Low Androgen Symptoms - Tests Ok - Time To Rethink

[Spartan300]

Some vit B1, a quality tribulus product but won't bother again, zinc/selenium, some eggshell calcium and taurine before bed.
1 drop tyronene in the morning and 1 drop of tyromix in the evening

 

[gaze]

What’s the longest you’ve gone without potatoes?

 

[Spartan300]

The question prompted me to think & realise that I mainly eat rice. Potatoes 2 or 3 times a week and increasingly more often those times I'll opt for sweet potatoes.

 

[gaze]

Interesting. Sometimes bacterial fermentation from potToes and other fibrous starches can cause sleep problems. If I were you, I would personally cut all supplements, try to eat some cheese with each meal for calcium (I assume your not drinking milk if your supplementing eggshell calcium) and watch how each supplement effects your body 1 by 1 once you’ve cut them all for about a week. Isolated amino acids like protein powders or taurine, egg shell calcium, even zinc supplements can be hard to digest and throw off other minerals in the case of zinc. Have you tried this before, going long times with 0 supplements?

 

[Spartan300]

I stopped all supplements for a week recently and felt worse. Restarted supplements but did not see any great improvements until I reintroduced a little thyroid.
I should probably try that on its own.
Also it seems to be working better this time. Only difference has been 1mg MB. I'm wondering if that could potentiate it's effects?

 

[JoeKool]

Hey I read thru this thread and wanted to share my perspective as it sounds very similar to pfs. If your blood levels show good levels of said hormones, yet you have poor symptoms, similarly to pfs, it is my belief it's due to damaged or destroyed androgen receptors. In fact, your introduction of thyroid, is shown to upregulate those ARs

From: Thyroid hormone modulates androgen and oestrogen receptor content in the Sertoli cells of peripubertal rats - PubMed
The present data suggest that T3 down-regulates ERs and up-regulates ARs in peripuberal Sertoli cells.


So I'm not a doctor but i have gone through a ton of issues related to pfs, and hcg finally resolved it. In my other thread, i post how hcg even helps thyroid, so its really a strong 1,2 punch for pfs or hormonal related issues. If your interested in some reading, check it out.

 

[Spartan300]

Hi @JoeKool Having tried most everything else, this is a theory I can relate to. Symptoms seem very pfs like.

I did dip into the pfs/hcg thread for a while but there was talk of a lot of injections and that might be a step too far for me unless there are other options?

 

[JoeKool]

Well, they are insulin needles so just take a quick look when you have a chance.

Unfortunately, things like enclomid were short lived feelings of recovery whereas HCG (an LH mimetic) really stuck. Perhaps it was the length I used it at that dose, whereas enclomid was 4 weeks max. Plus, hcg's increase of testosterone really outperforms enclomid and that's a huge portion of what repairs and actually rebuilds ARs.

Still, just sharing. Something to know it exists, but Is admittedly a more extreme option and commitment. I promise though, you'll be ok to handle insulin needles. Mind over matter 100%.

 

[Spartan300]

Thanks I'll catch up on that thread. Appreciate you jumping in.

Did you discuss your course of action with your GP/PCP?

 

[JoeKool]

No but i highly recommend getting a doctor that'll work with you. On my thread, there's a link to a Joe Rogan podcast with a timestamp, the doctor on it is one of the only docs who recognized pfs. He lists some other symptoms related to low dht in the brain. He also says he used hcg and a little clomid to bring ppl back in line, hormonally. Just a good listen if you had a few mins later. Probably around page 18.

 

[ilhanxx]

why are you using thyroid hormones, maybe you are iodine or selenium deficient, you must correct them, if you're deficient, a little iodine can boost lh and androgen production.

 

[Spartan300]

@JoeKool I haven't yet but will listen to the doc in the link you mention. Is the suggestion that it's possible to have high blood dht and low brain dht?
My dht blood tests are very close to top of range but I don't think I show hight dht traits.

Hi @ilhanxx I take selenium daily and have used Lugols iodine from time to time. Neither has made a discernable difference.

 

[JoeKool]

Yes the brain needs the dht and be receptive it to it. Blood tests only show a snapshot in time. But also other neurosteroids downstream, like allopregnelone

 

[Frankdee20]

Well, they are insulin needles so just take a quick look when you have a chance.

Unfortunately, things like enclomid were short lived feelings of recovery whereas HCG (an LH mimetic) really stuck. Perhaps it was the length I used it at that dose, whereas enclomid was 4 weeks max. Plus, hcg's increase of testosterone really outperforms enclomid and that's a huge portion of what repairs and actually rebuilds ARs.

Still, just sharing. Something to know it exists, but Is admittedly a more extreme option and commitment. I promise though, you'll be ok to handle insulin needles. Mind over matter 100%.

Clomid raises SHBG over time, but HCG doesn’t