Caffeine Heals Liver Fibrosis - But What About Poor Glycogen Storage?

[AinmAnseo]

I have read posts from Haidut noting that caffeine can heal liver fibrosis.

But what about poor glycogen storage?
Can caffeine fix that?

I am 65, and my liver seems to run out of glycogen every morning at 1 am, waking me up, as Peat has discussed before.

I am about to start using limited caffeine in the morning, for my hypothyroid/hypometabolic state.
It would be nice if it also healed my liver's glycogen issue.

Paul

 

[vocedilegno]

I have read posts from Haidut noting that caffeine can heal liver fibrosis.

But what about poor glycogen storage?
Can caffeine fix that?

I am 65, and my liver seems to run out of glycogen every morning at 1 am, waking me up, as Peat has discussed before.

I am about to start using limited caffeine in the morning, for my hypothyroid/hypometabolic state.
It would be nice if it also healed my liver's glycogen issue.

Paul

Don’t waste your time and get some Cytomel (T3 aka liothyronine) from farmacias del nino. I had the same thing from 2015-2018 or so. The waking up at 3:00 AM lasted about 2 and a half years and I slept through the night normally the first time I tried T3. It wasn’t even the whole pill, it was 1/4 of the pill, or 6.25mcg I believe. Got the idea of course from one of Ray’s articles, I’ll reply again here when I find the specific reference, but it was something he said about how active thyroid hormone is necessary for the glycogen synthase enzyme to work.

Caffeine will probably just keep your glycogen stores depleted.

 

[AinmAnseo]

Don’t waste your time and get some Cytomel (T3 aka liothyronine) from farmacias del nino. I had the same thing from 2015-2018 or so. The waking up at 3:00 AM lasted about 2 and a half years and I slept through the night normally the first time I tried T3. It wasn’t even the whole pill, it was 1/4 of the pill, or 6.25mcg I believe. Got the idea of course from one of Ray’s articles, I’ll reply again here when I find the specific reference, but it was something he said about how active thyroid hormone is necessary for the glycogen synthase enzyme to work.

Caffeine will probably just keep your glycogen stores depleted.

I am already taking T3 (tyromene), 1 mcg 3x a day.
Paul

 

[vocedilegno]

I am already taking T3 (tyromene), 1 mcg 3x a day.
Paul

Only because I tried it and it happened to work for me, I would say try 6-7mg in the evening with a meal containing a significant amount of some kind of carb that has a fructose component (Mexican coke is what I believe I did that time) and see how it makes you feel. I’ll be surprised if it doesn’t make you sleep through the night.

The effectiveness can depend on the concentration achieved in the blood, which is mostly dependent on the dose given in one sitting as I understand it.

To say how much of the success I had sleeping through the night when I did this was due to the glycogen synthase aspect and how much due to the pregnenolone synthesis would be a guess, but it’s for sure that the cholesterol-raising property of the sugar synergized with thyroid to help with the pregnenolone synthesis.

Which reminds me: taking thyroid chronically, one should monitor one’s LDL cholesterol number to make sure it doesn’t get too low. LDL deficiency is a threat to cell membrane stability and therefore a cancer risk. According to the studies I’ve seen the ideal LDL number is 126.

 

[AinmAnseo]

Thanks for all the information.

 

[vocedilegno]

Thanks for all the information.

No problem, please let me and the forum know if it works. Did you manage not to wake up at 1:00 yet?

Might also be interesting/helpful to know if you have any ideas about how you became aware you were hypothyroid/hypometabolic, how you’ve encountered the ideas of Peat and how long you’ve been exploring them.

There are other resources which come to mind given the limited info you’ve shared thus far, Broda Barnes is one author with extensive clinical experience as an MD helping his patients with thyroid, who was one of Peat’s main sources in this, you may want to check out his books “Hypoglycemia: It’s Not Your Mind, It’s Your Liver!” And “Hypothyroidism: The Unsuspected Illness.”

I’m sure everyone here is wishing you best of luck with your health journey, please feel free to share anything else or any other questions. I have been in this sphere reading voraciously for about 6-7 years now so I imagine I can save you some time.

 

[Ahmed ELH]

Hey Paul,

This should be interesting : Taurine Doubles Liver Glycogen

 

[AinmAnseo]

Hey Paul,

This should be interesting : Taurine Doubles Liver Glycogen

Ahmed,
That sounds great - the only problem is that my blood studies a year ago showed sky-high taurine levels.
So, I can't take any taurine supps, until I re-test for amino acids.
I appreciate the link.

 

[Ahmed ELH]

he only problem is that my blood studies a year ago showed sky-high taurine levels.

Do you have a Beta Alanine deficiency by any chance? Beta Alanine and Taurine share the same transporter, supplementing with Beta Alanine is a good way to reduce excess taurine levels.

 

[AinmAnseo]

Do you have a Beta Alanine deficiency by any chance? Beta Alanine and Taurine share the same transporter, supplementing with Beta Alanine is a good way to reduce excess taurine levels.

Not sure.
The test measured alanine, which was not low or high.

 

[vocedilegno]

Hey Paul, I read some of your other posts in the forum, didn’t see if you had found anything about vitamin B1. That’s another one of the bases to stop at first when addressing carb metabolism, it can produce noticeable and immediate effects in some cases, (definitely has for me),and the following thread doscusses how it can reverse liver fibrosis (and cirrhosis):

Vitamin B1 (thiamine) And Testosterone Can Cure Liver Cirrhosis

These studies should be quite embarrassing for the organ transplant industry, especially given the other published studies showing saturated fat and caffeine also being capable of reversing even advanced liver fibrosis. [ON 2 CASES OF ASCITES DUE TO HEPATIC CIRRHOSIS IN SUBJECTS OPERATED ON BY...

raypeatforum.com

And I believe Haidut made another thread about biotin and its role in glycogen synthesis if you can find it

 

[AinmAnseo]

Hey Paul, I read some of your other posts in the forum, didn’t see if you had found anything about vitamin B1. That’s another one of the bases to stop at first when addressing carb metabolism, it can produce noticeable and immediate effects in some cases, (definitely has for me),and the following thread doscusses how it can reverse liver fibrosis (and cirrhosis):

Vitamin B1 (thiamine) And Testosterone Can Cure Liver Cirrhosis

These studies should be quite embarrassing for the organ transplant industry, especially given the other published studies showing saturated fat and caffeine also being capable of reversing even advanced liver fibrosis. [ON 2 CASES OF ASCITES DUE TO HEPATIC CIRRHOSIS IN SUBJECTS OPERATED ON BY...

raypeatforum.com

And I believe Haidut made another thread about biotin and its role in glycogen synthesis if you can find it

Thanks, Voice of Wood (?).
Yes, I take Allithiamine, and I am now trying energin, so I think B1 is covered.
And biotin is covered, too, in energin.
I am not ready to try T or DHT, yet. My numbers are not low, according to my naturopath.
But I have no idea what T or other lab numbers are considered "Peaty", since that is apparently not written down anywhere.

 

[vocedilegno]

Thanks, Voice of Wood (?).
Yes, I take Allithiamine, and I am now trying energin, so I think B1 is covered.
And biotin is covered, too, in energin.
I am not ready to try T or DHT, yet. My numbers are not low, according to my naturopath.
But I have no idea what T or other lab numbers are considered "Peaty", since that is apparently not written down anywhere.

Thanks or the reply, Paul, my name is John.

Your reference to the testosterone element of that thread is interesting, it seems like some people here want to aim for high serum T by any means but to me it seems risky for a number of reasons, for example how a metabolically compromised or inflamed organism will likely over convert that to estrogen, or how high serum T *can* be achieved by excess of LH or by β-hCG, which as Peat has warned us can lead to gonadal cancers, by rousing the glands to action while the glands may be energetically deficient.

Have you tried epsom salt baths? One of the best ways to absorb magnesium, which along with B1 will enhance pyruvate dehydrogenase (PDH) function and assist with carbohydrate metabolism.

How about a teaspoon of coconut oil with each meal? To relieve the inhibitory effect of circulating PUFA on the thyroid gland. This is one of Peat’s big recommendations as I’m sure you’re aware.

How about vitamin E to the same end, which Peat has mentioned synergizes with coconut oil in this regard?

Or incorporating iodine, zinc, and casein together in meals for endogenous thyroid synthesis. Peat once said or wrote that you can make a pretty good homemade thyroid substitute by boiling oysters and seaweed in milk. Sounded too gross to me but I have tried having cheese, raw oysters, and seaweed at a meal and felt warmer with a faster heartbeat afterward.

Or eating a lot of starch with minimal protein over the day to get the NAD+ levels up?

Niacinamide can help with this; I’m aware you are taking energin but I have noticed very positive things from 500mg doses of Niacinamide as Abram Hoffer recommended for his cancer patients, which is much higher than is practical to dose with energin.

Would seem most potent to do all of the above in a given day, I bet if you throw everything at the problem you’ll eventually push yourself over the threshold and/or find the missing link. I know what you are going through and I am optimistic that you will find your way through to the other side.

-Voice of Wood

 

[Healthseeker]

Ahmed,
That sounds great - the only problem is that my blood studies a year ago showed sky-high taurine levels.
So, I can't take any taurine supps, until I re-test for amino acids.
I appreciate the link.

well what causes your high taurine? it would interesting to know what you believe you caused it.

 

[youngsinatra]

well what causes your high taurine? it would interesting to know what you believe you caused it.

I think it’s a conjugation issue from taurine into bile acids.
OP, If you have liver/bile flow problems, look into B1/B5. B5 is needed for the synthesis of bile acids. No high doses needed.

 

[vocedilegno]

I think it’s a conjugation issue from taurine into bile acids.
OP, If you have liver/bile flow problems, look into B1/B5. B5 is needed for the synthesis of bile acids. No high doses needed.

This is amazing info

 

[AinmAnseo]

Thanks or the reply, Paul, my name is John.

Your reference to the testosterone element of that thread is interesting, it seems like some people here want to aim for high serum T by any means but to me it seems risky for a number of reasons, for example how a metabolically compromised or inflamed organism will likely over convert that to estrogen, or how high serum T *can* be achieved by excess of LH or by β-hCG, which as Peat has warned us can lead to gonadal cancers, by rousing the glands to action while the glands may be energetically deficient.

Have you tried epsom salt baths? One of the best ways to absorb magnesium, which along with B1 will enhance pyruvate dehydrogenase (PDH) function and assist with carbohydrate metabolism.

How about a teaspoon of coconut oil with each meal? To relieve the inhibitory effect of circulating PUFA on the thyroid gland. This is one of Peat’s big recommendations as I’m sure you’re aware.

How about vitamin E to the same end, which Peat has mentioned synergizes with coconut oil in this regard?

Or incorporating iodine, zinc, and casein together in meals for endogenous thyroid synthesis. Peat once said or wrote that you can make a pretty good homemade thyroid substitute by boiling oysters and seaweed in milk. Sounded too gross to me but I have tried having cheese, raw oysters, and seaweed at a meal and felt warmer with a faster heartbeat afterward.

Or eating a lot of starch with minimal protein over the day to get the NAD+ levels up?

Niacinamide can help with this; I’m aware you are taking energin but I have noticed very positive things from 500mg doses of Niacinamide as Abram Hoffer recommended for his cancer patients, which is much higher than is practical to dose with energin.

Would seem most potent to do all of the above in a given day, I bet if you throw everything at the problem you’ll eventually push yourself over the threshold and/or find the missing link. I know what you are going through and I am optimistic that you will find your way through to the other side.

-Voice of Wood

VDL:
I appreciate your comments.
- I have tried epsom salts. It seemed to be too stimulating (the sulfur) for me. I get lots of magnesium, from diet and supps and mag on skin (theheartoftradition dot com).

I stopped using mct oil, because I read here that it could increase allergenic reactions.

Yes, I get tons of vitamin E in my mitolipin.
Thanks, yes, I have a (low dose) iodine supp, and zinc.
Yes, I have plenty of starch with each meal, with some protein, and niacinamide (75 mg) - more affects my sleep.

 

[AinmAnseo]

I think it’s a conjugation issue from taurine into bile acids.
OP, If you have liver/bile flow problems, look into B1/B5. B5 is needed for the synthesis of bile acids. No high doses needed.

Sinatra,
My liver studies seem to be ok.
I get B1 and B5 in energin.
Thanks.
I will re-test taurine soon.

 

[Mauritio]

This is amazing info

It is indeed. And this study shows that b5 can help with cholestasis, which is blocked/reduced bile emptying into the gut,which can result in all kinds of symptoms including liver dysfunction! So B5 helps with that.

"The results of this study indicated that vitamin B5 ha s hepatoprotective and antifibrotic effects in the cholestatic liver,..."
- https://www.researchgate.net/public...s_in_Bile_Duct_Ligation_Cholestatic_Rat_Model

 

[youngsinatra]

It is indeed. And this study shows that b5 can help with cholestasis, which is blocked/reduced bile emptying into the gut,which can result in all kinds of symptoms including liver dysfunction! So B5 helps with that.

"The results of this study indicated that vitamin B5 ha s hepatoprotective and antifibrotic effects in the cholestatic liver,..."
- https://www.researchgate.net/public...s_in_Bile_Duct_Ligation_Cholestatic_Rat_Model

B5 is also involved in so many enzymes in energy metabolism. (esp. in PDH and TCA)