Persorption Of Starch?

[cantstoppeating]

I doubt he said "much" in much higher in that sentence. Even still, he's been taking thyroid since 1972. Most people would not be able to burn that fat off as energy instead of storing it without taking thyroid. Do you mind forwarding that email to me?

Such irony displayed in this post.

You claim others of ignoring facets of Peat when you readily try to minimise and distort his comments on fat intake. You've also shown your lack of understanding of Peating when you segregate thyroid supplementation from diet; if you understand Peating, you should understand that thyroid supplementation IS a part of the "diet" (insofar as you can call it a "diet"): it's about metabolism; if you need thyroid then take it, if you need methylene blue then take it, if you need OJ then take it. They are all moving towards the same thing which is increasing metabolism -- this is Peating.

It's you who's reducing him to a myopic collection of foods with a list of bitesized quotes.

 

[Westside PUFAs]

if you understand Peating, you should understand that thyroid supplementation IS a part of the "diet"

Wow. No words.

 

[Westside PUFAs]

It`s just like us to turn a thread relating to starch persorption, into a fruit sugar/starch debate, then into a fat intake debate.

Thank you. Those who lost the persorbtion part turn to diversion.

 

[cantstoppeating]

I never thought about that. They're just there to make the club look full? Keep in mind that not everyone can be rich and VIP or "important" would lose meaning. So I must be here looking for answers, so to speak.

Generally, yes, they're there to make the club look full and provide a busy and hip atmosphere. If you're interested Google, "harvard business case study nightclub" and you'll find a few cases that go into more depth.

 

[narouz]

Well narouz I'm not saying no-starch will do anything to the tongue or stool, but also chips and CAFO steaks aren't exactly a minor detail if we wish to give this no-starch thing some dignity.

This is true.
On the other hand:
-I had a coated tongue and not-great poops throughout my half-year strict no-starch era.
-When I reverted to strict no-starch after my health went south, I didn't get better.
-Certain probiotics, and/or Nystatin, have given me the cleanest tongue I've had since I began Peating, and it was after I began Peating that my coated tongue began. And in general I'm much improved from with those supplements/pharma med.

It could be that this is a special problem having to do specifically with having no appendix.
Our poster "thebigpeatowski," also appendixless, developed severe problems while Peating and apparently resolved them with Nystatin--again pointing pretty squarely to fungi/yeast.

Leaving aside whether Peating, or even perhaps strictly no-starch Peating, contributed to this suspected yeast/fungi problem (and I really am leaving them aside because I really don't know),
it seems pretty clear to me from my own experience and from thebigpeatowski's,
that strict, no-starch Peating doesn't help a yeast/fungi problem.
I've improved a lot, in fact, by eating some "Peatish starches" (if I can put it that way--the Peat-favored starches with butter and cooked correctly, etc), some starch-like prebiotic foods like FOS, and certain probiotics--especially S. boulardii.

 

[tca300]

I doubt he said "much" in much higher in that sentence. Even still, he's been taking thyroid since 1972. Most people would not be able to burn that fat off as energy instead of storing it without taking thyroid. Do you mind forwarding that email to me?

So your saying I added the word "much" into that email? Basically calling me dishonest?

 

[cantstoppeating]

Wow. No words.

Exactly.

That's the type of reaction one has when they realize that it's not about this diet or that diet but about the answer to "what do I need to keep a high metabolism?".

If you need to take thyroid for the rest of your life then so be it; it's a part of the "diet" as much as OJ or niacinamide is.

The people who haven't yet understood this can't wrap their heads around the fact that Peat has been using thyroid for years, or why Danny Roddy has been taking 2 grains of thyroid for the last few years, and consider it "cheating" or somehow out of the realms of possibility for themselves.

In fact, one's views of thyroid supplementation is a good indicator of their understanding of Peat.

 

[Zachs]

Masaai have CVD and a life expectancy of like 50. Not a diet you would want to model after if long life is your main concern.

 

[Zachs]

This is getting ridiculous, Ray Peat would yell at us all like we were some preschoolers.

He has no diet, thyroid is not a part of his diet, zero starch is not a part of his diet. He studies areas and gives his opinion. I'll eat high starch, low fat and feel awesome, CSP can eat high saturated fat, no starch and feel awesome. Neither of us are doing a "Peat diet".

 

[barefooter]

Anyone else notice the sunlight, movement, & fresh air in the masai pic? I'm sure those bluezones are the same. We know what makes us healthy, we're just not prepared to live a life under those circumstances, so here we are debating the best macro %.

Well said! I completely agree. There are so many factors that contribute to health and longevity, and if you're wasting time debating starch vs sugar, you may be missing the fact that if your diet is already pretty solid, it's time to work on other aspects, like making more friends, deepening existing relationships, improving sleep, spending more time in nature, learning new things, and the list goes on.

However, I would say that it's not necessarily that people aren't prepared to live under these circumstances. It's that the environment/lifestyle that makes good health automatic is almost completely opposed to modern industrial culture. In a way choosing this path is a sort of exile from the culture you live in.

 

[Westside PUFAs]

So your saying I added the word "much" into that email? Basically calling me dishonest?

I saw the screenshot you put but then just took down.

It's nothing personal, it's just that many people are dogmatic about this stuff and people have posted faux Peat quotes on other sites in the past.

I don't think people should be allowed to post Peat emails unless they forward them to admin at raypeatforum.com

There is such a thing as photoshop...yes, people get crazy with it as you can see with all of the pro-keto people who find their way here.

 

[cantstoppeating]

Masaai have CVD and a life expectancy of like 50. Not a diet you would want to model after if long life is your main concern.

Of course not. Other than the fact that the Masai drink milk, I know of nothing else about them. That was a tongue-in-cheek remark to Westside since he likes to model what he eats on what other groups of people have eaten. I decide what to eat for the specific aim of maximizing my body's continual renewal and energy production, which is what Peat refers to as eating to maintain a high metabolic rate.

 

[Such_Saturation]

Generally, yes, they're there to make the club look full and provide a busy and hip atmosphere. If you're interested Google, "harvard business case study nightclub" and you'll find a few cases that go into more depth.

Thanks, I found the pdf. I'm hooked.

I doubt he said "much" in much higher in that sentence.

I think we just attained bible studies level.

 

[Westside PUFAs]

I'm not even a "peatarian" anymore in the dietary sense but the difference between me and the high-fat lovers is that I admit it while they try to do some sort of Peat-ketosis, which it certainly not "Peat." My high starch is not 'Peat," but neither is their obsession with cream, both of coconut and cow origin.

When asked his number one recommendation in one of the HD shows, he said "avoid oils" not "take thyroid."

 

[tca300]

Masaai have CVD and a life expectancy of like 50. Not a diet you would want to model after if long life is your main concern.

I saw the screenshot you put but then just took down.

It's nothing personal, it's just that many people are dogmatic about this stuff and people have posted faux Peat quotes on other sites in the past.

I don't think people should be allowed to post Peat emails unless they forward them to admin at raypeatforum.com

There is such a thing as photoshop...yes, people get crazy with it as you can see with all of the pro-keto people who find there way here.

I saw the screenshot you put but then just took down.

It's nothing personal, it's just that many people are dogmatic about this stuff and people have posted faux Peat quotes on other sites in the past.

I don't think people should be allowed to post Peat emails unless they forward them to admin at raypeatforum.com

There is such a thing as photoshop...yes, people get crazy with it as you can see with all of the pro-keto people who find there way here.

YA I did take it down because a member messaged me and reminded me that spammers would love to have Rays email, and so i removed it. You honestly think I used photo shop? really?

 

[cantstoppeating]

This is getting ridiculous, Ray Peat would yell at us all like we were some preschoolers.

He has no diet, thyroid is not a part of his diet, zero starch is not a part of his diet. He studies areas and gives his opinion. I'll eat high starch, low fat and feel awesome, CSP can eat high saturated fat, no starch and feel awesome. Neither of us are doing a "Peat diet".

True: neither of us are doing a "Peat diet", but we are both "Peating".

I have blood values of myself (TSH, testosterone, cholesterol, FFA, prolactin etc) while experimenting with various diets. Feeling awesome can be gained too easily with cortisol and adrenaline. If you're conflicted, measure cholesterol, prolactin and TSH while eating lots of starch and again eating lots of fruit with saturated fat. You'd quickly figure out what works for you without playing guessing games.

 

[tca300]

I'm not even a "peatarian" anymore in the dietary sense but the difference between me and the high-fat lovers is that I admit it while they try to do some sort of Peat-ketosis, which it certainly not "Peat." My high starch is not 'Peat," but neither is their obsession with cream, both of coconut and cow origin.

When asked his number one recommendation in one of the HD shows, he said "avoid oils" not "take thyroid."

And Im not pro ketosis, I eat at least 500grams of sugar per day, I just think saying saturated fat in decent quantities is ok.

 

[Such_Saturation]

Well I'm low fat and low starch. Let's make a Venn diagram.

 

[Zachs]

CSP, I have actually done a high saturated fat, zero starch, high sugar diet. I did it for three months strict, my main calories came from whole raw goat milk, half gallon a day, 2-3 eggs, cheese, sugar, fruit and fruit juice. I experienced mixed results but I did not gain fat on that diet dispite eating 3k calories a day minimum.

Comparing that to my very high carb, no fat experiment I did for 6ish months where I lost 40lbs of fat and completely enhanced my metabolism by ridding my body of pufa, I have decided this is best for me. I have been back on high carb, low fat again for a few months and continue to see improvements in metabolism, skin, and other areas.

I'm at a point though where my life and health are pretty optimal and diverging from strict diets does not really affect me. I mainly eat this way now because I won't eat meat, I can't get lots of quality fruit, living in MN and starch is very satisfying to me without much else.

 

[brandonk]

This is a recent email from Ray when I asked about how much Fat to have in the diet

"Sometimes a person’s digestion is better with a little more fat, but if a person is getting enough of the fat soluble vitamins (A,D,E,K) 8% is probably enough. If the fat is saturated, I think a much higher percentage of the diet would be o.k., and can be compatible with weight control. When I ate a lot of coconut oil, as well as a moderate amount of butterfat, my total fat intake was about 50% of my calories, but I didn’t gain any weight."

This seems perhaps too obvious to me based on everything of Ray Peat's I've read. I guess I'm surprised that people here would be surprised by it. That said, I do admire Westside's pluck in making the non-Peat case both with fat and with persorption of starch. I'm not bored at all, and actually tend to learn a lot from disagreement of this kind, often when I least expect it.

Just today, for example, when looking in to the "Westy's" ideas, I happened to stumble across how to extract potato starch from potato juice (with a fine grater or rasper first, to make a slurry, and after that, with a centrifuge, adding the juice back in to further separate the starch from the slurry through the sieve). And I found this interesting page that I think makes a coherent case for the benefit of the resistant starch in raw potato starch.
http://vegetablepharm.blogspot.com/p/blog-page_9020.html

I still think it's obvious, though, from Ray Peat's perspective, why the raw starch in carrots is much safer, since there's only 1% starch in carrots and the carrot starch granule size is relatively small enough to clear, compared to the giant granules in potato starch that really can and almost surely do block arterioles and cause lots and lots of trouble, eventually. (with apologies to Westy!)