A Wish For More Energy

[GreekDemiGod]

Update:

Did blood tests for the liver today as instructed by my gastroenterologist, good news! Liver enzymes came back in normal range, they were previously high.

AST 25
ALT 54

What I did:
- cut back on the amount of sugar and fructose that I was eating, indirectly lowered caloric intake
- took UDCA for 1 month.
- Milk thistle extract.
- moderate starch, moderate sugar.

 

[Healthseeker]

Cool. Told you it was your liver I guess you already knew. Add psyllium husk to your protocol. Small amount half teaspoon 2 or 3 times a day.

 

[GreekDemiGod]

So, I'm thinking that my poor digestion causes low levels of minerals/ nutrients.
I've now added Zinc and Vitamin C to my Copper regime.
I was reading this about Zinc and it fits me:

Zinc also is a powerful detoxer, reduces histamine, reduces nasal congestion, reduces skin rashes.

These four are all related. Toxins often cause the body to release histamine, which is responsible for “allergic” reactions that result in nasal congestion and skin rashes.

Zinc is also a digestive aid, as it is needed by the body to make hydrochloric acid (HCL) for the stomach. Some very wise health advocates say that if you can improve digestion, especially HCL, that a lot of other health problems will resolve.

 

[aniciete]

So, I'm thinking that my poor digestion causes low levels of minerals/ nutrients.
I've now added Zinc and Vitamin C to my Copper regime.
I was reading this about Zinc and it fits me:

But why continue to take supplements that need to be heavily regulated? Zinc is not hard to get from food if you eat beef and eggs. You will just end up causing new issues taking supplements.

 

[Runenight201]

But why continue to take supplements that need to be heavily regulated? Zinc is not hard to get from food if you eat beef and eggs. You will just end up causing new issues taking supplements.

I agree I feel like supplements are not the answer if you are eating a varied omnivorous diet. How many veges are you eating OP?

 

[Healthseeker]

It is your liver. All that stuff about histamine and allergies has to do with your liver. You might not be able to Google it but I'm telling you. It is your liver. I know for a fact. Exercise hard. Take laxatives, sennosides, though they lose there effectiveness quickly. Take fiber. Take apple cider vinegar, I noticed it helps with congestion problems, it's all tied to liver. Take taurine, I noticed the taurine seemed to help, got that from this forum. Get enough protein, You probably don't need zinc if your getting protein. Idk, about the copper so I can't say on the copper. About the vitamin c, check your rate wound healing, if you have a cut or a little place on your hand or something keep close watch on it, vitamin c can help, but I think if healing factor is slow to begin with your just adding scar tissue... from what I seen. I'm not sure on the vitamin c, but I tried it the Ester-c brand. But, I can only recommend keeping an eye on a cut or something to see if it heals quickly.

 

[Healthseeker]

You can try the betaine hcl, it won't hurt. But also get a source of betaine anhydrous. That's more like a bodybuilding supp. It's also good.

 

[Healthseeker]

Maybe get bottle of clear muscle. I read somewhere stimulating mtor regenerates liver faster

 

[Healthseeker]

Like part of me wants to laugh, because I know you must of been practically bleeding out on the floor for the doctors to be able to find anything wrong. Just because your liver enzymes are within normal range now doesn't mean anything. Your liver is still damaged and is barely holding on probably. Whatever you can do to increase the rate of healing is the most important thing you can do, because your fighting fibrosis. You don't want that scar tissue to set.

 

[Kram]

So, I'm thinking that my poor digestion causes low levels of minerals/ nutrients.
I've now added Zinc and Vitamin C to my Copper regime.
I was reading this about Zinc and it fits me:

You should check out this podcast episode (it's only an hour). Really informative on heavy metals and how they interfere with mineral absorption and function (and contribute to chronic infections, gut and liver issues). This then leads to decreased production of all the enzymes required for energy and hormone production.


View: https://twitter.com/SolBrah/status/1550955704676102145

 

[Healthseeker]

Also get a foam roller and foam roll your liver.

 

[InChristAlone]

It is your liver. All that stuff about histamine and allergies has to do with your liver. You might not be able to Google it but I'm telling you. It is your liver. I know for a fact. Exercise hard. Take laxatives, sennosides, though they lose there effectiveness quickly. Take fiber. Take apple cider vinegar, I noticed it helps with congestion problems, it's all tied to liver. Take taurine, I noticed the taurine seemed to help, got that from this forum. Get enough protein, You probably don't need zinc if your getting protein. Idk, about the copper so I can't say on the copper. About the vitamin c, check your rate wound healing, if you have a cut or a little place on your hand or something keep close watch on it, vitamin c can help, but I think if healing factor is slow to begin with your just adding scar tissue... from what I seen. I'm not sure on the vitamin c, but I tried it the Ester-c brand. But, I can only recommend keeping an eye on a cut or something to see if it heals quickly.

Exercising hard can really cause a bile dump and then if you aren't prepared it's going to be rough.

 

[Sefton10]

But why continue to take supplements that need to be heavily regulated? Zinc is not hard to get from food if you eat beef and eggs. You will just end up causing new issues taking supplements.

Exactly. Eat a couple of oysters a day and you've got all the zinc and copper you need.

 

[GreekDemiGod]

Had a remarkable day, very good energy levels and mentally strong, considering I'm going through a breakup.
What might have caused it:
- 2 drops of Tyromix/ day in the last 2 days. Had some left over, and though, why not, let's try some again
- 1g of Aspirin today, I took it because I got a sunburn in the weekend
- Copper(up to 15mg) + Zinc + Vitamin C protocol

 

[LLight]

P5P mostly increases dream vividness, but acetylcholine is responsible mainly for lucidity and dream recall.

Would you say that having low (very infrequent) dreams recall is a sign of acetylcholine deficiency ?

 

[cs3000]

Starting to suspect that my fatigue problem might be related to Iron/ copper. Ever since adopting Peat principles, almost 3 years ago, I've become physically weaker. All that Aspirin, coffee, milk might have depleted my Iron.
Also starting to believe that taking thyroid when in a state of nutrient deficiency is downright dangerous. My health just got worse and worse. Peating is definitely not the path to healing.
I remember when i was a child, the doctor suspected me I was anemic, but turned out I wasn't, according to his judgement.

What's your ferritin level? ferritin can show up as "false" results elevated when acutely inflammed or sick with a virus infection as the body shuffles iron out to protect from infection, so best to test outside of that. but if not generally from what i've read ferritin<50 can be associated with fatigue. where excess iron can be dangerous if transferrin saturation shows high.

Doctors often say people's iron levels are ok just because hemoglobin hasn't degraded yet, actually when hemoglobin gets hit youre already in a later stage of iron deficiency - a lot of people report fatigue on ferritin <30 which goes away when they raise it (takes a while unless they get an infusion which takes a few weeks to correct stores. a lot of the iron supplement forms are ***t for the stomach / gut, iron protein succinylate might be better). maybe this connection is due to iron requiring enzymes starting to get dysfunctional at that level or something idk. liver is probably a good way to help raise it if testing low as it's high in iron and vit A retinol which can aid in raising iron (but idk if vit a is good for ferritin yet)-> Effect of vitamin A supplementation on iron status in humans: A systematic review and meta-analysis - PubMed.

body typically loses 1mg - 2mg iron each day through cell shedding / waste, and 1mg iron in diet is not 1mg in the body due to how much the body takes in (varies in %, maybe 15% absorbed from red meat), so if continually at a deficit it has effects over years. if you look around long distance endurance runners often deplete their ferritin and start performing like ***t even without the progression to anemia. then often report recovery when they get their ferritin back to ~75-100.

also copper plays a role in converting plant sources of iron ferric oxidized form (fe3+), gets reduced by copper enzyme into ferrous (fe2+) to be absorbed in intestines. but maybe you wouldnt notice an acute effect from this mechanism unless getting a bunch of iron from plant sources that you ordinarily wern't converting well. i read non-heme ferric plant iron competes with copper if taken at the same time tho. also polyphenols i.e in tea can chelate iron.

if iron stores >40 or 50 on typical testing / high transferrin saturation then probably not but if < then might be worth a look at
https://www.oatext.com/iron-deficiency-without-anemia-common-important-neglected.php

 

[TheCalciumCad]

Doctors often say people's iron levels are ok just because hemoglobin hasn't degraded yet, actually when hemoglobin gets hit youre already in a later stage of iron deficiency - a lot of people report fatigue on ferritin <30 which goes away when they raise it (takes a while unless they get an infusion which takes a few weeks to correct stores. a lot of the iron supplement forms are ***t for the stomach / gut, iron protein succinylate might be better). maybe this connection is due to iron requiring enzymes starting to get dysfunctional at that level or something idk. liver is probably a good way to help raise it if testing low as it's high in iron and vit A retinol which can aid in raising ferritin -> Effect of vitamin A supplementation on iron status in humans: A systematic review and meta-analysis - PubMed.

body typically loses 1mg - 2mg iron each day through cell shedding / waste, and 1mg iron in diet is not 1mg in the body due to how much the body takes in (varies in %, maybe 15% absorbed from red meat), so if continually at a deficit it has effects over years. if you look around long distance endurance runners often deplete their ferritin and start performing like ***t even without the progression to anemia. then often report recovery when they get their ferritin back to ~75-100.

If you're right that "body typically loses 1mg - 2mg iron each day through cell shedding / waste, and 1mg iron in diet is not 1mg in the body due to how much the body takes in (varies in %, maybe 15% absorbed from red meat)" then id be blown away if I wasn't iron deficient. I've been having coffee with all meals for the last 7years which lowers iron absorption by around 80% and only recently quit coffee. The last 4years I ramped up dairy and took aspirin a few times a week (for hair loss) both are Iron chelators. I noticed this summer I don't even tan (I stopped burning years ago when I reduced PUFA) as I walk frequently in the countryside when its hot which is a classic low iron / anemic symptom outside of hair loss that I could never solve. I eat red meat every other day but that doesn't sound like its enough to combat low iron stores then.

 

[GreekDemiGod]

@TheCalciumCad are you saying Iron is not really a problem for you, and coffee, Aspirin, milk do not leave you iron deficient?

 

[cs3000]

If you're right that "body typically loses 1mg - 2mg iron each day through cell shedding / waste, and 1mg iron in diet is not 1mg in the body due to how much the body takes in (varies in %, maybe 15% absorbed from red meat)" then id be blown away if I wasn't iron deficient. I've been having coffee with all meals for the last 7years which lowers iron absorption by around 80% and only recently quit coffee. The last 4years I ramped up dairy and took aspirin a few times a week (for hair loss) both are Iron chelators. I noticed this summer I don't even tan (I stopped burning years ago when I reduced PUFA) as I walk frequently in the countryside when its hot which is a classic low iron / anemic symptom outside of hair loss that I could never solve. I eat red meat every other day but that doesn't sound like its enough to combat low iron stores then.

this study Body iron excretion in man: A collaborative study
says daily iron loss ranges from 0.9mg - 2.42mg depending on group. probably higher end for people who do frequent prolonged endurance exercise.
estimated typical iron absorption from mixed diets ~15% & less in vegetarians depleted Iron bioavailability and dietary reference values - PubMed and with ferritin 45 estimated ~15% average (ranges a lot obviously due to numerous factors gut health cofactors chelators etc) Estimation of Dietary Iron Bioavailability from Food Iron Intake and Iron Status

some iron is re-absorbed by the body but idk how much. theres re-absorption from urine by the kidneys, but it also comes out through feces & through skin / skin cell shedding. and that study mentions urine excretion only made up a small part of the daily loss. but its gonna depend on u individually like most things i guess

 

[TheCalciumCad]

@TheCalciumCad are you saying Iron is not really a problem for you, and coffee, Aspirin, milk do not leave you iron deficient?

That i'm almost certainly Iron deficient and a big reason for that will be abusing coffee, milk and aspirin over the years. I used to have tonnes of greens aswell which I stopped when I got into the Peat stuff and they're rich in iron. I even donated blood at the start of 2020, whoops.

this study Body iron excretion in man: A collaborative study
says daily iron loss ranges from 0.9mg - 2.42mg depending on group. probably higher end for people who do frequent prolonged endurance exercise.
typical iron absorption from mixed diets ~15% Iron bioavailability and dietary reference values - PubMed

So the more stressed you are the more you need like most things. I'll have to do an iron panel at some point, I've only ever had my ferritin measured once an it was about 70 before I got into all the Peat stuff. I've suspected Iron could be an issue for a while especially this summer judging by how pale I am vs how much sun I get. How to get it up without eating liver then is the question? lots of beef and spinach everyday? my digestion is great so I doubt stomach acid is an issue.