Copper Deficiency In Humans

Discussion in 'Minerals' started by Amazoniac, Aug 29, 2016.

Tags:
  1. Amazoniac

    Amazoniac Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2014
    Messages:
    7,441
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Not Uganda
    Copper Deficiency in Humans

    This is not a brief review, I suggest that you read it completely for all the details. Here are some interesting parts from it:
    • "The importance of reductions in the activity of cytochrome oxidase in causing the manifestations of Cu deficiency has probably been underestimated. Many authors have suggested that the reduction to 50% of normal activity seen in Cu deficiency is unlikely to cause disease (e.g. 85)."
    • "Maintaining a steady level of copper in the body of a healthy subject depends primarily upon a balance between intestinal absorption and biliary excretion, with small additional losses in sweat and by the desquamation of skin. Biliary excretion is capable of increasing substantially when there is copper overload."
    • "Metallothionein is involved in the important mechanism by which excessive zinc (Zn) intake can block Cu absorption (32). Zinc is a stronger inducer of metallothionein production than Cu, yet Cu can displace Zn from metallothionein (5). Large doses of Zn can trap Cu in the intestinal mucosal cells bound to metallothionein until the mucosal cells are shed."
    • "The conventional view has been that Cu is taken up by the liver, incorporated into ceruloplasmin, and carried by it to other tissues. However, this process cannot explain the high proportion of orally administered 64Cu found in nonhepatic tissues in the first hours after oral administration (52)."
    • "Ceruloplasmin is an important Cu protein. It is a large glycoprotein containing six atoms of Cu per molecule, has an oxidase activity against many substrates (10, 13, 31), and contributes approximately 90% of the Cu present in plasma. Consequently, measurement of plasma Cu is effectively measurement of ceruloplasmin."
    • "Anemia and neutropenia are seen in all animal species and in nutritional Cu deficiency in humans. Lack of the ferroxidase activity of ceruloplasmin and consequent failure of release of iron from tissue stores has been blamed for the anemia (28), but this is unlikely to be the complete explanation (70, 71). Patients with Wilson disease or Menkes disease may have very little ceruloplasmin, yet they do not develop anemia or neutropenia (16) nor do brindled mice (7, 71). Severe reduction of cytochrome oxidase and superoxide dismutase has been shown in bone marrow of Cu-deficient mice, but not in brindled mice (71). This might explain both the anemia and the neutropenia. Reduction of erythropoietin has been described in rats (105)."
    • "Osteoporosis is another feature seen in all species. It is probably the consequence of inadequate cross-linking of collagen caused by lysyl oxidase deficiency. Lysyl oxidase deficiency also leaves elastin inadequately crosslinked (and therefore more soluble than normal when tissues are studied in the laboratory), a defect that is responsible for the aortic rupture and emphysema seen in several species (8, 35, 62)."
    • "Myocardial disease due to Cu deficiency was first noted as a cause of sudden death ("falling disease") in cattle in Western Australia in the late 1930s and has also been seen in sheep (96). Myocardium is generally hypertrophied, but may become dilated and thin, and may even rupture. Fibrosis is found diffusely through the hypertrophied muscle with a distribution quite different from that seen in ischemic heart disease seen in humans."
    • "The type of myocardial disease seen in these various animals seems to have much more in common with the cardiomyopathy seen in cytochrome oxidase deficiency in humans (21) than with human ischemic heart disease. Lysyl oxidase deficiency and dopamine-f3-hydroxylase deficiency may also be playing a part."
    • "Neuronal loss is marked in the cerebellum and spinal tracts with extensive demyelination (84, 85, 96)."
    • "Claims of a specific role of copper in myelination have become entrenched in articles on copper, but there is little evidence of a specific role (72). This claim began because myelin deficiency is so marked in swayback, but this condition has the features of demyelination, not defective synthesis, and the distribution of lesions corresponds with the distribution of neuronal loss (72, 83-85)."
    • "Interference with cross-linking of elastin and collagen can be blamed for many of the features of the [Menkes] disease (16)--premature rupture of the membranes leading to premature birth, lax skin and joints, elongation and dilatation of major arteries leading to rupture and hemorrhage, subintimal thickening with partial occlusion of major arteries, hernias, and diverticulae of bladder and ureters causing recurrent infection or rupture. Osteoporosis, flaring of metaphyses, fractures of metaphyseal edges, and Wormian bones in cranial sutures may all be secondary to collagen abnormalities."
    • "Lack of pigmentation of skin and hair and abnormal spiral twisting (pili torti) and fragility of the hair add to the characteristic appearance of the affected babies (19). Disulfide bonding of keratin is defective as in Cudeficient sheep (20)."
    • "The fine hair and depigmentation observed in Peruvian children with Cu deficiency (30) is difficult to interpret because these features are also described in kwashiorkor and the children were grossly malnourished. One cannot tell whether protein-caloric deficiency was causing these effects in the Peruvian children or whether Cu deficiency could be involved in causing these features in many cases of severe malnutrition."
    • "Chronic diarrhea may have been important in the Cu deficiency observed in Peruvian children (10, 30)."
    • "Oral administration of Zn has also caused Cu deficiency in humans. The mechanism was discussed above. In some patients, the Zn was given for specific reasons in sickle cell anemia (68) or in delayed wound healing. A current vogue of liberally prescribing Zn supplements (with or without multivitamin preparations) by some practitioners of alternative forms of medicine is a serious concern. The practice often follows analysis of trace element levels in hair and/or fingernails of patients with various symptoms and sufficient money to pay for the procedures. The interpretation of these results is difficult and generally of dubious validity (see below). Some people buy vitamins and Zn across the counter of "health food" shops and consume large quantities in the belief that they are harmless and good for health. This practice should be discouraged."
    • "[In severe deficiency,] Serum Cu and ceruloplasmin levels are reduced to a degree that leaves no doubt, e.g. to 30% of the normal level."
    • The authors suggest that everything that happens in severe deficiency, can help diagnose mild chronic deficiency when those symptoms still occur (but in a milder form) and are not responsive to other (more direct) treatments.
    • "If ceruloplasmin does really transport Cu to connective tissues, then the estrogen/Cu interaction may be relevant since serum ceruloplasmin levels are partly determined by estrogen levels (31)."
    • "Arthritis is another common condition in which Cu status may be relevant. Collagen and elastin are important in cartilage so Cu must be necessary. One might anticipate a role in osteoarthritis rather than in rheumatoid arthritis or other joint disorders of early onset. Copper has been used in arthritis for many years without any scientific basis. Many arthritis sufferers wear Cu bracelets. Advocates of the copper/arthritis connection have pointed out that Cu is absorbed transdermally from metallic Cu and some have advocated dermal application of organic Cu complexes such as Cu aspirinate for the treatment of arthritis (87). The same workers have argued that the beneficial effects of penicillamine in rheumatoid arthritis might be the result of a redistribution of Cu between tissues."
    • "The exaggerated claims of these proponents should not deter others from taking seriously the possibility of a causative association. Careful studies are needed in a large group of patients once good methods' of assessing Cu status have been developed."
    • "The principal abnormality in the arterial walls in Cu deficiency is in elastin, with great increases in soluble elastin and reduction in cross-linked mature fibrils (8, 62). Consequently one might expect the impact of the disorder to be maximal in the aorta and large arteries, with less effect on smaller vessels, which have more smooth muscle in their walls."
    • "Myocardial disease has not been firmly related to Cu deficiency in humans, although it clearly does occur in animals (see above). The myocardial changes observed in Cu-deficient animals are quite different from those of ischemic heart disease in humans. This has not deterred Klevay (45) from promoting very strongly his "zinc-copper hypothesis" of ischemic heart disease ever since 1973."
    • "Mere avoidance of deficiency does not guarantee good nutrition. This may require the supply of enough plus a little to spare."
    • "The liver plays a special role in Cu homeostasis as the organ through which most Cu is excreted from the body and the organ taking up the largest part of Cu after its absorption from the intestine. Liver Cu levels fall more rapidly than the levels of Cu in other organs during Cu deficiency, which suggests that part of the Cu in the liver is available as a store for other organs."
    • "Ceruloplasmin is an acute-phase responsive protein. Consequently, levels are altered by a variety of intercurrent factors. Its production is stimulated by estrogens (31). Levels are higher in adult females than males, vary during the menstrual cycle, and are greatly elevated during pregnancy (31)."
    • "Poorly cross-linked collagen is broken down more rapidly than normal collagen. Some of the breakdown products of collagen are unique (e.g. hydroxylysine) and can be measured in urine. Quantitation of these compounds may provide a useful indicator of Cu deficiency."
    • "Information available about adult human Cu requirements has been reviewed repeatedly (58, 78, 102). Many balance studies in healthy adults have shown losses of 1.5-2.0 mg per day, mostly in the stools. Therefore intakes of at least 2.0 mg per day have been recommended. A number of nutritional surveys have shown intakes of less than 1.0 mg, which suggests that mild Cu deficiency is very common, or else the requirement stated is overly generous for most people (78)."
    • "Foods with high copper content include animal livers and shellfish, but the principal contributors in an average diet are potatoes, fruit, bread, meats, fish, and legumes (78). Cow's milk and dairy products contain little Cu and that present is poorly absorbable, apparently because it is bound to casein (11). Although the Cu content in human milk is only a little higher than that of cow's milk, the Cu present is well absorbed, most of it being found in the whey (11)."
    • "There is clearly a complex interrelationship between the intake of Cu, of Zn, and the growth rate: a high growth rate or high Zn intake increased the requirement for Cu."
    • "Protein and dietary fiber content appear to diminish the availability of Cu (78). High dietary intake of ascorbic acid has also been shown to lower serum ceruloplasmin and Cu levels (27). A number of studies have examined the interrelationship between fructose and Cu status. The consensus is that fructose increases the requirement for Cu, rather than interfering with its absorption. Red cell superoxide dismutase activity was significantly reduced by the high fructose intake, whereas ceruloplasmin levels and serum Cu were not decreased (76)."
     
  2. ecstatichamster

    ecstatichamster Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2015
    Messages:
    7,583
    if you consume reasonable amounts of gelatin, you are probably getting enough copper, yes?

    Thanks for this!
     
  3. Giraffe

    Giraffe Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2015
    Messages:
    2,736
    I checked different databases, and the values stated for copper ranged from 0.05 to 2.16 mg copper per 100 g gelatin, Greatlakes gelatin being somewhere inbetween with 0.3 mg copper per 100 g gelatin.
     
  4. JackHanma

    JackHanma Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2016
    Messages:
    312
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Canada
    Too much sulfur causes copper deficiency:
    Studies of a naturally occurring sulfur-induced copper deficiency in Przewalski’s gazelles

    Garlic, onions and eggs are the worst. Sulfites contribute too. You will know you have way too much sulfur (or improperly metabolized sulfur) when your pee smells like sulfur and people say you smell like eggs.
    To process sulfur molybdenum and vitamin b6 come up. Salt apparently increases sulfur, with copper, calcium and potassium antagonizing it along with "vitamin b15". ( Selenium Sulfur DRI/RDA, benefits, side effects, overdose, toxicity, requirements )

    So those with copper deficiency may be having too much sulfur in their diet. Wines, dried fruits have sulfites added and so on.

    Salicylates can hinder the pst pathway and thus interfere with metabolism of sulfur. Coconut oil and aspirin are high sources of salicylates. ( a list of foods http://atpscience.com/salicylate-foods-sensitivity-intolerances-and-food-list/ )

    Thus consuming too many salicylates with your sulfur may interfere with proper metabolism of sulfur, thereby causing elevated levels that hinder copper absorption.

    Excessive sulfur also can induce a selenium deficiency, which is necessary for thyroid function.
    High caffeine is touted to interfere with the body utilizing vitamin b6, which is needed for sulfur metabolism.

    Thus say a high coffee diet with coconut oil and too many eggs with too many dried fruits could induce excessive sulfur leading to these mineral deficiencies.

    I am researching this for myself, as I noted extraordinarily negative effects from consuming raw garlic (2 cloves a day) Mind you large quantities of eggs are a staple in my diet, as is coconut oil.

    So much to research.
     
  5. OP
    Amazoniac

    Amazoniac Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2014
    Messages:
    7,441
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Not Uganda
    MULTIPLE SCLEROSIS AND OTHER HORMONE-RELATED BRAIN SYNDROMES.
    "Nutritional supplements that might help to prevent or correct these brain syndromes include: Vitamin E and coconut oil; vitamin A; magnesium, sodium; thyroid which includes T3; large amounts of animal protein, especially eggs; sulfur, such as magnesium sulfate or flowers of sulfur, but not to take continuously, because of sulfur's interference with copper absorption; pregnenolone; progesterone if needed."
     
  6. bzmazu

    bzmazu Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2015
    Messages:
    1,297
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Corozal, Belize
    thanks for all the research...too much of anything causes problems
     
  7. OP
    Amazoniac

    Amazoniac Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2014
    Messages:
    7,441
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Not Uganda
    Jack, they have plenty of copper and selenium, just like many of the foods that are good sources of sulfur. Most of the problems come from supplements. As a Belieber myself I have to never say never, but it's unlikely that it was something related to sulfur depleting copper.
    Check this website:
    Food Data Chart - Sulphur
    Epsom salt is about 10% Mg and 13% S. If you take 400mg of, well, Mg, then you're getting 520mg of S. Way more than the majority of foods listed, and isolated.
     
  8. JackHanma

    JackHanma Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2016
    Messages:
    312
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Canada
    Garlic has an ok source of copper and selenium. However it all depends on how sulfur effects the absorption and to what ratio. Raw garlic has an incredible amount of sulfur, vs cooking it. Thus I am inclined to believe the copper and selenium found in raw garlic is not enough to counter the large amount of sulfur.

    The secondary issue is if the body cannot process sulfur properly, this could cause excessive sulfur, thereby increasing its effects at lowering copper and selenium.
    Since my pee reeks of sulfur, I conclude that an excess of sulfur is the case, thereby the likelihood of low copper and selenium are high.

    After consuming 2 cloves of raw garlic many days in a row I started to get tingling in the back of my hands, which spread to my forearms and calves. I have never experienced this before. My body temperature has also gone down and I experience cold hands and feet, which never has occurred before. Selenium is necessary for proper thyroid function and same with enough copper, so even more reason to speculate.
     
  9. OP
    Amazoniac

    Amazoniac Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2014
    Messages:
    7,441
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Not Uganda
    Anything that irritates the intestines or is harsh (such as raw garlic) has the potential to alter things that are excreted through feces, urine, sweat and breath. If some noxious compounds are generated in the intestines and absorbed, they have to be detoxified by the liver, sometimes requiring sulfates, which will increase sulfur in your urine. It doesn't need to involve depletion of copper and selenium.
    Garlic Antimicrobial Effects Were More Permanent And Irresistible When Compared To Tetracycline
     
  10. Dragon

    Dragon Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    Messages:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    On The Beach...in Mexico
    wow....GREAT job of extracting highpoints. a lot of work too. mucho gracias!

    I thought I already 'knew' copper....but I did not know of protein reducing availability (absorption?) of copper. That calls into question the estimates of intake from almost all the alleged 'best' sources...e.g. shellfish, meat, liver. huh...
     
  11. aliciahere

    aliciahere Member

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2015
    Messages:
    62
    Hmmm, I know a few "health" places that are recommending copper drinking cups and water bottles. I wonder if they would provide the right type of copper, and not to much.
     
  12. OP
    Amazoniac

    Amazoniac Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2014
    Messages:
    7,441
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Not Uganda
  13. Luann

    Luann Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2016
    Messages:
    1,317
    Gender:
    Female
    I looked but wasnt able to find studies that showed that sulfur caused low copper in humans. Sheep, gazelle, cattle, and goat yes. Is there a reason to believe this applies to people too?

    Theres a rat study that touches on this, Whanger '70: silver cadmium molybdenum and zinc all reduce useful copper more than sulfate. At 10000 ppm, sulfate antagonized a copper intake of 6 ppm. If you assume a human system is more like a rat than like a grass eater, then it would be very hard for a person to reach a sulfur intake that would affect copper use.
     
  14. robknob

    robknob Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2016
    Messages:
    384
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    St Louis
    Sounds like supplementing with a safe form of copper can knock multiple birds out with one stone...

    1: Achieve high copper stores/ high respiratory enzymes
    2: Reduce damage done by iron
    3: Stimulate your body's natural heavy metal detox mechanism
     
  15. Luann

    Luann Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2016
    Messages:
    1,317
    Gender:
    Female
  16. yerrag

    yerrag Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2016
    Messages:
    5,283
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Manila
    Glad for the posting. I'm taking a large daily amount of raw garlic at 3 x 15 grams daily, in my attempt to detox lead from my kidney. This may have the side effect of reducing copper. So I have to make a point of taking more food rich in copper. I eat goat liver with an effort to not overdo it. But while I'm taking the garlic at this quantity, I may have to increase my consumption of liver. I'll also add shrimp, but I think wild-caught shrimp is better, as I doubt the nutrient quality of farm-raised shrimp.
     
  17. Frankdee20

    Frankdee20 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2017
    Messages:
    2,698
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Intensive Case Manager
    Location:
    Sun Coast, USA
    Jack, what do you think of sulfide hydroxyl ions in garlic penetrating the blood brain barrier? They've been blamed for causing the mind to be out of sync, so to speak. I avoid garlic like the plague, as it seems to really throw my awareness off. I never knew the connection before, but seems like onions don't do this to me. Dr. Robert C. Beck was the one who spoke about this, how garlic can elicit noticeable changes on an EEG. Sorry people if I should be on a different thread with this topic, but it relates to sulfur.
     
  18. Ella

    Ella Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2012
    Messages:
    646
    Thank you @Amazoniac for your efforts on posting and reinforcing the importance of copper. Zinc and copper are pairs and we can't think of one without the other. Those individuals that have a penchant for supplementing zinc need to read the following paper recently published. It reinforces the man knows ***t about the human body and the body has an intelligence infinitely beyond ours. Foods that provide zinc and copper with other nutrient cofactors are the safest. Supplementing isolated minerals that are contaminated with heavy metals and industrial chemicals; not so smart. The body tightly regulates these rxns.

    The Functions of Metamorphic Metallothioneins in Zinc and Copper Metabolism
     
  19. OP
    Amazoniac

    Amazoniac Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2014
    Messages:
    7,441
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Not Uganda
    Chromium Copper DRI/RDA, benefits, side effects, overdose, toxicity, requirements,

    "Of thousands of patients tested since the mid 1970s from different continents around the world, nearly 90% exhibited a chemical profile that in addition to their own unique chemistry, contained an underlying pattern that reflected the impact of elevated copper levels on various opposing nutrients, which include Vitamin C, chromium, sulfur, nickel, molybdenum, and hesperidin, an essential flavonoid, among others.
    There are other copper antagonists such as zinc, however while zinc is generally documented as such in the nutritional literature, it is not only the weakest of all copper antagonists, but its action on copper takes place only on an intestinal level, so once copper goes into storage, zinc will have no effect on lowering copper any longer. The only time zinc could become a threat to copper is in situations where either copper levels are already on the low side and high amounts of zinc are ingested, or when potassium and calcium - being "synergistic allies" to copper - are well below normal."

    "copper (or calcium) [becomes] more bioavailable by supplementing the proper co-factors, with the best choice being those whose levels are lowest ratio-wise to copper - and as mentioned above - may include Vitamin C, chromium, sulfur (MSM), molybdenum, nickel, or (rarely) zinc. The avoidance of foods high in copper is important as well."

    "Chromium has to be considered first when trying to normalize copper, since it is its associated trace element."
    "Following a close second is Sulfur"

    "Copper works synergistically with potassium and calcium, so when patients do exhibit low copper levels, then calcium and potassium are frequently on the low side as well. Supplementing 3 mg of copper for one to two weeks, or less, is all that is needed for an adult to normalize any copper deficiency, but then it should be discontinued or reduced, otherwise copper may go too high."
     
  20. JackHanma

    JackHanma Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2016
    Messages:
    312
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Canada
    Interesting, could be an explaination. I havn't had garlic in a long while since the bad reactions and same as you I've always had better results with onions. Never-ending variables.

    I also remembered that Ray cautions not to have flowers of sulphur for extended periods because it depletes copper.
     
Loading...