Zinc, Copper, Selenium: Shellfish Vs Cocoa

Discussion in 'Minerals' started by kettlebell, Oct 22, 2012.

  1. OP
    kettlebell

    kettlebell Member

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    I assume this is after cooking them? :):

    Edit: I didn't realise you ate them raw! (I have been eating mussells but they don't cut it)
     
  2. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

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    I think this is before cooking them.
     
  3. HDD

    HDD Member

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    Eating them in oyster stew (the little ones) are pretty good. Well, much more edible IMO. Pitcher of beer is the only way to tolerate raw. :)
     
  4. HDD

    HDD Member

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    But beer is bad.:(
     
  5. Birdie

    Birdie Member

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    I'm back at the oysters again. I just had to stop for about a month. Started back last week.
    So, we do have fresh ones here, but my husband doesn't trust the source.

    So, it's Canned Smoked Oysters. Yes, I've been cutting them up and soaking in lemon juice. First drying them with paper towels.

    Then I make Hangtown Fry. Eggs, milk, gelatin, garlic... I do a flat omelette. (My husband who only likes the eastern us oysters raw won't touch the smoked ones. So, I put two into my share of the eggs.) Then grated cheese. Bacon done in CO on top.

    Every other day, I have 2 oysters, this way.
     
  6. Chemi

    Chemi Member

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    Hi guys!

    I'm guessing the high amount of phosphorous in chocolate is because dark chocolate has large amounts of phytic acid/phytates - chemically it's a very stubborn and hard to break down molecule.

    Phytic acid loves binding to most minerals eg zinc and iron and forms a really inert complex of the mineral which makes it hard to absorb. Guess the chocolate cooking process breaks a good amount of phytic stuff.

    Maybe oysters have their minerals and nutrients as a part of their metabolic and or structural makeup which might be more readily free'd up for absorption/digestion aka "bioavailable"

    Wish I could be more certain about it but its just a possibility. I wouldn't be afraid of chocolate personally, since its so convenient and tasty.


    Happy Peating~ :)
     
  7. Birdie

    Birdie Member

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    I don't know if somebody else mentioned this but RP talks about eating milk chocolate rather than dark. Also, the dark hits hard on the blood glucose. But if you were having it with milk, that would help blunt the effect. Somebody else mentioned the high leucine, and the association with craving.

    I can't find any unadulterated milk chocolate. All has soy lecithin at the least.

    Anyway, I can't eat a lot of chocolate because the high arginine activates Herpes zoster/Shingles for me.
    Too bad.
     
  8. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

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    Hmmm, so maybe dark chocolate isnt exactly optimal.....
     
  9. Birdie

    Birdie Member

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    Somehow I must finish my tin of smoked oysters. I think I'll put one on a rice cracker next. And I should pat them all dry and cover with lemon juice.
    This morning I used lemon juice, garlic powder and extra butter with my oyster. It didn't work. Still ruined my omelette. :roll:
     
  10. crX

    crX Member

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    Birdie, I don't know where you are located, but was wondering what kind of tinned oysters you are able to find? I can only find the ones packed in cottonseed oil, as I heard that the ones in olive oil were recalled.... I'm wondering if the ones in cottonseed oil would be OK if they were drained and soaked properly...
     
  11. Birdie

    Birdie Member

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    I am in the US. I threw out the tin and forget the brand, but they are done in olive oil. I don't know if you can get enough of the cottonseed oil off the oysters.
     
  12. crX

    crX Member

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    Oh, OK. I haven't been able to find the ones in olive oil, but I do remember liking them very much.

    I just went to a different market tonight and found some oysters (not smoked) in a can with just salt and water. I'm pretty sure these weren't there the last time I looked at that market. I also found that they have raw oysters in a jar next to the meat dept, but the exp. date was tomorrow and didn't think I'd get to them that fast so I bought the canned ones. Oyster problem solved for the moment. I also bought some canned "french liver pate" which is made from pork livers so not the greatest source and probably has its share of PUFA, but until I figure how I want to buy and cook liver for myself at least I will be getting a little in my diet :)
     
  13. OP
    kettlebell

    kettlebell Member

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    I think it is ok, just always have it with some sugar or even better some milk and sugar to help balance the phosphate/calcium ratio. Its packed full of vits and minerals and in my opinion is well worth eating.
     
  14. fat4thought

    fat4thought Member

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    kettlebell said:

    "Cocoa has:

    Less Zinc (By far) BUT high cocoa chocolate can be eaten daily which would make up the difference
    Similar copper content
    Higher selenium content

    If you were to eat say 100gm of 90% cocoa chocolate every day you would get the following per week:

    44gm Zinc per week
    24gm copper per week
    12.8mcg selenium per week"

    So, Charlie, the answer was already in this thread.

    nwo, I don't think I was directing anything at you personally, and anyway, I left my gloves somewhere else... I always seem to forget them... ;)

    Maybe if it's the largest dietary source of phosphorous, it is less likely to be a problem?

    Anyway, this is also going from a gut feeling that chocolate is likely not a suitable recommendation for zinc for every individual, from my experience of about six years of eating oysters and chocolate (with the oysters being a lot more intermittent than the chocolate, both dark and milk, during various periods), and needing oysters, not chocolate, for zinc. Now, that being said, I'm not having zinc levels tested, I'm going by premenstrual issues, and, specifically, lines in my fingernails. Another variable, besides phytate, which was not mentioned, was oxalate.

    This crosses over to my posts on K2 -- K2 deficiency seems to play a role in sensitivity to oxalate. I go through periods of mild sensitivity to oxalate. Maybe something about oxalate has to do with my inability to get sufficient zinc from chocolate.

    Is there any evidence that zinc tests are useful or reliable?

    That all being said, I seem to be doing better on zinc on this way of eating, whereas I seemed to be wasting it on a high-zinc (low-carb) diet. The lines in my nails (which disappeared when I was eating oysters weekly) are much fainter than they were on the low-carb diet. Sadly, the canned oysters I was able to get here (Crown Prince) were recalled for potential norovirus contamination many months ago, and we haven't been able to get them since. I need to just grill some whole oysters, since all the chocolate I am eating (trying to emulate Jeanne Calment) isn't doing the trick. ;)

    Amy
     
  15. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

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    Well, and now that I see how bad phosphorus is for us, dang, wish I had that newsletter but anyways, I know phosphorus is not so good. Dark chocolate is getting a downgrade in my book. Less chocolate, more oysters.
     
  16. j.

    j. Guest

    I'd like to see some numbers. I'd like to see if one drinks between 2 and 5 quarts of milk, what's the calcium/phosphorus ratio after adding chocolate.
     
  17. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

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    Would like to see the numbers too. I have pretty much cut my chocolate consumption in half now.
     
  18. j.

    j. Guest

    Since I take chocolate with milk, what I should be interested in knowing is the calcium/phosphorus ratio of that milk chocolate cup. Maybe some day when I'm not lazy...
     
  19. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

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    Could always chase it with some extra egg shell calcium to.
     
  20. OP
    kettlebell

    kettlebell Member

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    Considering im chugging nearer 3 litres a day Milk right now I imagine my Calcium :phosphate ratio is pretty good.
    I still eat a fair amount of organic 85-90% cocoa chocolate and seem to do well on it. I love the taste!

    Its all individual of course.
     
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