Supplemental Riboflavin (B2) And Insomnia

[postman]

I recently began experimenting with vitamin b2 supplementation and I've had some great results concerning cognitive function, memory and learning, sexual function etc.

But it also seems to make it very hard to fall asleep. Why is this and how could I fix it?

Someone else posted this Ray Peat quote on the forum:

Over the next 20 years, my own increased sensitivity to synthetic ascorbate led me to look for such reactions in others. The same people who reacted to it often reacted similarly to riboflavin and rutin, which were also made from cornstarch by oxidation. I ascribed the reaction to some industrial contaminant that they had in common, possibly the heavy metals introduced with the sulfuric acid. The heavy metal contamination of synthetic ascorbate is so great that one 500 mg tablet dissolved in a liter of water produces free radicals at a rate that would require a killing dose of x-rays to equal. The only clean and safe vitamin C now available is that in fresh fruits, meats, etc. The commercial stuff is seriously dangerous.

So maybe this is why. Does anyone know of any riboflavin supplement/powder that is not produced via this method or is not sourced from corn starch?

 

[charlie]

Have you tried a smaller amount in the morning only? I think sometimes some B-vitamins can cause sleeping issues when taken in the afternoon.

 

[Cirion]

So.... maple syrup? =D

 

[Frankdee20]

Regular B2 or the 5P ?

 

[ecstatichamster]

Others have reported the same issue with larger doses of B2. I haven’t found it to be a problem myself but others have.

 

[somuch4food]

Which form? Which brand? I tried a prenatal with higher dosage and mostly not activated and it gave me more energy, but I had a hard time sleeping which is not great (it had 25 mg of riboflavin per capsule and I was taking one in the morning only).

Then, I switched to an activated prenatal with lower dosage and I feel like it calms me down instead (to the point that I'm sleepy, a good thing if you ask me since I haven't slept well in the last few years). It's got 1.67mg of 5P.

I don't know whether my adverse reaction is due to contamination, the vitamin forms or simply too much Bs. Just chiming in to share my personal experience.

 

[Tarmander]

Riboflavin causes a building of glycogen in the muscles, niacinamide causes a release of the glycogen so you could try combining the two.

I have found when I start using high doses of B2 I get better sleep at first and then as time goes on worse sleep and mounting anxiety. You have to use small amounts timed around meals.

 

[postman]

Which form? Which brand? I tried a prenatal with higher dosage and mostly not activated and it gave me more energy, but I had a hard time sleeping which is not great (it had 25 mg of riboflavin per capsule and I was taking one in the morning only).

Then, I switched to an activated prenatal with lower dosage and I feel like it calms me down instead (to the point that I'm sleepy, a good thing if you ask me since I haven't slept well in the last few years). It's got 1.67mg of 5P.

I don't know whether my adverse reaction is due to contamination, the vitamin forms or simply too much Bs. Just chiming in to share my personal experience.

interesting, what brand are you taking?

 

[jb116]

B2 plays a big role in supporting methylation, specifically taking electrons from B3 to create methylfolate. It's important but obviously can be disruptive to times of rest and sleep.

 

[somuch4food]

interesting, what brand are you taking?

Thorne basic prenatal.

B2 plays a big role in supporting methylation, specifically taking electrons from B3 to create methylfolate. It's important but obviously can be disruptive to times of rest and sleep.

Do you mean that too much methylation disrupt sleep?

 

[jb116]

Thorne basic prenatal.



Do you mean that too much methylation disrupt sleep?

Exactly

 

[charlie]

Exactly

What is the best way to approach that?

 

[jb116]

What is the best way to approach that?

First, make an effort to take all B's if there is the decision to supplement, unless there is clinical evidence of one of them specifically being actually deficient.
Also use physiological doses unless you are specifically trying to fix a specific health issue. The final thing that can help is using supplement B's starting earlier in the day.
This will ensure that closer to bed time the numerous metabolic activities associated with all B's are less active at that time and you can wind down.

 

[charlie]

First, make an effort to take all B's if there is the decision to supplement, unless there is clinical evidence of one of them specifically being actually deficient.
Also use physiological doses unless you are specifically trying to fix a specific health issue. The final thing that can help is using supplement B's starting earlier in the day.
This will ensure that closer to bed time the numerous metabolic activities associated with all B's are less active at that time and you can wind down.

Thank you sir, much appreciated.

 

[postman]

I contacted a manufacturer and asked them if it was sourced from corn, this was their reply

Riboflavine can’t prodcued from corn. It has been biotechnologically produced since 1990 with the help of the filamentous fungus Ashbya gossypii. The wild type produces up to 100 mg riboflavin per g biomass, the production strains supply more than 20 g/L. Alternatively, riboflavin is also produced by genetically modified strains of Bacillus subtilis.

 

[somuch4food]

I contacted a manufacturer and asked them if it was sourced from corn, this was their reply

Maybe, you should ask them what feeds the fungus that produces it.

 

[postman]

Maybe, you should ask them what feeds the fungus that produces it.

Well I don't have an allergy to corn or anything like that, I was concerned about if the riboflavin was made by oxidizing corn starch with sulfuric acid or whatever it was Ray Peat said. But maybe that quote is from 40 years ago, who knows.

 

[accelerator]

Riboflavin causes a building of glycogen in the muscles, niacinamide causes a release of the glycogen so you could try combining the two.

I have found when I start using high doses of B2 I get better sleep at first and then as time goes on worse sleep and mounting anxiety. You have to use small amounts timed around meals.

How much B2 were you taking and in what form?

 

[ecstatichamster]

Dr Peat has repeatedly warned of possible allergy to riboflavin and this fungal or bacterial production process explains that I think.

 

[Tarmander]

How much B2 were you taking and in what form?

riboflavin. Not sure exactly, but I can handle 100-200mg pretty easily now...but as you get up to 1grm per day it gets rough.