Fatigue, Chest Pressure & Pain for 1 year

[sodapopCroc]

Hello all,

I have been getting intense fatigue and chest pressure/pain for several months. It started as chest pressure when weaning off Thyroid.

I had started on T4 and T3 at 12.5mcg each, taken together with breakfast, in December 2021. I did not measure total cholesterol before starting. By February 2022 I began to notice a progressively accumulating fatigue which was worsened by adding T3 and seemed to get better by adding T4. This fatigue became debilitating by March 2022.

I had developed chronic diarrhea since the start of 2022. I got my blood drawn in February 2022 and my cholesterol was low - 146 mg/dL - possibly explaining why thyroid was not working for me.

I decided to wean off thyroid entirely, T3 first followed by T4. My teeth were chipping and I was experiencing chest pressure and immense fatigue. Due to these obstacles I had to wean off very gradually and was only able to get off thyroid completely, with a couple interspersed ER visits (feeling fatigued/horrible), by May 2022.

The chest pain returned when I tried about 15mg vitamin K over the course of a week in July 2022. The pain was intense, in my left pectoral, and aspirin brought instant relief. Vitamin D and aspirin helped for a couple weeks. When those stopped working, I panicked and went to the hospital, where after x rays, a CT scan, and a heart sonogram, they found nothing wrong, except iron deficiency for which I was recommended iron supplements. The diarrhea was still ongoing at this point.

In the beginning of November 2022 I tried progest-e which did not work well for me at all - I felt like I was suffocating and dying for 2-3 weeks. I have heard that this could be because I have too much goiter, which progest-e was rapidly reducing.

Towards the end of December 2022 I experienced, once, fluid collection at the bottom of my left foot. Since then there has been neuropathy when going on longer walks, and slight discomfort when wearing footwear with arch support.

Currently (February 2023), I find that the chest pain does not bother me too much in my day to day, although it can flare up a bit. My diarrhea is better following use of MegaSporeBiotic, and my total cholesterol is now ~200. Vitamin E (Tocovit) and Vitamin K (Thorne products) are, unfortunately, severe chest pain triggers. Caffiene (coffee/black tea) is a definite trigger.

I cannot tolerate vitamin D because of sharp pains it gives me behind my belly button. I also notice the same thing, to a milder degree, from time to time, with no vitamin D -- perhaps due to calcium intake.

I am focusing on keeping up my calcium, magnesium, and thiamine intake. I will soon be using Georgi's energin to help combat any thiamine deficiency/beriberi.

Attached are labwork screenshots from two blood draws.

Thank you for reading!

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

What made you start taking thyroid in the first place. I have never taken it. Were you in bad health?

 

[sodapopCroc]

What made you start taking thyroid in the first place. I have never taken it. Were you in bad health?

I was dealing with severe fatigue prior to taking thyroid, but once I dropped a lot of the fat in my diet (6 eggs to 2, whole milk to 1 percent) it lifted, in great part. Hidden gut problems of course remained.

I was intrested in seeing whether thyroid could make me feel even better. Of course there are those that implement it correctly, but boy do I regret it.

 

[exile]

You never mentioned your diet which always seems like the best place to start. This quote of Rays could be relevant at least based on what you presented thus far: “For many years, I have been seeing more symptoms relieved by stopping all the chemical supplements, than by using them.”

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

You never mentioned your diet which always seems like the best place to start. This quote of Rays could be relevant at least based on what you presented thus far: “For many years, I have been seeing more symptoms relieved by stopping all the chemical supplements, than by using them.”

I like this RP quote and am going to repost it!

 

[Mr Joe]

If scanner showed nothing it must be something else. Most of the time chest pain comes from endotoxin in the gut creating gas, or anxiety and decrease global CO2 levels and prevent relaxation of vessels. Vasoconstriction is present in hypothyroidsm, hyperventilation. Have you tried breathing bad exercice ? In most of the case it helps with hyperventilation and chest pain. Have checked your prolactin / acth levels ? Magnesium is a key as well

 

[Mr Joe]

If you are low in CO2 you will have a tendency to hyperventilate and thus trigger chest pain.

 

[exile]

I like this RP quote and am going to repost it!

Yeah i like it and it always stuck with me. Danny Roddy said something to me along the same lines, he told me the various supplements he used and then said he wouldn’t hesitate to stop all of them in a second if he was having a health problem and try to figure it out with diet.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Yeah i like it and it always stuck with me. Danny Roddy said something to me along the same lines, he told me the various supplements he used and then said he wouldn’t hesitate to stop all of them in a second if he was having a health problem and try to figure it out with diet.

That sounds so much more reasonable. Supplements in themselves are not consistent, like a brand of butter, it is going to be different in the summer than it is the winter according to what the cows are eating in that season. How many times people say in this forum they liked a brand of something until the product seem to change, and good for those people who can notice that. How many don’t notice the changes and blame things on something else because, “it’s not that because I have taken it for years.”

 

[Creative Nature]

Parts of your story resemble mine.

I developed bad B vitamin deficiencies (and possibly a magnesium deficiency) as a result of a combination of severe stress, demanding work, chronic diarrhea, excessive metabolic stimulation (thyroid, caffeine, table sugar), and insufficient dietary intake of B vitamins and magnesium to support my revved-up metabolism.

I believe that the B vitamin deficiencies (especially B1) caused massive GI dysfunction and alarming, daily chest pain. After 2+ years of feeling like I was going to die of a heart attack (despite normal EKGs and a normal heart scan), I figured out that much of my chest pain was due to substances that were irritating my stomach -- especially tocopherols (vitamin E) and MCT oil in supplements. Stopping oral vitamin D and E supplements (and some other oral supplements and irritating foods) and taking these vitamins transdermally instead eliminated around 90-95% of my chest pain and ended the worst period of my life. I believe that B vitamin deficiencies (especially B1 deficiency) were what made my stomach so hypersensitive to irritants.

The B deficiencies also caused a wide variety of other symptoms (including fatigue and exercise intolerance). Anything metabolically stimulating (thyroid, caffeine, etc.) made all of these symptoms much worse. At times, I could barely eat or walk across my apartment without a stress reaction. I spent much of my time wondering whether I needed to go to the ER.

Since late 2020, I have slowly put the puzzle pieces together and made progress healing my GI and fixing my nutrient deficiencies. I can now eat most of the foods I want to eat and have recovered a significant degree of mobility (though I still have a ways to go).

It might be helpful for you to experiment with dropping supplements and any foods you think might be irritating your stomach or intestine. You might also investigate the work of Derrick Lonsdale and Eliot Overton on B vitamin deficiencies.

Best of luck to you.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Parts of your story resemble mine.

I developed bad B vitamin deficiencies (and possibly a magnesium deficiency) as a result of a combination of severe stress, demanding work, chronic diarrhea, excessive metabolic stimulation (thyroid, caffeine, table sugar), and insufficient dietary intake of B vitamins and magnesium to support my revved-up metabolism.

I believe that the B vitamin deficiencies (especially B1) caused massive GI dysfunction and alarming, daily chest pain. After 2+ years of feeling like I was going to die of a heart attack (despite normal EKGs and a normal heart scan), I figured out that much of my chest pain was due to substances that were irritating my stomach -- especially tocopherols (vitamin E) and MCT oil in supplements. Stopping oral vitamin D and E supplements (and some other oral supplements and irritating foods) and taking these vitamins transdermally instead eliminated around 90-95% of my chest pain and ended the worst period of my life. I believe that B vitamin deficiencies (especially B1 deficiency) were what made my stomach so hypersensitive to irritants.

The B deficiencies also caused a wide variety of other symptoms (including fatigue and exercise intolerance). Anything metabolically stimulating (thyroid, caffeine, etc.) made all of these symptoms much worse. At times, I could barely eat or walk across my apartment without a stress reaction. I spent much of my time wondering whether I needed to go to the ER.

Since late 2020, I have slowly put the puzzle pieces together and made progress healing my GI and fixing my nutrient deficiencies. I can now eat most of the foods I want to eat and have recovered a significant degree of mobility (though I still have a ways to go).

It might be helpful for you to experiment with dropping supplements and any foods you think might be irritating your stomach or intestine. You might also investigate the work of Derrick Lonsdale and Eliot Overton on B vitamin deficiencies.

Best of luck to you.

With dairy, meat and eggs high in B1 were you not eating these foods?

 

[Creative Nature]

With dairy, meat and eggs high in B1 were you not eating these foods?

See my 2nd paragraph. Those foods weren't enough in my context. (And if nutritiondata.self.com is correct, I would not call beef or eggs high in B1.)

 

[UG Krishnamurti]

The chest pain returned when I tried about 15mg vitamin K over the course of a week in July 2022. The pain was intense, in my left pectoral, and aspirin brought instant relief.

I just want to say that we have almost exact same symptoms all over.

VIT K2 MK-4 increased calcification/stiffness?

While VIT K2 MK-4 [45mg] helped me with eczema and psoriasis [which maybe prove that this particular skin issues are tightly related to the blood vessels] it caused me to have symptoms of aortic valve calcification/myocarditis. Really badly. Extreme chest tightening, short cough, shallow...

raypeatforum.com

I panicked and went to the hospital, where after x rays, a CT scan, and a heart sonogram, they found nothing wrong, except iron deficiency for which I was recommended iron supplements.

I did the same scans, ECG and ultrasound and they said that my heart is healthy.

Vitamin E (Tocovit) and Vitamin K (Thorne products) are, unfortunately, severe chest pain triggers.

:Read under the first quote:

Caffiene (coffee/black tea) is a definite trigger.

For me too.

I cannot tolerate vitamin D because of sharp pains it gives me behind my belly button.

Bleeding again, now after D3 supplement - SUPER CONFUSED

I'm beyond confused. I've started supplementing VIT D3 [30 000 IU] and gelatin [1 tbsp] four days ago and today I've started bleeding after defecating. The same thing happened a few months ago when I supplemented Cynomel and Cynoplus and with exchanged emails with Dr. Peat we came to the...

raypeatforum.com

So, I'm baffled how similar our experiences are.
And I have few things to say about that whole thing.
I think there are 2 major things that needs to be considered.

1st thing: Blood gases imbalance. Thyroid increases CO2, Caffeine increase CO2, K2 increases CO2 etc. I think there is some connection between iron/hemoglobin and CO2. If I remembered correctly I heard Ray said that CO2 is binding to hemoglobin to either create oxygen or to transport oxygen or something like that. When you don't have enough iron or hemoglobin that can probably create gas imbalances which can lead to many different random pain and aches and variety of different problems. That's why we have issues with compounds which increase CO2 in the blood/arteries.

The reason when this downed on me was when I stopped drinking mineral water (high CO2) and found improvements.

2nd thing: Some coagulation imbalances. I don't know if the gas imbalances can create a further imbalance in clotting homeostasis but based on my experience - I think it can. After K2 experiment I had blood clots appear on my skin all over my body and my platelets were high and some other markers too. In order to sleep at night - or function at all - the thing that helped me was Progesterone (with VIT E).

Prog + VIT E is known blood thinner so at that point in time I found it really helpful. But there was a threshold after which those supplements caused the similar issues. Which probably means it swung pendulum to the other side.

So that's why you probably find aspirin useful. Because it thins the blood and reduces coagulation. But just be careful and don't overuse it.

The thing I'm finding to be extremely useful at the moment and which I believe can bring complete homeostasis after few months is a pure fruit + fruit juice diet. I'm 15 days in so far and I've experience 80% reduction in all those symptomes.

 

[UG Krishnamurti]

Also improving Iron/hemoglobin is probably extremely important. But I don't believe you need supplemental iron at all.

 

[sodapopCroc]

You never mentioned your diet which always seems like the best place to start. This quote of Rays could be relevant at least based on what you presented thus far: “For many years, I have been seeing more symptoms relieved by stopping all the chemical supplements, than by using them.”

Good point. My diet is comprised of rice, potatoes, eggs, 1% milk, beef & chicken, cod & sole, an array of vegetables, coconut oil, coconut milk, vinegar, and semi-daily raw carrot salad. I do eat out about once a week but strive to keep PUFAs minimal. I'm also striving to put a cronometer together hah.

 

[sodapopCroc]

Stopping oral vitamin D and E supplements (and some other oral supplements and irritating foods) and taking these vitamins transdermally instead eliminated around 90-95% of my chest pain and ended the worst period of my life.

The funny thing is, I did take all my vitamin K last year transdermally. And any fat soluble vitamin I take now is transdermal. I'm just extremely sensetive.

Nonetheless, I agree that it is absolutely worthwhile to look into B1 deficiency as a source of this sensitivity and possible origin point for chest pain.

 

[sodapopCroc]

excessive metabolic stimulation (thyroid, caffeine, table sugar), and insufficient dietary intake of B vitamins and magnesium to support my revved-up metabolism.

Creative, I relate to this wholeheartedly. Metabolic stimulation now, whether from aspirin or caffiene, brings on chest pain, and my sensitivity to vitamins E and K may be operating similarly.

When you don't have enough iron or hemoglobin that can probably create gas imbalances which can lead to many different random pain and aches and variety of different problems.

Krishnamurti, FWIW my hemoglobin is normalized now albeit still close to the bottom of the range.

The reason when this downed on me was when I stopped drinking mineral water (high CO2) and found improvement

When I bag breathe, it actually worsens my symptoms. The fact that you mention this is really incredible.

After K2 experiment I had blood clots appear on my skin all over my body

I have had the same thing occur, to a lesser extent.

Prog + VIT E is known blood thinner so at that point in time I found it really helpful. But there was a threshold after which those supplements caused the similar issues. Which probably means it swung pendulum to the other sid

Right, aspirin was useful at first, but after a certain point last year it made the chest pain worse.

I may try a similar reductive diet to the one you describe. Thank you.