MelaNon - Dietary Supplement For Skin Spots, Moles, Etc

Discussion in 'IdeaLabs' started by haidut, Nov 10, 2015.

  1. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    I3C is indole-3-carbnol, and is very popular right now for steering estrogen metabolism away from estradiol. If you could post a study showing vitamin C has beneficial effect on estrone and its effect on liver it would be great.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spider_angioma
    "...The dilation, in turn, is caused by increased estrogen levels in the blood. Many pregnant women, or women using hormonal contraception, have spider angiomas, due to high estrogen levels in their blood. Individuals with significant hepatic disease also show many spider angiomas, as their liver cannot metabolize circulating estrogens, specifically estrone, which derives from the androgen androstenedione.[3] About 33% of patients with cirrhosis have spider angiomas.[5] As such, microhemorrhages may be observed as spider angiomas."
     
  2. Nicholas

    Nicholas Member

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    if there were a study showing vitamin c having beneficial effects on estrone and its effect on the liver, i agree that would be great. But that's not what i said could easily be found. If someone only perceives through the lense of scientific study, there will be so much valuable information missed....and to search for direct causes and effects is not in line with the way the body works. People do not develop conditions through simplistic cause and effect events. I would assume you understand this, but i honestly can't tell from your two replies. Take, for example, the necessity for vitamin C in the synthesis of steroid hormones. Pregnenolone plays an important role in immune function. Angiogenesis is popularly associated with aging and low immune function. There are certainly studies showing the necessity of Vitamin C in liver processes and even a study showing a relationship between vitamin C deficiency and elevated hepatic lipds/oxidative stress....as well as a study showing a combo of Vitamin E and C being an effective treatment for fatty liver disease. smoking is seen as a "cause" of spider angiomas popularly. but what primary vitamin are all smokers depleted of? sun exposure is seen as another "cause" of spider angiomas. but what vitamin is so crucial for reducing sun damage? Of course i am not alluding to these studies (in whatever quality) merely to make a point that Vitamin C needs to be in the Peatarian arsenal against fatty liver disease or part of an anti-aging protocol (even though it popularly is in the mainstream)....i am simply making the point that elevated estrogen in the body has more causes than can be listed here....more pathways....it's more like a domino effect. the natural route is to say it's a liver issue....but then why the liver issue? vitamin E deficiency? nobody's ever heard of that. elevated estrogen could be because someone is on a low protein diet and their liver cannot repair. or it could be related to all sorts of nutrient deficiencies. I have already heavily researched spider angiomas and it revealed absolutely nothing to me regarding what causes them.
     
  3. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    All I am saying is that estrone seems to be causative for spider angiomas and the clinicians that I have talked to sometimes treat it with fulvestrant (an estrogen antagonist). Primary cause of liver dysfunction is PUFA, endogenous estrogen, and of course environmental estrogens. Protein deficiency plays a role but for most people it is minor since cortisol will rise adaptively to provide the liver with amino acids. Saturated fat and large doses vitamin E can reverse even advanced cirrhosis. Without PUFA, a human cannot develop liver disease, not even hepatitis. Assuming high estrogen is both a result and cause of liver dysfunction, opposing it in any way is often very helpful. The role estrogen in both venous and hepatic disorders is acknowledged by most endocrinologists, so that's why I posted the link from Wikipedia - to emphasize that the role of estrone in liver disease and spider veins is more than just a study, it's the current consensus among most endocrinologists (at least in the USA). Of course, just because it is a consensus does not make it true but the evidence for it is strong.
    I think we are hijacking the thread with this discussion. It's OK to disagree, but let's take it to another thread.
     
  4. NathanK

    NathanK Member

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    Haidut, just to clarify, would this be good for scar tissue? Also, in the description you say that the caffeine is combined with mixed tocopherols, but I don't see that in the ingredient list. Vitamin E I would guess would be good in this combination to lower estrogen even more.

    btw, in relation to the conversation you were just having, I believe much of the notorious "belly fat" is comprised of estrone (E1), which has been considered an estrodiol (E2) precursor.
     
  5. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    It is possible that it would work for scars since there are some studies with caffeine effect on scar tissue. Apigenin also has some data for helping reduce collagen buildup as a result of healing a skin lesion.
    The product initially had some tocopherol but it was making it very sticky and could even clog the bottle. So, instead I went with the tried formula DMSO + ethanol, and now it is a pure liquid of orange-brownish color that absorbs into the skin almost immediately. No bottle clogging either.
    On the estrone - thanks for bringing this up. Estrone sulfate (E1S) is one of the best blood tests to get for determining estrogenic activity in the organism.. Just like DHEA-S is used to gauge DHEA and overall anabolic activity. I'd say E1S, prolactin, and CO2 are the 3 biomarkers that give the most information for the least amount of money in regards to overall health.
     
  6. NathanK

    NathanK Member

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    When I was writing that, I was just thinking that E1 test may be the best test for tissue bound estrogen, but I'd never heard of anyone doing so for this particular reason. My serum CO2 has gone down by a few points since Peating from Paleo a couple years ago and my energy and health has gone up. It's odd, so I don't trust those results. I want to get a capnometer to see if that would be more accurate.

    I plan to test this supp in a few areas: On a small subcutaneous cyst on my right shoulder, a couple moles here and there, and a small scar under my eye I got in wartime. All are located on different skin tissue so it'll be interesting how it all comes out. I can always add E and K seperately as needed and I actually appreciate it not having E in it if it's easier to use.

    These flavanoids, if they can reduce collagen buildup as shown, combined with the anti-inflammatory DMSO, sound like this supp could potentially be good for someone with arthritis in certain joints.
     
  7. Nicholas

    Nicholas Member

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    observations so far after only 2 days: significant skin tightening (not something i was necessarily looking for). could be useful for wrinkles?
     
  8. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    A known "side effect" of anti-estrogenic substances:): Progesterone and DHT have a very well known skin anti-aging effect and both of them oppose estrogen, especially in the skin.
    So, yes, I guess it could be useful for wrinkles and it would synergize well with SolBan as it also has some solid research behind it for skin aging.
     
  9. Nicholas

    Nicholas Member

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    "It is well known that many flavonoids provide protection from telangiectasias and petechias caused by ruptured blood vessels. Thus, the notion of a "strengthening" effect of these compounds on blood vessel walls is common.": http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18691514

    "The best known pharmacological activity of this molecule is the reduction of permeability and capillary fragility.
    In the 1940s and 1950s, rutin was widely described for this activity. At the time, rutin, which belonged to the "vitamin P" family, the P referring to the idea of Permeability, grouped together the actives capable of increasing the resistance and modulating the permeability of the capillaries. Today, the term "Vitamin P" has disappeared, to be replaced by bioflavonoid.": http://www.etatpur.co.uk/index.php/rutin-sheet

    oral silica also seems to be a preventative or cosmetic measure in telangiectasias, but i can't find the studies. deeper issues are obviously at play in capillary problems.
     
  10. Nicholas

    Nicholas Member

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    i like to use the melanon at night before bed, but was wondering if using it during the day would be harmed by sunlight.
     
  11. Blossom

    Blossom Member

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    There has been discussion on the forum about concerns over silica and intestinal persorption. If you type 'silica persorption' in the search box you can read all about it and decide for yourself if silica is right for you.
     
  12. Nicholas

    Nicholas Member

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    ok, thank you.
     
  13. mbachiu

    mbachiu New Member

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    Haidut, do you think this formulation would work to lighten melasma? I have a patch on my upper lip. I'm a woman, and so looking like I have a moustache, even when it's November, is not really what I'm going for. I'm guessing that it would be.
     
  14. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    Why would it be harmed by sunlight?
     
  15. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    My other supplement, SolBan, has a lot more research on melasma given that it contains a high concentration of niacinamide. Go to that thread and look at the studies under the "Niacinamide" section.
    MelaNon may help, but it would probably be the caffeine in it that has the most effect.
     
  16. Nicholas

    Nicholas Member

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    well, i was reading about vitamin K (and, of course, PUFA) being damaged by light. So was wondering about the tocopherols....if they can oxidize in light (or oxidize on skin in sunlight)
     
  17. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    I don't think tocopherol is subject to destruction by sunlight the same way as riboflavin or vitamin K are.
    http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/mic/micronut ... protection
     
  18. Nicholas

    Nicholas Member

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    for those who have asked or are considering using over a large portion of skin: i tried this all over my face for 4 days (like 3-4 drops at night and washed off in AM)....just as a curious experiment for capillary issues in the meantime of working on the root problem. The first 2 days were fine. It really has a dramatic and very fast alteration of skin quality - like very radiant, smaller pores, definite tightening, more even skin tone, etc. However, by the 3rd or 4th day i started noticing sensitivity and stinging and i stopped when i had a day where i was flushing constantly. It tightened my skin so much that it almost hurt to smile (not making this up). The issue resolved a day after stopping. And i can still see the general skin benefits 2 days later not even using it (though now i can smile comfortably). So i will try it again for a single day and isolate if there's in fact any inflammation from using it for my purpose....and if not, will likely use it on face with larger intervals in between. no seriously, this could actually be used as a botox alternative. : I
     
  19. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    Thanks for the feedback. I noticed a wrinkle removing effect on my forehead where I applied to a small cut to see if it would heal better and without a scar. The scar did not form either, which is also a good result.
     
  20. Parsifal

    Parsifal Member

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