Does Coffee Inhibit B1 Absorption?

youngsinatra

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I've read multiple times that compounds in coffee can inhibit thiamin absorption. I am wondering if it inhibits it completely or just partly?

I like taking 200mg of thiamin HCL with my meals and I really love a good espresso or two after some meals. I am wondering if it has any real effect when combined with coffee or does it render it useless? Does anyone of you have experience with it?

@Hans @Razvan @haidut
 

Bart1

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I've read multiple times that compounds in coffee can inhibit thiamin absorption. I am wondering if it inhibits it completely or just partly?

I like taking 200mg of thiamin HCL with my meals and I really love a good espresso or two after some meals. I am wondering if it has any real effect when combined with coffee or does it render it useless? Does anyone of you have experience with it?

@Hans @Razvan @haidut
Here is a post from Dr Lonsdale after someone asking if coffee blocks thiamin:

Lonsdale:
I don ‘t know where you got that info. We know that coffee CONSUMES energy while thiamine stimulates energy PRODUCTION. There is therefore a theoretical possibility that one cancels out the other——but that is not a block.

-------
However there are other sources claiming it inhibits absorption indeed, see also this study:

 

Giraffe

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related thread:

 
P

Peatness

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It does lower the circulating b vitamins simply by causing it's excretion. However. if coffee completely blocked thiamine absorption Dr Peat would be crippled by now. It's my understanding that he drinks copious amount of coffee daily.


This is from my notes but I don't have the source of the info

Ascorbic acid, tartaric acid, and citric acid, all present in many vegetables and fruits, are said to lower such precipitation and increase thiamine bioavailability.

• delay the consumption of tea or other tannin-containing products after a meal;
• consume foods high in ascorbic acid along with the meals;
• heat products containing thiaminase before consumption.
 
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Hans

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I've read multiple times that compounds in coffee can inhibit thiamin absorption. I am wondering if it inhibits it completely or just partly?

I like taking 200mg of thiamin HCL with my meals and I really love a good espresso or two after some meals. I am wondering if it has any real effect when combined with coffee or does it render it useless? Does anyone of you have experience with it?

@Hans @Razvan @haidut
Coffee contains thiaminase, which breaks thiamine down into metabolites. But there is obviously a spectrum. Coffee is the most consumed beverage on the planet and a lot of people have a B1 deficiency, but that's because they eat a low B1 diet in the first place. I'd like to see a percentage breakdown of B1 by 1 cup of coffee and then 2 cups and so on. But thiamine is intracellular, so people might have low B1 in the blood, but ample in the cell, so that's hard to test. I'm sure if you combine high vitamin B1 foods, such as OJ with coffee, you're much less likely to get a deficiency. Coffee has been shown to be beneficial in almost all regards, so if it depleted B1, it should be causing disease.
But let's say having a cup of coffee with 200mg thiamine, how much is being broken down? 0.1mg, 1mg, 5mg?
 

schultz

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The evidence seems scant.

I won't worry about it until I see some good evidence (like with coffee and iron).
 
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youngsinatra

youngsinatra

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Coffee contains thiaminase, which breaks thiamine down into metabolites. But there is obviously a spectrum. Coffee is the most consumed beverage on the planet and a lot of people have a B1 deficiency, but that's because they eat a low B1 diet in the first place. I'd like to see a percentage breakdown of B1 by 1 cup of coffee and then 2 cups and so on. But thiamine is intracellular, so people might have low B1 in the blood, but ample in the cell, so that's hard to test. I'm sure if you combine high vitamin B1 foods, such as OJ with coffee, you're much less likely to get a deficiency. Coffee has been shown to be beneficial in almost all regards, so if it depleted B1, it should be causing disease.
But let's say having a cup of coffee with 200mg thiamine, how much is being broken down? 0.1mg, 1mg, 5mg?
Thanks a lot, Hans. Really appreciated your response.
 
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Coffee contains thiaminase, which breaks thiamine down into metabolites. But there is obviously a spectrum. Coffee is the most consumed beverage on the planet and a lot of people have a B1 deficiency, but that's because they eat a low B1 diet in the first place. I'd like to see a percentage breakdown of B1 by 1 cup of coffee and then 2 cups and so on. But thiamine is intracellular, so people might have low B1 in the blood, but ample in the cell, so that's hard to test. I'm sure if you combine high vitamin B1 foods, such as OJ with coffee, you're much less likely to get a deficiency. Coffee has been shown to be beneficial in almost all regards, so if it depleted B1, it should be causing disease.
But let's say having a cup of coffee with 200mg thiamine, how much is being broken down? 0.1mg, 1mg, 5mg?
Are the breakdown metabolites useful at least? Or does Thiaminase render Thiamine useless as a whole?
 

Hans

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Are the breakdown metabolites useful at least? Or does Thiaminase render Thiamine useless as a whole?
Honestly I have no idea. They can definitely not substitute for B1 in a way.
 

Apple

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It does lower the circulating b vitamins simply by causing it's excretion. However. if coffee completely blocked thiamine absorption Dr Peat would be crippled by now. It's my understanding that he drinks copious amount of coffee daily.
The evidence seems scant.
I won't worry about it until I see some good evidence (like with coffee and iron).
I've read multiple times that compounds in coffee can inhibit thiamin absorption. I am wondering if it inhibits it completely or just partly?

RP drinks copious amount of coffee...
It is known that thiamine defciency causes stuttering through damaging nerve cells and pretty often high dose of thiamine is used to fix it.
I don't know, maybe that would explain Ray Peat's stuttering caused by thiamine defciency due to coffee ?

He reminds me a lot of one old person I knew who drank alcohol a lot. (alcohol depletes thiamine) . He was also a big milk drinker when sober. He made it to 78yo, but he had absolutely same voice (and the stuttering issue in old age) as Ray Peat has , despite different language.
 
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