If You Don't Want Low Testosterone DO NOT FAST

[DaveFoster]

Smart people, athletic people, good looking people, whatever you may aspire to be do not fast. They don't. They are normal enough to wake up, feel a bit hungry and eat. They don't over think it. They aren't subconciously saying to themselves "I don't deserve to eat." Doing it once in a while is completely different, as i understand either being sick or very full one morning. Maybe you sleep in until noon, whatever. But fasting on a daily basis is bad news. I think one of the reasons Ray Peat's principles are so attractive, is that they are simple in nature. Micronutrients, carbohydrates, enough protein, etc. It all makes sense. I can also tell you right now that as a 29 year old man, i feel and look much better than i did 3 years ago. My sex drive is back. My six pack is back without really much maintenance, and i am much better at work. Ray Peat is smarter than the 25 year old bro with the fitness blog you are reading regarding fasting.

Absolutely. It takes an enveloping form of narcissism to believe that we have greater insight than our cravings. Rather than rejecting our cravings, we should understand what they indicate.

 

[Drareg]

There's no doubt that some people have had wonderful results following Peat's advice. What about those that have followed his advice and haven't had great results? That's not a small number of people. Are we assuming they did it wrong, or didn't take enough time? I've been restrictive with PUFA for 4-5 years now. I used to eat walnuts every day before that. Have I improved? Not at all. I've tried going low fat for a month at a time. Did I improve? Nope. I switched out all starch for non fibrous fruit on two different occasions. Did I improve? No, in fact both times were a disaster. I actually think I may be worse now than I was five years ago when I started reading Peat's work. The only thing I haven't done is slam down high dose pharmaceuticals to see if they would push me over the edge into a recovery. I frankly have not been impressed by what I've seen of people who take a lot of supplements. Some improve, many seem to be worse off afterward. I don't know, but I'm just not seeing wonderful results for the majority following a high sugar, low(ish) fat, graze throughout the day type of diet, and I really can't see how it's such a complex idea that so many people are screwing up. I have no idea if Gbolduev is correct or not, but it's really interesting to me that a few seem to immediately thrive on a Peat style plan, and others seem to continuously spin their wheels without any real improvement. I personally don't care who's right or wrong, or what diet will help me look 40 when I'm 100, I just want to feel well and focus on factors in my life not involving what to eat.

That’s correct,you have possibly have no idea what Peat is saying and you make it clear in your statement here,all gbolduev does is recommend supplements for people.

He discusses more than PUFA and biology relative to food or pill consumption,as in there is biological effects based on your perceptions,which one is it for you? Biology causing perceptual issues or perception causes biological issues.

 

[Drareg]

the logic in this thread then is fasting is a magic button for resetting the button.

Where do you reset to exactly?
All of you have an imaginary view of your reset self,the person you want to be is it,is it Bradley cooper from limitless? Do you just want to feel normal again? What made you fell abnormal and can you get back to before this point.

See the reality is you might before ssri or before finasteride but unfortunately this won’t work for you,you went and got an ssri and took fin asteroids for a reason so you will have to go back further.

Or is contrarian to think about building new structure to bypass the old.

 

[Drareg]

So many opinions. Here's mine; if you think or find that fasting is harmful, don't do it. If fasting noticeably improves your health, then do it.

We really don't need studies to tell us what's helpful or harmful. You just need awareness.

Cheers.

Hi James ,
Studies are awareness as is all of reality,study was needed to create the needle for your tattoo and the clothes you where,peer reviewed is an entity in itself,the good studies still stand.

Humans at one point thought slaughtering/sacrificing humans was helpful for a favor from the gods,James IV was in the crowd and was like well man ,if you like find it helpful and all just do it,here have my kid there I have too many and their eating all my avocados,I binge after a fast an all.....

 

[cyclops]

Their problems are from taking dietary advice from people like you.

 

[Drareg]

There is actual evidence......
gbolduev has some sort of "dietary Stockholm syndrome"effect on people.

 

[Milky]

I think you need to work on your conversational skills if you see that as an appropriate approach to starting a conversation.

This a written forum on the internet, which is typically a bit more relaxed than Sunday school. It's also very easy for context and tone to be lacking versus real live conversations, and even easier for your own brain to fill in the gaps. I actually think this is more a reflection of the one reading someone else's written words with the voice in their own head, so yeah. If I went by how you sounded just now, you came across as a condescending jerk. I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt by assuming that's not accurate.

Bolduev has mentioned having been sick and having cancer more than a few times in some other threads from the past couple weeks. Also I'm pretty sure English isn't his native language.

 

[gbolduev]

Drareg= copper toxicity. Get help ASAP

 

[Milky]

Drareg= copper toxicity. Get help ASAP

LOL seriously

 

[schultz]

It's also very easy for context and tone to be lacking versus real live conversations, and even easier for your own brain to fill in the gaps.

That's what emoticons are for Gbolduev, you need to use more emoticons!

For example, the post you just made above me... allow me to add an emoticon to it.

Drareg= copper toxicity. Get help ASAP

Much more playful

 

[charlie]

...many of the accounts claiming help from him are gbolduev!

Do you have proof of this?

 

[Drareg]

@gbolduev @Milky
Keep in mind I have hair and full sexual functioning.
Gbolduev still has health problems.

These guys and others online have made themselves guinea pigs fro gbolduevs theories,he comes up with new ideas and finds people to try them on,they all revolve around sexual functioning as this where gbolduev issues is,he gets other to post labs and keeps the info,they are basically taking part in gbolduevs study!
ROFL!
Don’t worry all,there are many victims all over health forums everywhere from gbolduev.

Remember the reset button,where is it do you think? Can’t find it take more copper.....

 

[Drareg]

Do you have proof of this?

I will PM.

 

[alywest]

Bolduev has mentioned having been sick and having cancer more than a few times in some other threads from the past couple weeks. Also I'm pretty sure English isn't his native language.

Umm, English maybe his second language, but that doesn't mean he has to offend people. I don't think @tca300 was out of line in his direct statement that gbolduev could improve his conversational skills. HAve you looked at the thread 'Man Goes Anti-Peat....' he basically says Peat looks awful for his age and goes on and on about his family members and how much better they look. He could have just said "Peat doesn't look great in my opinion." K! 'Nuff said! Instead he stirs the pot. HEre you go, @schultz:

 

[Peater Piper]

Fair point. I am sorry you don't feel better. I wasn't aware that so many people have not experienced success with Peats methods. There are certainly a lot of variables at play for all of us. I think the fast & slow oxidizer idea is interesting and don't mean to shoot down methods as he seems knowledgeable. I do find his definition of what constitutes a fast oxidizer, and what constitutes a slow oxidizer as strange. He says slow oxidizers already have enough sugar so they can't tolerate much sugar in their diet. While Fast oxidizers need to eat fat & protein because they burn glycogen too fast? The latter makes sense to me but the former makes no sense. I think it is interesting to put everyone in two boxes as well. Your either fast or slow. Not very logical to me.

I would ask you these questions:

1.) What is your resting pulse & Temp?
2.) How much protein do you eat?

Also, my favorite quote is below. I find it to be true in most areas of life.

"Look at a stone cutter hammering away at his rock, perhaps a hundred times without as much as a crack showing in it. Yet at the hundred-and-first blow it will split in two, and I know it was not the last blow that did it, but all that had gone before."

Jacob Riis

Thanks dude, and I'm glad you've had good results with Peating. I haven't checked these forums much lately, so it was a surprise when I come here and they're flooded with Gbol threads. I only have a general idea of his thoughts, but his point about a certain type of person thriving on Peat and another deteriorating made me think about why that could be. Obviously his theory is they're slow or fast oxidizers. I don't know if it's true or not, but there is a clear divide for whatever reason. You can also see a clear split in those who do better primarily with starch and struggle with sugar, and those who are the exact opposite (like myself). I could see dysbiosis causing some of the starch troubles, and perhaps the following explains why some people struggle with fruit and sugar:

Acetaldehyde As A Cause For Chronic Migraines In Candida Patients

Regarding heart rate and temp. My heart rate's always been high 70's to low 80's. Temp always 98+. Thyroid levels ideal by Peat. I think I've been chasing the wrong bone in regards to thyroid, whereas some people here have been blatantly hypothyroid.

That’s correct,you have possibly have no idea what Peat is saying and you make it clear in your statement here,all gbolduev does is recommend supplements for people.

He discusses more than PUFA and biology relative to food or pill consumption,as in there is biological effects based on your perceptions,which one is it for you? Biology causing perceptual issues or perception causes biological issues.

Come on now. Obviously Peat can be very nuanced and advanced if you want to get into the science, but his recommendations are straight forward. Fresh fruit and dairy, coffee, avoid PUFA, easy. Add in some liver and shell fish, keep muscle meat low and balance amino acid intake with gelatin. You can go even further by avoiding excessive fiber, estrogenic and goitrogenic foods. Lower fat intake if gaining weight. Eat ice cream if dense calories are needed. Aspirin, pregnenolone, niacinamide, and vitamin e can be therapeutic in some cases. Also, try to live a curious and interesting life. I mean I'm simplifying a lot, but the basic principles of Peat are not complicated. Do you really believe so many people don't know how to eat low fat dairy and fruit (or a non allergenic fruit juice) plus some shellfish and liver a couple times a week?

I never cared much about diet before I started feeling unwell. My diet throughout my life has actually been pretty Peat friendly. A lot of fruit and dairy. Of course the walnuts for years were a big no-no, but considering I've always been lean and have restricted PUFA for a while now I have a hard time believing I'm retaining massive amounts of PUFA. Perception can affect health, but I'm fairly certain it's vice versa in my case.

Regarding Gbol's advice, I mentioned above to Jsante that I really haven't read much of Gbol until recently and have applied none of his advice, but it looks to me in browsing through the threads, that many of the people interested in what he has to say are the ones that maybe haven't had the best results trying a Peat approach. Why didn't they have success? If you don't want people to follow Gbol's advice, then figure out why there's a group of people that aren't getting the best results with the basic Peat principles. If you believe it's their stupidity, then explain the mistakes they could be making. Since Peat, while he's espoused a few supplements, generally believes low supplementation is best, you should be able to solve everyone's problems with some simple dietary and lifestyle advice.

Specifically in terms of fasting, I've never intentionally done it unless I was sick. When my digestion goes off, I will skip breakfast for a few days in a row (about 16 hours without food) and things usually return to normal. Not much of a fast, but it's a quick fix with results that last for a while. That's more than I can say for avoiding fiber, or eating a carrot salad or mushrooms, or antibiotics, which never gave any short term or long term results.

 

[gbolduev]

Do you have proof of this?

This person needs to be banned. this is just ridiculous, Charlie. These Blatant lies are just pathetic coming from this psycho. I asked you directly to ban me from this forum so I dont get the ability to post here. I get tons of messages and that is why I come back here. But spending my time here and get this kind of attitude is just ridiculous.

 

[gbolduev]

Umm, English maybe his second language, but that doesn't mean he has to offend people. I don't think @tca300 was out of line in his direct statement that gbolduev could improve his conversational skills. HAve you looked at the thread 'Man Goes Anti-Peat....' he basically says Peat looks awful for his age and goes on and on about his family members and how much better they look. He could have just said "Peat doesn't look great in my opinion." K! 'Nuff said! Instead he stirs the pot. HEre you go, @schultz:

I discussed Peat in the aging prospective , that is all. When i see someone who does not age or looks good for his age, I say it. James looks great for his age and he is in his 40s. I say how I see it. No reason to be sensitive in discussing Peat. I did not disrespect him. I dont' even know him and never met him. I just looked at him as a body and the aging markers. And what went wrong in certain aspects of that aging to actually learn from it.

I never felt bad toward Peat as a person, I like his energy very much.

 

[Drareg]

Thanks dude, and I'm glad you've had good results with Peating. I haven't checked these forums much lately, so it was a surprise when I come here and they're flooded with Gbol threads. I only have a general idea of his thoughts, but his point about a certain type of person thriving on Peat and another deteriorating made me think about why that could be. Obviously his theory is they're slow or fast oxidizers. I don't know if it's true or not, but there is a clear divide for whatever reason. You can also see a clear split in those who do better primarily with starch and struggle with sugar, and those who are the exact opposite (like myself). I could see dysbiosis causing some of the starch troubles, and perhaps the following explains why some people struggle with fruit and sugar:

Acetaldehyde As A Cause For Chronic Migraines In Candida Patients

Regarding heart rate and temp. My heart rate's always been high 70's to low 80's. Temp always 98+. Thyroid levels ideal by Peat. I think I've been chasing the wrong bone in regards to thyroid, whereas some people here have been blatantly hypothyroid.


Come on now. Obviously Peat can be very nuanced and advanced if you want to get into the science, but his recommendations are straight forward. Fresh fruit and dairy, coffee, avoid PUFA, easy. Add in some liver and shell fish, keep muscle meat low and balance amino acid intake with gelatin. You can go even further by avoiding excessive fiber, estrogenic and goitrogenic foods. Lower fat intake if gaining weight. Eat ice cream if dense calories are needed. Aspirin, pregnenolone, niacinamide, and vitamin e can be therapeutic in some cases. Also, try to live a curious and interesting life. I mean I'm simplifying a lot, but the basic principles of Peat are not complicated. Do you really believe so many people don't know how to eat low fat dairy and fruit (or a non allergenic fruit juice) plus some shellfish and liver a couple times a week?

I never cared much about diet before I started feeling unwell. My diet throughout my life has actually been pretty Peat friendly. A lot of fruit and dairy. Of course the walnuts for years were a big no-no, but considering I've always been lean and have restricted PUFA for a while now I have a hard time believing I'm retaining massive amounts of PUFA. Perception can affect health, but I'm fairly certain it's vice versa in my case.

Regarding Gbol's advice, I mentioned above to Jsante that I really haven't read much of Gbol until recently and have applied none of his advice, but it looks to me in browsing through the threads, that many of the people interested in what he has to say are the ones that maybe haven't had the best results trying a Peat approach. Why didn't they have success? If you don't want people to follow Gbol's advice, then figure out why there's a group of people that aren't getting the best results with the basic Peat principles. If you believe it's their stupidity, then explain the mistakes they could be making. Since Peat, while he's espoused a few supplements, generally believes low supplementation is best, you should be able to solve everyone's problems with some simple dietary and lifestyle advice.

Specifically in terms of fasting, I've never intentionally done it unless I was sick. When my digestion goes off, I will skip breakfast for a few days in a row (about 16 hours without food) and things usually return to normal. Not much of a fast, but it's a quick fix with results that last for a while. That's more than I can say for avoiding fiber, or eating a carrot salad or mushrooms, or antibiotics, which never gave any short term or long term results.

Sorry not trying to come across off ,just replying fast.
Yes but what about meaning and perceptions,cultural issues relative to Peats work?
This is a massive part of it,if a lifestyle has made someone sick how can you continue on it?not in every case is this possible.
You could probably in this contemporary world solve the majority of health problems by giving financial freedom to people ,no supplements needed at this point.

But you just skip breakfast right? Can this be construed as fasting if your sick for example?

 

[Drareg]

This person needs to be banned. this is just ridiculous, Charlie. These Blatant lies are just pathetic coming from this psycho. I asked you directly to ban me from this forum so I dont get the ability to post here. I get tons of messages and that is why I come back here. But spending my time here and get this kind of attitude is just ridiculous.

Playing the victim and now abusing me.

Don’t ban him @charlie ,he does this tactic on other forums also to create a manic energy around his information. He is trying by getting banned to increase his value.
Let them follow everything he says.

This thread is moving along fine it’s memebrs of PFS thread came in here and have started this tone,the usual suspects.

 

[Palpatine]

He also mentions fasting shuts down the livers ability to detoxify. I noticed after fasting that as I resumed eating I smelled awful for a few days.

Well, since this is mentioned here... on a Testosterone related thread, and its been mentioned many times on this forum in other threads, I'm hoping someone can shed some light for me and others...

I was under the impression that the more pungent your body odor is... that it's a sign of higher Testosterone levels. Is that not correct?

I ask because I've read a few times on this forum that it is a sign of being "unhealthy."

When I work out, usually with my shirt off at home, and my wife walks in... she always comments on how bad the room smells. I laugh and own it and wear it like a badge of honor... but you guys have me second guessing myself now.

Obviously, when I work out I should be sweating and likely not smelling so "fresh"... and during the day, during regular activities I usually don't get too "smelly"... but I can always smell a bit of that pungent-ness when I wake up in the morning... it just gets super amplified once I start working out.

Thoughts?