How could Ray be so dogmatic about estrogen ?

[Risingfire]

@Risingfire, no apologies necessary! Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts.

To be specific, this is when I was tried the experiment of 25 mcgs of T3 with about 50 mgs of progest-E twice a day.

 

[joaquin]

The title of this thread is off. Ray was not dogmatic. It would behove us to be more deliberate in our choice of words. Ray's findings are solid. The use of the term dogmatic implies that he was an ideologue, or refusing to see another viewpoint.

Let's rise above this teenage way of over generalizing in our writing.

 

[freyasam]

did you ever try topical progest e using 10x the oral dose? its not very economical, but i think even a single drop orally can cause hot flashes due to the intestinal irritation. ray himself never used it orally, not even rubbed into the gums. the vitamin E could potentially cause it to.

This is news to me about ray's take on oral vs topical. Where should women apply it topically? I know some people will apply coconut oil to the skin first then the progeste. Not sure if that's to help absorption or to conserve the progeste.

 

[Risingfire]

This is news to me about ray's take on oral vs topical. Where should women apply it topically? I know some people will apply coconut oil to the skin first then the progeste. Not sure if that's to help absorption or to conserve the progeste.

Try the navel. Seems to have great bioavailability

Homage to @haidut

 

[Nik665]

I hear you , but my thyroid health is in chec

yes exactly. That is precisely what I said in this post and comments. Thankfully someone can at least entertain the idea that estrogen isn’t Evil. IMMENSE harm from blocking estrogen. And whenever I say low E causes issues previous times on this forumn, it gets gaslighted and said that they are low thyroid symptoms.

If they listened to any parties aside from this forum they would hear from multiple solid sources that estrogen is protective

Tommy, great point.

People can be resistant to accepting that estrogen is not evil: another thing, I am a scientist and people in this post have yet to differentiate that there is estrodiol, estriol, and estrone. They all have massively different effects in the body, meaning they should all not be clumped into one. I too have healthy thyroid, cortisol, normal temps, and went a little overboard when experimenting and drastically lowered my estradiol to levels lower than a post Menopausal female. Not good. I started feeling exhausted, even having facial hair and body hair in parts than never existed, and body fat distribution was changing to belly versus hips butt and breast. Estrogen has been vilified for good reason as it can be found high when disease and inflammation is present. Estradiol is necessary for health. Not too high not too low, either extreme will cause health issues; the problem is that many people are extremists. It’s either all paleo, all vegan, all ray peat without actually being objective and testing. Ray peat has said that if prolactin, cortisol leveks, and progesterone are in place then that is a good way to assess low estrogen in tissues. My prolactin was normal too, meaning low estrogen in tissues along with low estrogen in serum meaning ACTUALLY low estrogen. Started using an estriol/progesterone cream and within a couple days felt so much better! I could finally get some decent shut eye.

As for ray peat being dogmatic, I think people in this forum are dogmatic more to than peat, which appeared open minded FOR THE MOST PART.
I recall Emma Sgourakis saying Peat kept giving her advice that WAS NOT HELPFUL during her pregnancy. She finally concluded that HE HAD NO IDEA about this one thing as he was not female and had never gone through pregnancy. And MORE CARROT SALAD WAS NOT GOJNG TO SOLVE HER ISSUES. She followed her intuition and figured things out for HER body: and I think this is what the “peating” lifestyle is about, listening to YOUR body and knowing that no one knows every thing including Ray. Despite his good advice it is not conclusive. One must do their own research and come to their own conclusions.

So thank you for questioning and doing your own research and coming to your own conclusions And sharing your information. It takes a brave person to question anything Ray has put out in this forum because dogmatic people abound.

And o agree with you Estrogen is essential. Especially eatradiol, I would love for everyone to experiment and deplete their tissues and blood from estrogen and then let me know how you feel. For me I felt like trash and still working on increasing it back to normal levels.

Tinkering with hormones is no easy feat.