Coffee Inhibits Cortisol Synthesis

[tomisonbottom]

Tolerance. Also, I haven't been eating enough. (I need around 6,000-8,000 calories to feel good.) I was eating around 3,000.

I might try coffee further down the road, but I have plenty of energy.

So how many calories do you eat now? Have you always needed to eat that much?
Is that a hypo issue?

 

[DaveFoster]

So how many calories do you eat now? Have you always needed to eat that much?
Is that a hypo issue?

I eat around 3-5000/day; it's probably a hypothyroid issue, yes. As my thyroid and androgen production is improving, I'm subsisting on less and feeling better.

 

[DaveFoster]

I think niacin could very well be that agent. In animal and human studies it was found that niacin made them sleepy and the dose was low enough so the benzodiazepine effects of niacinamide are probably not involved. Lowering cortisol tends to make people sleepy so if niacin causing sleepiness could very well be from lowered cortisol. I am going to write to the fellow countrymen who wrote the study and ask what they think this magic compound is.

Did you ever find out what the compound was from your comrades?

 

[haidut]

Did you ever find out what the compound was from your comrades?

They said they don't know as they did not do follow up work on this but they think it was probably chlorogenic acid.

 

[Constatine]

So much goodness in one delicious cup. I wasn't aware that caffeine or rather coffee lowered cortisol. Does this mean coffee is potentially anabolic as it increases androgens and decreases cortisol, or are there other factors at play here?

 

[haidut]

So much goodness in one delicious cup. I wasn't aware that caffeine or rather coffee lowered cortisol. Does this mean coffee is potentially anabolic as it increases androgens and decreases cortisol, or are there other factors at play here?

Yep, it is not a coincidence that men who drink coffee regularly have T levels in the upper 30% of their age-range.

 

[schultz]

Yep, it is not a coincidence that men who drink coffee regularly have T levels in the upper 30% of their age-range.

and yet people love to hate on coffee. Not sure what that's about since the evidence is in favor of coffee. People are weird.



Other things people hate on for some reason... aspirin, sugar, sat. fat, DHT.

 

[milk_lover]

and yet people love to hate on coffee. Not sure what that's about since the evidence is in favor of coffee. People are weird.



Other things people hate on for some reason... aspirin, sugar, sat. fat, DHT.

maybe the establishment is trying to weaken the population so they have better control over them... I don't believe it's pure mistakes or ignorance.

 

[Peater Piper]

and yet people love to hate on coffee. Not sure what that's about since the evidence is in favor of coffee. People are weird.



Other things people hate on for some reason... aspirin, sugar, sat. fat, DHT.

It might be that coffee has been associated with other unhealthy behaviors, or at least perceived unhealthy behaviors. I think people are coming around to it now that the benefits are becoming apparent.

 

[docall18]

When I started coffee, I was getting the often noted jittery effects from it. I had presumed it was a poor liver or high PUFA issue.

However I realised that it was from high adrenaline. The coffee lowered cortisol, leaving adrenaline to fill in.

After trying niacinamide, coconut, vit E, aspirin etc. the thing that allowed for almost immediate tolerance of high coffee/caffeine consumption was P5P B6.

The P5P B6 really prevents any adrenaline jitters from even 2g+ daily doses of caffeine in coffee.

 

[tara]

and yet people love to hate on coffee. Not sure what that's about since the evidence is in favor of coffee. People are weird.

Or could be that coffee serves some people well, but others not so well, so you can find both sets of effects.

 

[DaveFoster]

They said they don't know as they did not do follow up work on this but they think it was probably chlorogenic acid.

Interesting; thanks for the reply. I recall you posting that chlorogenic raises stomach acid production as well, so this might be involved in superior protein absorption, and thus less need for cortisol. Just some thoughts.

 

[ddjd]

So, you're saying that caffeine does not contain this inhibitor of 11-beta-HSD1.

this study shows that caffeine actually reduces expression of 11β-HSD2. This is the enzyme that turns cortisol to cortisone. So slightly conflicting info for OP.

Caffeine Reduces 11β-Hydroxysteroid Dehydrogenase Type 2 Expression in Human Trophoblast Cells through the Adenosine A2B Receptor

 

[DaveFoster]

this study shows that caffeine actually reduces expression of 11β-HSD2. This is the enzyme that turns cortisol to cortisone. So slightly conflicting info for OP.

Caffeine Reduces 11β-Hydroxysteroid Dehydrogenase Type 2 Expression in Human Trophoblast Cells through the Adenosine A2B Receptor

Thank you for the study. I looked over it briefly and will add it into my notes. I do remember Dr. Peat mentioning that retardation of fetal growth could be reversed by administering sugar, specifically sucrose or table sugar if I recall.

 

[success23]

I personally think that coffee on an empty stomach lead to a drop in blood sugar and that leads to a stress reaction.
I have those episodes even with decaff coffee and i am pretty sure its the chlorogenic acid's blood sugar lowering effect.

Effect of green coffee bean extract and chlorogenic acid consumption on 11[beta]HSD activity in humans and mice | SFEBES2009

Also this study shows that chlorogenic acid is lowering cortisol. Maybe they are working together with caffeine.

Tell me if i got something wrong.

 

[Dave Clark]

I personally think that coffee on an empty stomach lead to a drop in blood sugar and that leads to a stress reaction.
I have those episodes even with decaff coffee and i am pretty sure its the chlorogenic acid's blood sugar lowering effect.

Effect of green coffee bean extract and chlorogenic acid consumption on 11[beta]HSD activity in humans and mice | SFEBES2009

Also this study shows that chlorogenic acid is lowering cortisol. Maybe they are working together with caffeine.

Tell me if i got something wrong.

I know before I learned the Peat theories on sugar, I bought into the 'no sugar' thing, and when I would drink my coffee (if I wanted sugar in it) I would put in an artificial sweetener. Invariably, I would get a low blood sugar crash, which I thought was the caffeine working on my nerves. Since I started putting a bit of coconut sugar in my coffee I haven't had that problem at all. It is still hard to believe that all I needed was some sugar, but because I had adrenal/thyroid issues, that was what helped. I also took Peat's advice to use some juice before bed, and that helped with any low blood sugar during the night.

 

[ddjd]

When I started coffee, I was getting the often noted jittery effects from it. I had presumed it was a poor liver or high PUFA issue.

However I realised that it was from high adrenaline. The coffee lowered cortisol, leaving adrenaline to fill in.

After trying niacinamide, coconut, vit E, aspirin etc. the thing that allowed for almost immediate tolerance of high coffee/caffeine consumption was P5P B6.

The P5P B6 really prevents any adrenaline jitters from even 2g+ daily doses of caffeine in coffee.

thanks for this info, I'm going to try this because I think I possibly have naturally low cortisol levels and ive noticed a strong adrenaline reaction when I drink coffee.
I wonder if people with already low cortisol levels would perhaps suffer from an even higher adrenaline increase after drinking coffee

 

[Dave Clark]

thanks for this info, I'm going to try this because I think I possibly have naturally low cortisol levels and ive noticed a strong adrenaline reaction when I drink coffee.
I wonder if people with already low cortisol levels would perhaps suffer from an even higher adrenaline increase after drinking coffee

Give inosine a try to lower the adrenaline. I believe I have heard Peat say that your adrenals won't straighten out until your thyroid is functioning properly. Maybe this could be the root cause, but most people try to address adrenals first because that is the popular assumption.

 

[redsun]

thanks for this info, I'm going to try this because I think I possibly have naturally low cortisol levels and ive noticed a strong adrenaline reaction when I drink coffee.
I wonder if people with already low cortisol levels would perhaps suffer from an even higher adrenaline increase after drinking coffee

You wouldn't "suffer" really, it would help energy but it wouldnt be the optimal type of energy. So you would suffer in the sense that you will be energized on extra adrenaline beyond what you normally have, so the adrenaline symptoms just amplify.

I think the pro-dopaminergic and histaminergic effects of active P5P help oppose excess adrenaline.

 

[Antonello]

You actually raise an interesting point. Given that T3 activity and entry into the cell can get inhibited by PUFA, it would help to take T3 with something that can get it inside the cell even in conditions of high PUFA. Caffeine (and especially its metabolite theacrine) increases cellular entry of pretty much any lipophillic chemical that is having trouble getting inside the cell. So, it seems that taking T3 with small dose of caffeine (as little as 50mg can work) can help bypass the inhibition of T3 entry into the cell by PUFA. See below study for more info on caffeine and thearcine increasing intracellular bioavailability of various compounds.
1,3,7,9-tetramethyluric acid--a chromosome-damaging agent occurring as a natural metabolite in certain caffeine-producing plants. - PubMed - NCBI
This is actually one of the reasons for my product Oxidal containing caffeine. Methylene blue can also have trouble entering the cell when FFA are high, so a little caffeine helps it get inside and do its good.
Finally, given that magnesium entry into the cell depends on proper ATP production (as magnesium floats around as MgATP complex) taking magnesium with caffeine can increase cellular uptake of magnesium as well. I have sort of confirmed that this works as taking 1g magnesium on its own can give me liquid stools, but taking the same amount with 200mg caffeine never produces these effects.

Do you know any other substances with the characteristic of increase cellular entry?