Why Does Starch Make Me Extremely Sick?

[PeatThemAll]

Theres more sugar in sugar than in starch... why are you guys doing this?

Man, the day I find what's in starches that's not in fruit or sucrose (glucose+fructose, commercial 'sugar')...

It's not just glucose. Tried the pure glucose powder. Tried glucotabs. Something's missing. Something addictively satisfying. Must be some kind of opioid trigger. Or some mineral. Or maybe it's simply a persorption 'hit' thing.

 

[Such_Saturation]

Man, the day I find what's in starches that's not in fruit or sucrose (glucose+fructose, commercial 'sugar')...

It's not just glucose. Tried the pure glucose powder. Tried glucotabs. Something's missing. Something addictively satisfying. Must be some kind of opioid trigger. Or some mineral. Or maybe it's simply a persorption 'hit' thing.

I'm saying you can get x calories much more easily with sugars... don't let a food that you don't agree with ruin your low fat experiment, especially since anything less that a ton of carbs and you will feel cold. And you'll blame it on the lack of fat. Which isn't wrong technically, but you know. We want our experiments to be successful.

 

[Ewelina]

Hi all, I felt I should come back and update this thread since I ultimately wound up abandoning my starch/no fat project. Around the time of my last post my anxiety kept ramping up to an unacceptable level, the scary pancreatic/lower left side pain went from sporadic to constant (echoes the experience of @lindsay perhaps) and ultimately the initial benefits evaporated anyway. The last month or so i've been eating basically lowish carb which is what I used to do before Peat except now I know to specifically avoid PUFA and gluten and it's been going much better than anything I've tried. I simply apply the principles of sticking to animal fats and I get like 100 carbs a day from sugars, kinda following the logic of Paul Jaminet. Things aren't perfect but I plan on sticking with this indefinitely as my mental health and energy levels have been very good.

I don't know how I've missed your update!
I also had to stop my lowish fat and starch experiment. After a month or so I started getting very swollen and painful knees, which are a symptom of endotoxins and most likely leaky gut. It was unfortunate as my skin looked a bit better. Now I'm on a strictly no starch diet with moderate amount of fat. Knees are fine now, though.

 

[raypeatclips]

@artist @Ewelina You guys that had issues with no fat/yes starch, have you tried starch with moderate/high fat at all? I had horrific anxiety doing low fat starch, lower abdominal pains etc. Vast improvements now by eating more fat and more vegetables, but still eating starch as before.

 

[Ewelina]

Yep, I always had lots of fat with starch before my low fat experiment. Unfortunately, even then it gave me digestive issues, bloat, and anxiety. This was the main reason I tried starch with lower fat as some people had success with this approach. Additionally, I wanted to go low fat to improve my glucose oxidation. Either way, starch doesn't work for me at the moment.

 

[Syncopated]

I have read Peat's articles and generally understand the logic behind his recommendation against starch, and I'm grateful for it - without Peat I would have continued thinking "carbs" in general make me sick, never realizing I can consume sugars without negative consequences.

When I eat a lot of starch on a daily basis, and I've experimented with many gluten-free varieties of starch (I still keep it low PUFA and mostly low fat, and I've played with whole and refined rice/corn, pasta, crackers, potatoes, starchy soups, legumes), within a week:

- I become extremely depressed to the point of suicidal thoughts, thinking that everyone I know hates me, general obsessive tendencies, overwhelming brain fog
- I slowly start to develop clogged pores and greasy skin and finally hormonal acne all along my jawline
- My face becomes puffy, eyes look sickly
- I start to require literally 12-14 hours of sleep per night, and feel hungover every morning, body feels heavy, nothing seems appealing but sleep and internet
- If I keep it up for more than a week I start to pile on weight (visibly, as I don't weigh myself) that I'm guessing is a mixture of fat and water retention

I could go on but you get the gist. Even moderate amounts of starch seem to lead me down this road, especially if I have several servings spread out over the week, I understand that starch may or may not be a part of an "optimal" diet but I would love to be able to eat it sometimes like a normal person. Without it I am a fairly high functioning person with good relationships and creativity and semi-decent energy levels so it is never worth it to go down the starch path for me.

Do other people here have the same experience with starch or have any ideas about why it can have such a profound effect?

Stick with potatoes and forget the rest if you eat starch. Peat once quoted a tribe who ate potatoes all year round then would have a week long pork feast otherwise.

 

[RobinH]

I know this is an old post, but it's so interesting to me. I've had issues with high starch diets myself (including zero fat diets, which is really the only context where I allow myself to eat a ton of starches). I've been trying to figure out why I swell up in areas, especially around the face and eyes, to the point of looking deformed--which I do right now . I always thought it was because I end up feeling great with lots of energy at first, so I go off my thyroid medication. Then I become convinced that the puffy eyes are a sign of hypothyroid. Now I think that isn't the case. I also suspect it's because of lack of protein, since I'm usually doing a plant-based McDougall type thing when I experiment with high starch. But I'm not convinced of that either. I think it may very well be related to endotoxins, which really annoys me, because it means I still have more gut issues than I thought. It's interesting that the full GAPS diet--which is specifically designed to kill off the bad bugs-- is fruit, honey, animal protein and fat, but no starch. I'm always looking for diets where I can minimize animal products, because the clean, humane versions are hard to find and very expensive. Starches are so tempting, because even organic versions are inexpensive, easy to store, easy to purchase, satisfying, makes sharing meals with other people easy, etc. This is beyond annoying. Even fruit is way more expensive and inconvenient. Artist and Ewelina, if you're around, are you still eating fruit and protein/fat for the most part? Is that solving most of your problems? I need to find something that works for me, so I can focus on the rest of my life for a second and not just my stupid diet.

 

[RobinH]

The other thing that's driving me nuts is that I'm about to go to Italy and France for a month, so either I'm just going to eat whatever and feel like crap until I come home, or I'll just be impossible to eat with, and my poor boyfriend will regret ever agreeing to this trip with me. I'll probably just alternate between option 1 and 2. Surely not eating starch in Italy is only for the most profoundly neurotic, orthorexic types.

 

[jet9]

I have read Peat's articles and generally understand the logic behind his recommendation against starch, and I'm grateful for it - without Peat I would have continued thinking "carbs" in general make me sick, never realizing I can consume sugars without negative consequences.

When I eat a lot of starch on a daily basis, and I've experimented with many gluten-free varieties of starch (I still keep it low PUFA and mostly low fat, and I've played with whole and refined rice/corn, pasta, crackers, potatoes, starchy soups, legumes), within a week:

- I become extremely depressed to the point of suicidal thoughts, thinking that everyone I know hates me, general obsessive tendencies, overwhelming brain fog
- I slowly start to develop clogged pores and greasy skin and finally hormonal acne all along my jawline
- My face becomes puffy, eyes look sickly
- I start to require literally 12-14 hours of sleep per night, and feel hungover every morning, body feels heavy, nothing seems appealing but sleep and internet
- If I keep it up for more than a week I start to pile on weight (visibly, as I don't weigh myself) that I'm guessing is a mixture of fat and water retention

I could go on but you get the gist. Even moderate amounts of starch seem to lead me down this road, especially if I have several servings spread out over the week, I understand that starch may or may not be a part of an "optimal" diet but I would love to be able to eat it sometimes like a normal person. Without it I am a fairly high functioning person with good relationships and creativity and semi-decent energy levels so it is never worth it to go down the starch path for me.

Do other people here have the same experience with starch or have any ideas about why it can have such a profound effect?

artist hi, sometimes starch work good for me, but often i am too getting most of the symptoms you've described.

Could you post how your diet looks like now? What foods are your staples?

p.s. by starch i mean regular potatoes and sweet potatoes (i don't touch any grains cause i can 't handle them at all)

 

[benaoao]

The other thing that's driving me nuts is that I'm about to go to Italy and France for a month, so either I'm just going to eat whatever and feel like crap until I come home, or I'll just be impossible to eat with, and my poor boyfriend will regret ever agreeing to this trip with me. I'll probably just alternate between option 1 and 2. Surely not eating starch in Italy is only for the most profoundly neurotic, orthorexic types.

I’m currently in France and you’ll have all the regular food choices found in North America. Same thing in italy. Most people do meet the cliche of a baguette eater + pasta + cigarette + high fat dairy. That’s for France.

When you go to Italy you’ll be surprised to see that their cuisine is far from starch starch starch pasta pizza. Of course they have it but they also have amazing gelato, seafood, vegetables.

Anyhow you won’t have any issue finding lots of fruits, juices, yams avocados cocoa coconut milk...

There’s no grass fed label tho, and wild caught salmon is absurdly expensive.

I think people who have issues with starch have issues with insulin and serotonin which is perfectly fine. In that case go for smaller portions (reduces load) if unavoidable and reduce the insulin spike: fruit or fatty appetizer then carbs.

 

[artist]

artist hi, sometimes starch work good for me, but often i am too getting most of the symptoms you've described.

Could you post how your diet looks like now? What foods are your staples?

p.s. by starch i mean regular potatoes and sweet potatoes (i don't touch any grains cause i can 't handle them at all)

jet9 -- I am still working out a diet that can be sustainable for me. I've oscillated a lot between essentially a lower carb starch-free diet and a higher carb starchy diet that includes things like white rice and potatoes. High sugar diets don't work well for me, because I need a lot of sodium to feel normal, and I'm intolerant to most fruits/juices. Over time I've started to feel that including the safer starches was giving me less severe symptoms than going low carb, as I get very depressed and strong estrogen symptoms getting most of my cals from fat. The only other alternative, high sugar, worsens my allergies and anxiety. Starch still gives me most of the issues I mentioned in this thread but I do think oregano oil over time has lessened the severity of these symptoms. I was actually about to start logging something that has been working for me the last 4 days which is getting a tablespoon of baking soda a day. It could be that either the sodium or CO2 has been the missing piece for me but I don't want to make any grand claims until I've been doing this for a month or two.

 

[tara]

I was actually about to start logging something that has been working for me the last 4 days which is getting a tablespoon of baking soda a day.

I think if I were taking in that much baking soda I'd consider finding a way to regularly monitor to avoid getting systemically too alkali. Possibly monitoring UpH would do it. Have you seen the threads from the people here who got into serious trouble with milk-alkali syndrome - I think by supplementing too much baking soda and calcium?

 

[artist]

I think if I were taking in that much baking soda I'd consider finding a way to regularly monitor to avoid getting systemically too alkali. Possibly monitoring UpH would do it. Have you seen the threads from the people here who got into serious trouble with milk-alkali syndrome - I think by supplementing too much baking soda and calcium?

Thank you for the warning. I should research that syndrome more but it probably helps that A. I consume almost no dairy or calcium-rich foods at the moment B. I mix it with a lot of ACV. I also take it spaced out in 1 tsp doses.

 

[jet9]

jet9 -- I am still working out a diet that can be sustainable for me. I've oscillated a lot between essentially a lower carb starch-free diet and a higher carb starchy diet that includes things like white rice and potatoes. High sugar diets don't work well for me, because I need a lot of sodium to feel normal, and I'm intolerant to most fruits/juices. Over time I've started to feel that including the safer starches was giving me less severe symptoms than going low carb, as I get very depressed and strong estrogen symptoms getting most of my cals from fat. The only other alternative, high sugar, worsens my allergies and anxiety. Starch still gives me most of the issues I mentioned in this thread but I do think oregano oil over time has lessened the severity of these symptoms. I was actually about to start logging something that has been working for me the last 4 days which is getting a tablespoon of baking soda a day. It could be that either the sodium or CO2 has been the missing piece for me but I don't want to make any grand claims until I've been doing this for a month or two.

I was handling fruits SUPER bad myself - check my post history. I don't know what happened - but now i feel very good eating them!
That's what i noticed:
1 To feel good on fruits i must eat only fruits and 0 starch (starches are not allowed), any time i start adding starches even in separate meals, fruits start to make me depressed/angry/anxious - not sure how it works...
2 I must eat most of the fruits in morning/day time - not evening. Some are ok in evening - but most of fruits should come before 4pm. (i was reading how chimpanzee eat fruit in the morning and leaves in the evening)
3 I like cooking fruits, like cooked apples.

I don't eat added sugar, nothing artificial - pretty much fruits, protein(meat/fish/chicken), some fat, some salt, some veggies and feel good. To fell asleep in the evening for my dinner meal i add fat(animal fat). Otherwise i can't sleep cause of too much energy.

Also i've used align probeotic for 2 days prior to positive change in fruit tolerance. But i don't think that this is the reason (i don't really believe in probeotics, and just tried it for 2 days - but was not happy with how i was feeling)