be anti-aging. It’s just a matter of if you prefer starch or meat to go along with milk and sugars.

What about "high" calcium via megadose vitamin D3? How much is adequate?

There are tests. If collagen and bone density are kept neutral or slightly positive (ie, not eroding), the louder markers of aesthetic aging have been saved. Especially great if done while still having regular periods of autophagy/renewal.

There isn't osteoporosis if there isn't bone loss. :). Then there's making it happen. Good to know things young.

 

[boris]

Lots of people who eat meat look young for their age. Lots of vegans and vegetarians look old, sick and fragile for any age.

"A few years ago, most of the nutritional problems that I saw were caused by physicians, by refined convenience foods, and by poverty. Recently, most of the problems seem to be caused by badly designed vegetarian diets, or by acceptance of the idea that 40 grams of protein per day is sufficient. The liver and other organs deteriorate rapidly on low-protein diets. Observe the faces of the wheat-grass promoters, the millet-eaters, the "anti-mucus" dieters, and other low-protein people. Do they look old for their age?" -Ray Peat

at 60 years old

at 70 years old

 

[mrchibbs]

how insane do you have to be when everyone agrees a vegan diet leads to death without animal/synthetic supplements, yet people prefer to be on it? It's like denying what made you human.

the need to virtue signal is stronger than desire for health.

I don't think it's virtue signalling.

I am not vegan, and I drink milk regularly, but I think there are valid reasons for wanting to be vegan. Farm animals do suffer immensely, and people tend to be attracted to all or nothing ideals, so they become fiercely anti-meat and eat a terrible diet and become ill and then revert back to carnivore or something like that.

Ray himself has spoken favourably regarding a vegan diet which would contain a variety of ripe fruits, cooked potatoes and green leafy greens, mushrooms etc. He said that such a diet would probably provide a very good amino acid balance. He has even talked a few times about the potential of combining fruits to get complete protein.

So it's not a question of insanity. I don't think a vegan diet is more insane than a keto, carnivore or paleo diet.

 

[MatheusPN]

Thank you! Aside from milking and butchering, you can breed and sell the kids. In Canada goats fetch a decent price at the moment. There are a lot of hobbyists who want specialty goats like the "Nigerian Dwarf" breed. We had these as our first goats and bred and sold them for approx. $500 each. We were registered, had the animals tested, papered, tattooed, disbursed, etc. Eventually though I purchased a different breed called Saanens because I wanted more milk. I bred the two breeds together and after this stopped selling because I no longer had pure Nigerians. The hybrid breed makes a decent meat goat though as it's stockier than a pure Saanen. I also traded some goats for some sheep and now have sheep as well. If I were to start all over with goats I would buy Saanens and Boer goats and breed them for milk and meat. I'd also buy a good cream separator right off the bat (they are about $1000 for a decent one). The goat milk tastes fine, just like cow's milk (most of the time), but it doesn't separate in the fridge like cow's milk so you basically have to consume it as is. It would be nicer if I could separate it quickly and then use the cream for making things and use the skimmed milk for drinking. Also once in a while the milk tastes funny and I never figured out what was causing it. I assumed it was either something they were eating, or something they were not eating (like a nutrient deficiency, or not enough calories). I thought maybe it was from going into ketosis or something. Hard to explain what it tastes like when it's off. Sort of like goat breath lol. Like when they are chewing cud and burp in your face when you're near them. Anyway, most of the time the milk tastes just like cow's milk.

kkkkkkkkkkkkk
Appreciate man! I have heard about this crazy funny taste...
I was thinking goatlings are the male kids, I was mistaken, sorry you could write less, at least it brought very useful cases. You slashed lots of topics and research time.

Apparently, if you want the male kids to go to adulthood, which I know is very problematic and can be bad for them, the best option is to be a breeder. Thx I wish you success with the cows. If I see anything helpful about, I will tell you

@mrchibbs Thanks for bringing those points here, I think the same. "Peating" is better. I will seek to counter-argument Peat fundamentals, so far I can't...

 

[Jennifer]

I wonder how much magnesium (+ potassium) feeds into looking younger, especially as it so much protects against peroxidation and inflammation? And aldosterone and PTH. And acidity. And stress. And heavy metals.

Collagen in skin, Norwood, etc start eroding after teenage years. I wonder if it's related to hidden stress? Declining melatonin + hGH? Less IGF-1? Heh.

Sure, I think many of the alkaline minerals support a youthful look, and health in general, for the many reasons Ray has talked about. I'm not sure if this will interest you but I was rereading Ray's article on regeneration and degeneration today and in it he writes:

"In the adult, the PUFA and prostaglandins are known to increase collagen synthesis. Serotonin and estrogen, which interact closely with PUFA, promote collagen synthesis and fibrosis. In the fetus, hyaluronic acid, rather than collagen, is the main extracellular material in wound repair (Krummel, et al., 1987). Both it and its decomposition products have important regulatory “signal” functions in wound healing (Gao, et al., 2008), inflammation, and cell differentiation (Krasinski and Tchórzewski, 2007).

Prostaglandins also inhibit local cell division (observed in the cornea, Staatz and Van Horn, 1980), shifting responsibility for tissue repair to mobile cells, for example stem cells from the blood. PUFA also interfere with the turnover of collagen by inhibiting proteolytic enzymes that are necessary for tissue remodeling. These are among the changes that characterize scar formation, rather than the scarless regeneration that can occur in the fetus. They also occur throughout the body with aging, as part of a progressive fibrosis.

Besides minimizing dietary PUFA, other things are known that will reduce the fibrosis associated with injury, inflammation, or aging. Thyroid hormone, progesterone, and carbon dioxide all reduce inflammation while facilitating normal tissue remodeling. Fibrosis of the heart and liver, which are often considered to be unavoidably progressive, can be regressed by thyroid hormone, and various fibroses, including breast, liver, and mesentery, have been regressed by progesterone treatment."

 

[pepsi]

The more wealthy vegans might look younger than the middle/poorer class
meat eaters because of the quality of food. Dr Peat mentions the longer
foods are stored and subjected to stress(meat and vegetables), the more polyamines that
are created and transferred to the eater and these polyamines can cause
stress related diseases.

I like Dr Peats articles because he addresses the problems in depth, then at
the end of the article he gives helpful easy solutions.

 

[pepsi]

Whats also interesting is that Dr Peat mentions when flatworms were fed
other trained flatworms, their performance increased by 50%.

So we can see how much affect the future food product has on the consumer
just by the way it was treated/handled.

 

[rei]

I don't think it's virtue signalling.

I am not vegan, and I drink milk regularly, but I think there are valid reasons for wanting to be vegan. Farm animals do suffer immensely, and people tend to be attracted to all or nothing ideals, so they become fiercely anti-meat and eat a terrible diet and become ill and then revert back to carnivore or something like that.

Ray himself has spoken favourably regarding a vegan diet which would contain a variety of ripe fruits, cooked potatoes and green leafy greens, mushrooms etc. He said that such a diet would probably provide a very good amino acid balance. He has even talked a few times about the potential of combining fruits to get complete protein.

So it's not a question of insanity. I don't think a vegan diet is more insane than a keto, carnivore or paleo diet.

No other promoted diet is completely lacking some vitamin we need to live. So veganism = death unless you start using synthetic ***t.

Farm animals don't suffer in most of the world, or at least in large parts of it. Farming animals in europe looks completely different to USA, and maybe some other places that value money over everything else...

For instance, the milk i drink comes from cows that only eat grass grown locally, they are free to move about at all times, they go to milking machine when they want, they don't get hormones or antibiotics. This is the quality you can find in every food shop.

Also, here caged chicken is illegal, as is warehouse chicken. They need to be free to move about, socialize etc.

It does not require very much to make the animal food we eat humanely. Just some profit cuts compared to behaving like a stone cold robot.

 

[mrchibbs]

No other promoted diet is completely lacking some vitamin we need to live. So veganism = death unless you start using synthetic ***t.

Farm animals don't suffer in most of the world, or at least in large parts of it. Farming animals in europe looks completely different to USA, and maybe some other places that value money over everything else...

Which vitamin are you referring to?

A vegan diet typically potentially lacks nothing except good quality protein and some trace nutrients and vitamin b12. But as I mentioned, sprouts, potatoes, mushrooms, and even a combination of fruits can provide a good combination of amino acids. (Ray said it, not just me) Cooked leafy greens can provide plenty of calcium, magnesium.

The problem with a vegan diet is that it rarely looks like what I describe above. And stress increases requirement for zinc, protein, and the b-vitamins. So I always think of a 80% vegan diet, where 20% comes in the form of very high quality milk, shellfish, eggs and maybe a little meat from local, more ethical farms. If people did this, and stopped buying conventional animal products from their supermarket, and instead used that cash to buy a little less, but higher quality foodstuffs from their local farms, we'd be better off.

It's an ideal, I don't follow this myself. But I aim to.

If you don't believe farm animals suffer, I invite you to go to your nearest superfarms and slaughterhouses. In my view it's just about impossible to deny. Some small-scale organic farms do a better job of avoiding cruelty, improving living conditions and stunning the animals before slaughter. But that's the very minority.

 

[rei]

vitamin = essential to live. So what does the lack of the vitamin you mentioned mean? A slow, suffering death once you stop consuming mother's milk.

I know what it looks like in the "mass producer" my milk comes from. I trust the others are at least OK, even if they are far from this exemplary producer i described. We respect our animals.

 

[GreekDemiGod]

Been curious about this guy. Rich Roll. He is 55. Seems to look about his age.
Physique is decent, more developed lower body. Upper body seems skinny, but that’s typical in runners.
Facially, he doesn’t seem to age that gracefully. I remember my father at 54 and he looked more youthful in the face, but he had higher body fat.
I’m wondering if it’s the vegan diet or the years of endurance running & marathons doing damage.

Rich is a vegan ultra-endurance athlete and full-time wellness & plant-based nutrition advocate

 

[mrchibbs]

Been curious about this guy. Rich Roll. He is 55. Seems to look about his age.
Physique is decent, more developed lower body. Upper body seems skinny, but that’s typical in runners.
Facially, he doesn’t seem to age that gracefully. I remember my father at 54 and he looked more youthful in the face, but he had higher body fat.
I’m wondering if it’s the vegan diet or the years of endurance running & marathons doing damage.

Rich is a vegan ultra-endurance athlete and full-time wellness & plant-based nutrition advocate

He definitely looks good. But I'm sure he benefits more from things like having a loving family, and running in nature, eating organic fruits, having a good epigenetic background, getting sunshine etc. All those positives compensate for the negatives of not getting enough animal protein and eating more irritating foods like grains, seeds, and beans.

Each individual has a different context.

 

[CastorTroy]

"A few years ago, most of the nutritional problems that I saw were caused by physicians, by refined convenience foods, and by poverty. Recently, most of the problems seem to be caused by badly designed vegetarian diets, or by acceptance of the idea that 40 grams of protein per day is sufficient. The liver and other organs deteriorate rapidly on low-protein diets. Observe the faces of the wheat-grass promoters, the millet-eaters, the "anti-mucus" dieters, and other low-protein people. Do they look old for their age?" -Ray Peat

Yet now Ray Peat aims for a 50gr protein /day diet.

 

[BearWithMe]

Yet now Ray Peat aims for a 50gr protein /day diet.

Do you have source on that?

 

[FocusedOnHealth]

Vegans/vegetarians/whatever, so many look so young. What do you think? while a peat diet looks to be optimal for hormones, why do vegans look so good?

ringo starr is 80...... yes he is actually 80

jared leto is 48....

adrien grenier is 43....

all these pics are recent, in the last 2 or 3 years.. sometimes i wonder, if you get enough light/thyroid working well, just eat vegetables all day, would it work just as well... ? the question would be to look at their cortisol, estrogen, etc, but they are all super slim, i doubt they have high estrogen, i wonder what their testosterone looks like or libido

I would disagree with the title.

I think it’s more lifestyle than anything that keeps you healthy looking. Plus vegtarians many times, look sickly, kinda gray at times, because IMO, they are not getting the nutrients that meat supplies. And they don’t get enough fat in general. Some may be a healthy weight but are they really healthy?

 

[CastorTroy]

Do you have source on that?

Dr. Ray Peat, Ph.D - Your Health Questions Answered - March 23, 2022 | One Radio Network

The double bonds in Omega 3’s are anti-thyroid and pro-estrogen. High cortisol and high estrogen cause leaky capillaries. Methionine restriction increases lifespan 40%. Get enough milk when eating…

oneradionetwork.com

Around 01:35:40

 

[Ritchie]

Dr. Ray Peat, Ph.D - Your Health Questions Answered - March 23, 2022 | One Radio Network

The double bonds in Omega 3’s are anti-thyroid and pro-estrogen. High cortisol and high estrogen cause leaky capillaries. Methionine restriction increases lifespan 40%. Get enough milk when eating…

oneradionetwork.com

Around 01:35:40

He says he aims for 50 gms of protein a day, and gets that from milk and oats. Vegetarian Peat?

 

[BearWithMe]

Dr. Ray Peat, Ph.D - Your Health Questions Answered - March 23, 2022 | One Radio Network

The double bonds in Omega 3’s are anti-thyroid and pro-estrogen. High cortisol and high estrogen cause leaky capillaries. Methionine restriction increases lifespan 40%. Get enough milk when eating…

oneradionetwork.com

Around 01:35:40

wow! thanks for sharing