Resting Heart Rate Dropping Alot After Starting Peat Enthused Diet

Jon

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Thanks jon

Appreciate the help everyone I'm going to try it out. A.) Tske some time off gym and bump up calories B.) Increase calories and reduce volume

Going to stop dieting for thr time being until I get some metabolism improvement and wait for things like bpm sleep temps to all improve before increasing training volume or starting another cut

I think that's a wise desicion brother. Just keep this in mind, that your attitude towards things will also influence how well you can adapt to them. Don't let things like negative feedback deter or depress you, just analyze the data, pin point the most logical reason why it's happening, ask questions if you need to, and keep positive that things are transitioning how you want them.

If you eat adequate calories and take time off just be aware of the first 4 days as this seems to be when people get worse before they get better. You're probably the 20th+ person I've talked to about this kind of thing and every time people get similar reactions to their initial days off; tremendous fatigue, restless leg, achy muscles and joints, increased appetite, powerful sleep, more vivid dreams, sometimes nightmares, severe twitching during sleep, mental apathy to do anything physical, salty and starchy cravings. This all goes away pretty much by the 5th day and by the 2nd week off your improvements of life quality seem to be daily. Just make sure you're eating enough, get lots of sunshine and go outside even if it's just to sit, go to bed at the first sign of sleepiness, stay there as long as you can/feel like it, and if you're in a relationship be sure to have sex as often as you can/your partner is comfortable with as the dopamine release from sex is huge for boosting natural test, dht, and immune function. Good luck man, give us updates!

Edit: also you may want to decrease your coffee consumption as caffeine will increase cortisol and adrenaline output and mask fatigue. At this point you want to feel the true depth of fatigue you have and coffee will interfere with this. I actually stopped coffee for the two weeks I rested and it was awesome to know that my higher energy levels were natural not synthetic.
 
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Sagitarrius90

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Will definitly report back to all!

On a side note not sure if anyone can help me here but how do you know if the increase in BPM and temperature is in essence "good" or warrented compared to that of one from a stress response?

Efficient increase in BPM and temps
- calm energy and warm almost a sedative feeling?

Inefficent increase in BPM/Temps (Stress response)
- irritable
- cold extremities/sweating/cravings
- anxiety/rush feeling

In my journey of recovery I just want to differentiate the two. I will still incorporate caffiene with plenty of saturated fat sugar along with aspirin and niacimide in the AM only.
 

Jon

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Will definitly report back to all!

On a side note not sure if anyone can help me here but how do you know if the increase in BPM and temperature is in essence "good" or warrented compared to that of one from a stress response?

Efficient increase in BPM and temps
- calm energy and warm almost a sedative feeling?

Inefficent increase in BPM/Temps (Stress response)
- irritable
- cold extremities/sweating/cravings
- anxiety/rush feeling

In my journey of recovery I just want to differentiate the two. I will still incorporate caffiene with plenty of saturated fat sugar along with aspirin and niacimide in the AM only.

Yeah you have it right with the difference in stress state vs beneficial heart rate/temps. Basically how you feel after taking niacinamide.
 

Luckytype

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Have you recently had a cholesterol or thyroid panel @Nick Borcic ? And did you have it before your doc put you on TRT?

I ask because of the symptoms of your current situation but also because of overall lack of steroid hormones that made the decision to put you on. Its further asked because of your off stress heartrate which is screaming poor energy production.

And when I quote "TRT" it was my way of asking you if it was prescribed TRT or deciding to cruise on enanthate despite the small dosing.

What happens to that 97.6 when you eat your first meal, 45 min after?
 
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Sagitarrius90

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Have you recently had a cholesterol or thyroid panel @Nick Borcic ? And did you have it before your doc put you on TRT?

I ask because of the symptoms of your current situation but also because of overall lack of steroid hormones that made the decision to put you on. Its further asked because of your off stress heartrate which is screaming poor energy production.

And when I quote "TRT" it was my way of asking you if it was prescribed TRT or deciding to cruise on enanthate despite the small dosing.

What happens to that 97.6 when you eat your first meal, 45 min after?

No it was doc prescribed I was going to do that but found a doc that first tried androgel then just put me on weekly shots... cost is about the same since I dont insurance (underground lab test vs pharma from doc)

My cholesterol was high when I last got tests done and thyroid showed tsh of 1.1 but my t3 t4 hormones were on the lower end but within range so my doc said they were fine which I knew was bull. I've always had a low heart rate back in 2005 I almost died from an eating disorder and recovered around 2012 and what I mean by recovered was my relationship with food gaining fat , weight In general.

@Luckytype let me report back to you about my temps/pulse after eating. I would assume if they drop even further than that would indicate either some big issues or a really messed up system.
 

nwo2012

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If temp pulse drop after breakfast, simply means adrenaline and cortisol are running the show.
I also f'ed myself with gear and training. First 3 months of Peating resting pulse dropped and after eating. Started NDT. Eventually cut it back to only NDT in winter. 6 years on and resting pulses and temps are good. Still take 10mg test base daily with Haidut supps. Feel great, look the best I have in years.

Listen to Jon, he knows his stuff especially from a BB perspective.
 
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Sagitarrius90

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If temp pulse drop after breakfast, simply means adrenaline and cortisol are running the show.
I also f'ed myself with gear and training. First 3 months of Peating resting pulse dropped and after eating. Started NDT. Eventually cut it back to only NDT in winter. 6 years on and resting pulses and temps are good. Still take 10mg test base daily with Haidut supps. Feel great, look the best I have in years.

Listen to Jon, he knows his stuff especially from a BB perspective.

Did you get your own NDT or was it script? I know thyroid is good but shouldn't I try and naturally get my pulse and temps up without t3? I think @Jon mentioned to do it without exogenous supps and perhaps later on add it.. maybe since winter is coming around I could supplement.

@nwo2012 what made you want to go on NDT the fact your pulse/temps were so low? What was your resting pulse?

I'm trying to see where I'm at in comparison with others who have been in my situation. I can function at my low pulse and temp but obviously I want them to improve so I guess I'll stick with just eating and lowering stress as much as possible (adopting peat principles/concepts etc) and see what good it does and also taking time off gym as per the discussion me and @Jon and @Luckytype and others I forgot to mention previously had.
 

Jon

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Did you get your own NDT or was it script? I know thyroid is good but shouldn't I try and naturally get my pulse and temps up without t3? I think @Jon mentioned to do it without exogenous supps and perhaps later on add it.. maybe since winter is coming around I could supplement.

@nwo2012 what made you want to go on NDT the fact your pulse/temps were so low? What was your resting pulse?

I'm trying to see where I'm at in comparison with others who have been in my situation. I can function at my low pulse and temp but obviously I want them to improve so I guess I'll stick with just eating and lowering stress as much as possible (adopting peat principles/concepts etc) and see what good it does and also taking time off gym as per the discussion me and @Jon and @Luckytype and others I forgot to mention previously had.

Thanks @nwo2012 :) you're too kind.

@Nick Borcic i only suggest to try everything you can except supplementing more hormones to see if A) you can fix things, and to what degree wothout having to use medication, and B) should you not be able to fix things 100% even after optimizing your natural approach, you'll at least have a clearer idea to what degree you need exogenous support to compensate. This way you'll either avoid having to use more medication OR only have to use the minimal amount necessary instead of just throwing s h i t at the wall and seeing what sticks.

It sounds like @nwo2012 did a lot of hard learning to get where he is, and I'm sure he would corroborate the value of taking a more methodical minimalistic approach. Most of us here are the hard learning types (me included) lol.
 
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Sagitarrius90

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Thanks @nwo2012 :) you're too kind.

@Nick Borcic i only suggest to try everything you can except supplementing more hormones to see if A) you can fix things, and to what degree wothout having to use medication, and B) should you not be able to fix things 100% even after optimizing your natural approach, you'll at least have a clearer idea to what degree you need exogenous support to compensate. This way you'll either avoid having to use more medication OR only have to use the minimal amount necessary instead of just throwing s h i t at the wall and seeing what sticks.

It sounds like @nwo2012 did a lot of hard learning to get where he is, and I'm sure he would corroborate the value of taking a more methodical minimalistic approach. Most of us here are the hard learning types (me included) lol.


Much appreciated

I suspect I'm going to gain some weight here and I'll go out on a limb and say some fat but mostly increased water from increased carb intake would that be a fair assessment?

It's hard enough for me to take time off and bump up calories but to see the scale move forward after dieting for so long just discourages me.. One, two or even three pounds is fine but I've gone from 208 in the AM to around 212.5 213 after 2 weeks of peat style diet. I'm tough but such a little girl when it comes to that damn scale. Abs are fluffy but then again they always were just even more so now... maybe too much carbs spilling over since I'm perhaps topped off on glycogen?

These micro details are what I should of paid attention to years ago prior to burning myself out funny how it works one way lol
 

Jon

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Much appreciated

I suspect I'm going to gain some weight here and I'll go out on a limb and say some fat but mostly increased water from increased carb intake would that be a fair assessment?

It's hard enough for me to take time off and bump up calories but to see the scale move forward after dieting for so long just discourages me.. One, two or even three pounds is fine but I've gone from 208 in the AM to around 212.5 213 after 2 weeks of peat style diet. I'm tough but such a little girl when it comes to that damn scale. Abs are fluffy but then again they always were just even more so now... maybe too much carbs spilling over since I'm perhaps topped off on glycogen?

These micro details are what I should of paid attention to years ago prior to burning myself out funny how it works one way lol

"The Devil is in the details"
-Lionel Luthor

You could be gaining for a plethora of reasons man. If you were eating extremely low carb before this then maybe it's glycogen but I'm gonna guess and say you've adopted a high salt intake? That's SURE to cause edema. 6-7lbs in 2 weeks?? That's mostly water, and I'm thinking it's from mineral fluctuations d i cking with aldosterone/cortisol levels. During time off the only thing I ever saw with weight was it going down as long as I wasn't pounding salt or eating a ridiculous surplus of calories. It's been the same for others I've advised and observed. Also, I know fructose is the popular carb in these parts, but tbh glucose is king for metabolism, especially in someone with excessive amounts of skeletal muscle (which those of us who weight train all have since it's not muscle that got there without a stress stimulus).
 

Jon

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@Nick Borcic also like many of us into our image, you have delt/are dealing with some body dismorphia. It sounds like you've made some strides in a better direction, but are still working through the vanity controlling your logic. This is something you need to get a handle on if you truly want to be better. Letting go of my vanity and materialism along with my obsessive nature towards my health variables literally made me more of a man and a better human being. You gotta realize dude no one really gives a s h i t what you look like, it's all about how you make them feel. I use my avatar pic to let people know I practice what i preach but I really don't care what people think of my looks anymore. I only really care about helping others, and in a cyclical way I think that has helped me look and feel better. Vanity will kill you dude. It's a liar, and a trap. Gaining intelligence and wisdom is what you should focus on, and you'll notice the more of each of those you gain, the less you care about things you thought were so important.
 

jitsmonkey

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this makes perfect sense
fasting/underfueled/caffeinated wo fuel/etc all are high adrenaline producers
this will raise your resting pulse rate.
Proper fueling/less stress/etc will reduce pulse rate.

this is why temp alone, pulse alone, even temp/pulse without relation to feeding is extremely limited as a tool
pulse/temp relevant to feeding (pre/post) is your most valuable tool.
 

nwo2012

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Did you get your own NDT or was it script? I know thyroid is good but shouldn't I try and naturally get my pulse and temps up without t3? I think @Jon mentioned to do it without exogenous supps and perhaps later on add it.. maybe since winter is coming around I could supplement.

@nwo2012 what made you want to go on NDT the fact your pulse/temps were so low? What was your resting pulse?

I'm trying to see where I'm at in comparison with others who have been in my situation. I can function at my low pulse and temp but obviously I want them to improve so I guess I'll stick with just eating and lowering stress as much as possible (adopting peat principles/concepts etc) and see what good it does and also taking time off gym as per the discussion me and @Jon and @Luckytype and others I forgot to mention previously had.

Welcome, Jon.
Well I did mail Peat and he suggested giving it a few moths of dietary stuff 1st, which I did. Yes then winter arrived and I decided I couldn't let myself, and family, play the health lottery any longer (it really is when your metabolism is sub-optimal) and took the plunge. No Dr script. At least you have options, it was hard to get a clean NDT. Now it's easy, Tyromax is very clean.

It is your call of course, and as Jon said minimalist approach is best. But with resting pulse so low, your metabolism is way down. If you were coming into spring I would say try diet and lifestyle only as you have two seasons, even three, to see changes. But if winter is approaching, imho, better to let NDT take care of metabolism, which will still lower stress hormones and reduce your chances of ill-health, then when spring approaches slowly wean the dose and try to do it with diet alone. At least with quality light heat and sunshine, you have a better chance of your body improving without supplements.
 

tara

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Should I lower protein a bit increase sugars and keep calorie intake close to maintenance to account for a possibly slowed metabolism . I want to maintain my bodyfat %(around 12 13)
What are your priorities? Recover health? If you have forced your body to make adaptations to stressful deprivation, then to some extent you have to make choices about what your goals are next.
I am not an expert, but I suspect that it would be unlikely for most people, and especially anyone recovering from a diagnosed restrictive eating disorder (was it of this type?), to be able to restore a healthy metabolism while restricting diet to supplying less energy than a normal healthy metabolism usually requires to run.
Could be your low heart-rate and etc may be a result of incomplete recovery.

I suppose supplementing with t3 during this recovery (running off of my normal metabolism instead of stress hormones) wouldn't be wise? Or perhaps eat more calories (peaty type) and add t3
Weigh 210 height 6.0
Possibly you may have been undereating compared with your energy needs? Low metabolism can be a protective adaptation for this.
I would not recommend adding T3 at this time - likely to deepen energy deficit.
My hunch would be to add more food - food with calories, carbs, minerals at least and maybe more sat fat (prob. not more protein).

Have you seen this site?:
Patients and General Public
and this article?
Phases of Recovery From An Eating Disorder Part 4

There's some discussion on this forum here:
Recovery From Undereating - Youreatopia
(Youreatopia came before the ED institute.)
 

Jon

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Welcome, Jon.
Well I did mail Peat and he suggested giving it a few moths of dietary stuff 1st, which I did. Yes then winter arrived and I decided I couldn't let myself, and family, play the health lottery any longer (it really is when your metabolism is sub-optimal) and took the plunge. No Dr script. At least you have options, it was hard to get a clean NDT. Now it's easy, Tyromax is very clean.

It is your call of course, and as Jon said minimalist approach is best. But with resting pulse so low, your metabolism is way down. If you were coming into spring I would say try diet and lifestyle only as you have two seasons, even three, to see changes. But if winter is approaching, imho, better to let NDT take care of metabolism, which will still lower stress hormones and reduce your chances of ill-health, then when spring approaches slowly wean the dose and try to do it with diet alone. At least with quality light heat and sunshine, you have a better chance of your body improving without supplements.

What do you think of taking some aspirin during training layoffs? I have considered during my off weeks taking some aspirin on the 4th day to really drive down the stress hormones and upregulate glucose oxidation. I'm not a fan of supplementation at all, but if there's a need or a benefit I'm open to it.

I just know there's a slight backlash effect with aspirin in terms of clotting. I want to avoid that, and I'm not sure if even just taking it once opens me up for more platelet aggregation?
 

A. squamosa

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was likely stress hormones keeping your temps and heart rate higher previously - your body isn't probably relying on them so much anymore - it takes time to heal, just keep getting in your nutrients!
 

Jsaute21

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Thanks @nwo2012 :) you're too kind.

@Nick Borcic i only suggest to try everything you can except supplementing more hormones to see if A) you can fix things, and to what degree wothout having to use medication, and B) should you not be able to fix things 100% even after optimizing your natural approach, you'll at least have a clearer idea to what degree you need exogenous support to compensate. This way you'll either avoid having to use more medication OR only have to use the minimal amount necessary instead of just throwing s h i t at the wall and seeing what sticks.

It sounds like @nwo2012 did a lot of hard learning to get where he is, and I'm sure he would corroborate the value of taking a more methodical minimalistic approach. Most of us here are the hard learning types (me included) lol.

Jon - have you used peat approved exogenous supplements like progesterone or thyroid yet?
 

Jon

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Jon - Just curious, have you used exogenous soups at all?

Nah :cool: too prideful for that lol.

I've considered it for thyroid issues though. But I've been fortunate to rectify my issues without it. I'm also slightly afraid of things that powerful, as just food supplements have messed me up in the past from rather pedestrian doses others here would find inconsequential. That makes me very apprehensive to try anything as powerful as thyroid hormone.
 

Jsaute21

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Nah :cool: too prideful for that lol.

I've considered it for thyroid issues though. But I've been fortunate to rectify my issues without it. I'm also slightly afraid of things that powerful, as just food supplements have messed me up in the past from rather pedestrian doses others here would find inconsequential. That makes me very apprehensive to try anything as powerful as thyroid hormone.
Understandable. I was the same way but than curiosity trumped pride lol. When you say rectify issues, does that mean your resting pulse is above 75 and temps are above 98? I just ask as an experienced lifter as it took me a while to get my pulse/temps up (still a work in progress.)
 

Jon

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Understandable. I was the same way but than curiosity trumped pride lol. When you say rectify issues, does that mean your resting pulse is above 75 and temps are above 98? I just ask as an experienced lifter as it took me a while to get my pulse/temps up (still a work in progress.)

It might have been different if I never competed, but when I ended up happy with what I could accomplish naturally I decided gear wasn't for me . Yeah I had low test, temps of 95-97.5, heart rate of 40-52bpm but now temps stay at 98.6f pretty much always and heart rate stays around 77bpm. Sometimes temps or pulses drop because of an ending microcycle of training but it's usually fixed by a week off. I'm trying to optimize my weeks off and thinking of using aspirin in the middle of an off week to drop stress hormones nice and low before revisiting training but as I've said I'm pretty cautious of supplementing lol.
 
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