New to Ray Peat…having weight gain

[Risingfire]

Perfect thank you!

I gained so many pounds initially when I started peating. I also still consumed a lot of pufas. My advice is beware of pufas!!!!

 

[Franesthesia]

Thank you! I am close to PUFA free but just starting out so I know I have a ways to go. Thank you for sharing. At least I know it’s not just me. I thought I was doing something wrong…

 

[Richiebogie]

Hi @Franesthesia,

How many carbs do you get each day?

Are you having rice or potato with your beef?

60 ounces of apple, orange or grape juice would be nearly 800 calories, and provide you with some good sugars, vitamin C, potassium etc.

Then add your cottage cheese, turkey, beef, gelatin, coconut and bamboo shoots, for protein and saturated fat.

Some peeled and cooked potato could add a few more calories from starch!

 

[Regina]

View: https://youtu.be/3OhCZ5YEou8

Thx for the re-post.
That was an excellent podcast!

 

[Franesthesia]

Hi @Franesthesia,

How many carbs do you get each day?

Are you having rice or potato with your beef?

60 ounces of apple, orange or grape juice would be nearly 800 calories, and provide you with some good sugars, vitamin C, potassium etc.

Then add your cottage cheese, turkey, beef, gelatin, coconut and bamboo shoots, for protein and saturated fat.

Some peeled and cooked potato could add a few more calories from starch!

Hi and thank you-
I’m taking in about 250 g of carbs. I’m learning now that we need about 500g? I will definitely add potatoes and rice. Thanks Richiebogie!

 

[Franesthesia]

Thank you for such a great explanation. I’ve been told I’m not eating enough. And I am a little sicker than weight gain but I think my body has learned to cope. Your encouraging words will keep me going. I’ll have to buy some baggy clothes for the time being but luckily I’m heading into winter and not bikini season. Thank you!

 

[FitnessMike]

I started low fat and high carb and I'm losing fat at around 3500 kcal/day. You need to have good enough thyroid/liver to have good enough glycogen-storing capacity

 

[Franesthesia]

I started low fat and high carb and I'm losing fat at around 3500 kcal/day. You need to have good enough thyroid/liver to have good enough glycogen-storing capacity

Thank you! My thyroid is an issue and working on it. I’m assuming my liver is functioning due to normal LFTs unless there is a better way to measure liver function?
What carbs and fats that you eat?

 

[FitnessMike]

Thank you! My thyroid is an issue and working on it. I’m assuming my liver is functioning due to normal LFTs unless there is a better way to measure liver function?
What carbs and fats that you eat?

Enough thyroid level was essential for me to stop having blood sugar swings which allow the liver to store glycogen as i understand, egg yolks I found also essential for the liver/glycogen, check liver enzyme level ALT AST I believe. Iv had problems with fructose before but now with a choline supplement and egg yolks daily and low fat doesn't seem to be the case anymore.

look at my Crono if it helps, 70% carbs /20% profit/10 fat approx. if you live in the UK there are cheap Thriva home blood tests.

 

[Franesthesia]

Enough thyroid level was essential for me to stop having blood sugar swings which allow the liver to store glycogen as i understand, egg yolks I found also essential for the liver/glycogen, check liver enzyme level ALT AST I believe. Iv had problems with fructose before but now with a choline supplement and egg yolks daily and low fat doesn't seem to be the case anymore.

look at my Crono if it helps, 70% carbs /20% profit/10 fat approx. if you live in the UK there are cheap Thriva home blood tests.

Unfortunately I’m not in the UK. That home lab tests looks awesome.
If you don’t mind me asking what carbs do you eat?
I’ve seen listed that white bread is ok but my brain has been programmed to say no to breads, potatoes, and complex carbs. I’ve always eaten veggies which is now a no no now.
Proteins are basically my dairy and white meat, lean beef and fish.
Fats, are dairy like eggs, cheese and low-fat cottage cheese and milk.
Am I on the right track?

 

[TheToad]

I started low fat and high carb and I'm losing fat at around 3500 kcal/day. You need to have good enough thyroid/liver to have good enough glycogen-storing capacity

Interesting. Sorry if I'm hijacking this threat now, but I have a very similar story as Franesthesia and you seem like someone who may have an answer to my problem as well. Low Carb helped me lose my excess weight and all the symptoms that came with it. But starting to peat made everything worse again. I gained 30 pounds and all the fruit really didnt do me any good in terms of my liver. I have a terrible fructose tolerance and my glycogen stores never seem to fully charge up. I cant go 2h without getting super hungry and low energy again. I have currently (after 8 months of peating) stopped my peatarian experiment and gone back to a rather low carb style diet after all of a sudden losing ALL of my appetite and cravings. I was low energy and hungry, but there was no urge in me left to go and eat anything, which resulted in me depending on caffein. And whenever I didnt consume any caffein (weekends i.e.) I'd just sleep forever. 20-30h without a break easily. Like I was hibernating. It was terrible. This only started after around 7-8 months in and I dont know what I could have done better.
I tried not to take any thyroid in the beginning, as it kept me ravenously hungry, caused crazy waves of overheating and sweating and made me overeat my calories which also contributed to weight gain. But the weight still piled on even without the thyroid hormone.
Any clues on what I could do better on my next round of peating?

Sorry again for hijacking the threat.
Thanks in advance

 

[PeskyPeater]

@Rita. yeah that happens, its called the yoyo effect

low carbs slows down the thermostat of your body or basal metabilic rate by eating less caloruies. Then eating again more but not really changing your metabolic rate, you will get your fats cell filled up again because of the randle effect blocking sugar or oxidative metabolism.

so using niacinamide-aspirin-vitamin E and keeping your bloodsugar stabel every 90 minutes helps to shift away from fat burning and towards sugar burning

-edit - it sounds strange to burn sugar to loose fat, but the excess fat gets released into the blood stream and via the liver you pee it out

 

[Franesthesia]

Interesting. Sorry if I'm hijacking this threat now, but I have a very similar story as Franesthesia and you seem like someone who may have an answer to my problem as well. Low Carb helped me lose my excess weight and all the symptoms that came with it. But starting to peat made everything worse again. I gained 30 pounds and all the fruit really didnt do me any good in terms of my liver. I have a terrible fructose tolerance and my glycogen stores never seem to fully charge up. I cant go 2h without getting super hungry and low energy again. I have currently (after 8 months of peating) stopped my peatarian experiment and gone back to a rather low carb style diet after all of a sudden losing ALL of my appetite and cravings. I was low energy and hungry, but there was no urge in me left to go and eat anything, which resulted in me depending on caffein. And whenever I didnt consume any caffein (weekends i.e.) I'd just sleep forever. 20-30h without a break easily. Like I was hibernating. It was terrible. This only started after around 7-8 months in and I dont know what I could have done better.
I tried not to take any thyroid in the beginning, as it kept me ravenously hungry, caused crazy waves of overheating and sweating and made me overeat my calories which also contributed to weight gain. But the weight still piled on even without the thyroid hormone.
Any clues on what I could do better on my next round of peating?

Sorry again for hijacking the threat.
Thanks in advance

Rita-
I’m so glad you posted this. As I am super new (entering my third month) and don’t have any advice at this point. What I am starting to learn, by reading on this forum, is that I’m not eating enough protein. I was told (about 8 years ago) by a nutritionist that high amounts of protein (greater than 60g) can be inflammatory in women over 35 years old. I was 39 years old at the time and lost a ton of weight (11 lbs in 6 days!) and was told it was all inflammation. Reading on this forum, this nutritionist practically depleted me!
Now, I am learning that I am not taking in enough protein and when I think back to my ‘healthy’ and ‘my best looking body’ days, in my 20s to my early 30s, I ate high protein (egg whites, chicken breasts, occasional fish), low fat, no complex carbs (breads and pastas but occasionally would have potato hash w eggs for breakfast) and fruit whenever I felt like it. I guess I was Peating and didn’t even know it!
So, maybe count how much protein you take in. I’m going to start at 100g (as suggested by a member on a thread I just read) and keep my fat low, complex carbs super low, and increase my fruit. I think for me, the key in weight loss will be increasing the amount of lean protein I’m going to take in. Maybe if your energy is low and you need a carb, go for a potato or sweet potato….?
As I am a medical professional, do you have any medical history that can impede your process? You don’t have to answer that publicly on here but maybe something to investigate.
I felt horrible when I first started and still have bouts of it. My understanding is for the amount of years you’ve had issues, it’ll take that in months to rectify now. So I can say my issues started around 2010…12 years so I’m assuming it’s going to take a year before I see a real difference.

Do you eat fruit or drink fruit juice alone? I’m thinking maybe it’ll help to eat/drink w a little protein? Collagen powder w fruit juice is what I was told by a long standing Ray Peater. I eat my fruit w low-fat cottage cheese. Maybe eating the sugar w the protein and low fat will help…?

I can keep you posted on what I’m doing and vise versa. Maybe together we can figure it out since we are having the same issues. I have to get my labs drawn soon to see what my body is doing and I’m cringing in fear of the numbers being bad and my doc flipping out

 

[Franesthesia]

@Rita. yeah that happens, its called the yoyo effect

low carbs slows down the thermostat of your body or basal metabilic rate by eating less caloruies. Then eating again more but not really changing your metabolic rate, you will get your fats cell filled up again because of the randle effect blocking sugar or oxidative metabolism.

so using niacinamide-aspirin-vitamin E and keeping your bloodsugar stabel every 90 minutes helps to shift away from fat burning and towards sugar burning

-edit - it sounds strange to burn sugar to loose fat, but the excess fat gets released into the blood stream and via the liver you pee it out

Thank you for that explanation… I'm starting to get the foundation of this now. Would you say eating your sugar w a protein and a little fat would help one with processing and using the sugar?

 

[PeskyPeater]

@Franesthesia yes, mixed meals stimulated the digestive juice better. always eat a mixed meal. and try to have carbs into your system before eating eggs or high protein meals. for the protein releases more insulin than starch or sugar.

 

[PeskyPeater]

Would you say eating your sugar w a protein and a little fat would help one with processing and using the sugar?

this last part of utilizing the sugar is more complex.

it depends on your stress levels that can be releaseing PUFA into the blood blocking sugar burning via randle effect.
it can depend on your hormones when porgesterone is low, aldosterone increases and changes the metabolic state reducing insuline release. And estrogen that has risen may block your thyroid function.

 

[Franesthesia]

this last part of utilizing the sugar is more complex.

it depends on your stress levels that can be releaseing PUFA into the blood blocking sugar burning via randle effect.
it can depend on your hormones when porgesterone is low, aldosterone increases and changes the metabolic state reducing insuline release. And estrogen that has risen may block your thyroid function.

Ahhh ok this is making sense. I’m assuming my stress levels are still elevated because I’m having issues w hormones. So PUFA can be released despite eliminating them from my foods…meaning PUFA is caught in my tissues like other toxins? I had my urine tested and high levels of lead, black mold and plastic so this is where I’m linking PUFAs to hide too. Am I on the right track?

 

[Franesthesia]

@Franesthesia yes, mixed meals stimulated the digestive juice better. always eat a mixed meal. and try to have carbs into your system before eating eggs or high protein meals. for the protein releases more insulin than starch or sugar.

Is fruit considered a carb and a sugar or just a sugar?
If not a carb, what kind of carb would you suggest to eat before eating high protein meal?
….keep in mind I’m looking to lose fat because I put in a few pounds since the start of Peating …and needed to lose before as well.

 

[PeskyPeater]

Ahhh ok this is making sense. I’m assuming my stress levels are still elevated because I’m having issues w hormones. So PUFA can be released despite eliminating them from my foods…meaning PUFA is caught in my tissues like other toxins? I had my urine tested and high levels of lead, black mold and plastic so this is where I’m linking PUFAs to hide too. Am I on the right track?

yes, fats can have a so called elimination half-time of 600 days from the stored fat tissue. so using aspirin-niacinamide-vitaminE is the best combination to inhibit their excessive release and prevent shifting away from sugar burning. while stress may creep up and trigger release of stored PUFA, until depleted over the years

Is fruit considered a carb and a sugar or just a sugar?

fruit is a source usually evenly high in glucose and fructose, and these are both a form of carbohydrates

If not a carb, what kind of carb would you suggest to eat before eating high protein meal?
….keep in mind I’m looking to lose fat because I put in a few pounds since the start of Peating …and needed to lose before as well.

if you can handle the soluble fibers of fruit without bloating, you may eat fruit up to 1h before a protein meal. When more in a hurry then absorbing a couple of glasses of juice before the meal should prevent the stress response of low blood sugar.

 

[TheToad]

@Rita. yeah that happens, its called the yoyo effect

low carbs slows down the thermostat of your body or basal metabilic rate by eating less caloruies. Then eating again more but not really changing your metabolic rate, you will get your fats cell filled up again because of the randle effect blocking sugar or oxidative metabolism.

so using niacinamide-aspirin-vitamin E and keeping your bloodsugar stabel every 90 minutes helps to shift away from fat burning and towards sugar burning

-edit - it sounds strange to burn sugar to loose fat, but the excess fat gets released into the blood stream and via the liver you pee it out

Thanks for the tip. I was using that exact combination too.
The only thing that really made a noticable difference for me was the Vitamin E. Helped me to tolerate fruit without getting inflamed. The B3 and Aspirin didnt really do much. At least not noticable.

I also wanna add that I got into peating through a nutrition program. They just upped my calories and totally flipped my macros. No easing in. No adapation phase. I think this can also harm the body.

But I guess all that's left to do for me now is to track my daily calories, see how much I really consume in a day (since the appetite loss shrunk my stomache and I'm generally consuming far less then I even did on low carb) and then slowly shift my macros while increasing my exercise. Otherwise I fear my extra weight wont budge.
Or are there any other tips I could consider?