Danny's crusade against Mercola on Progest-E

[Regina]

I probably misunderstood what point you were making




With that
There are several issues or arguments going on here



For me:
Ray didn’t prosletize himself or his message
People need to find him when they are ready to hear the truth
Joe wasn't ready
Ie: He said LA instead of PUFA

The Great Fish Oil Experiment

Ray Peat

raypeat.com

He’s just not there yet imo
And that-
That can cause harm to Ray and his work because of his giant platform and ego

My opinion


Peace out….

I found out about Peat while visiting a Jaminet (Perfect Health Diet) chatgroup. I wasn't even fully cognitively aware that IF wasn't working for me. I poked around people talking about Ray Peat and at first, I thought "these are those nutty sugar loons." I'd go back n forth and slowly I began to develop mad respect for the depth of Peat's knowledge. We can't grow without being encouraged to keep searching and building bridges for more open discussions and investigation.

 

[Peatful]

I found out about Peat while visiting a Jaminet (Perfect Health Diet) chatgroup. I wasn't even fully cognitively aware that IF wasn't working for me. I poked around people talking about Ray Peat and at first, I thought "these are those nutty sugar loons." I'd go back n forth and slowly I began to develop mad respect for the depth of Peat's knowledge. We can't grow without being encouraged to keep searching and building bridges for more open discussions and investigation.

Is this the posture of a man that is seeking?

"One commercial product that Georgi and I discussed was Progest-E which the late biologist and thyroid expert Ray Peat developed..."
"...I did some research and now would strongly recommend avoiding Progest-E."

"...[Progest-E] is put into a cheap plastic squeeze bottle.... loaded with plasticizers like BPA..." [LDPE does not contain BPA]

"But, the more important reason is that it is virtually impossible to squeeze out a precise dose of 'one drop' from the bottle... this product needs to be avoided." [Mercola can't figure out how to warm the bottle to dose it?]

"M: And there's only one company – or there are two companies that do that, Progest E, which I don't like.
G: Kenogen is the company that produces Progest E.
Dr. Joseph Mercola:
M: Yeah, I don't like that. I do not recommend that company at all."




-Too viscous
-Dangerous or cheap squeeze bottles
-Stated he deletes comments
-“Im an MD. Seven years of schooling…”
- Etc


I don’t see searching, openness or bridge building here




We’ve heard the phrase
“Don’t cast your pearls before swine”

Meaning
One can waste their time by offering something that is helpful or valuable- to someone who does not appreciate it


Brokenness, humility, ill health et al are great teachers

 

[xeliex]

"One commercial product that Georgi and I discussed was Progest-E which the late biologist and thyroid expert Ray Peat developed..."
"...I did some research and now would strongly recommend avoiding Progest-E."

"...[Progest-E] is put into a cheap plastic squeeze bottle.... loaded with plasticizers like BPA..." [LDPE does not contain BPA]

"But, the more important reason is that it is virtually impossible to squeeze out a precise dose of 'one drop' from the bottle... this product needs to be avoided." [Mercola can't figure out how to warm the bottle to dose it?]

"M: And there's only one company – or there are two companies that do that, Progest E, which I don't like.
G: Kenogen is the company that produces Progest E.
Dr. Joseph Mercola:
M: Yeah, I don't like that. I do not recommend that company at all.

Now instead of a proper apology for these baseless slanderous statements he threatens to sue Danny for slander?

Georgi, Danny, and many of you here; I love you and am grateful for you.
I understand that we are all different in how we approach and deal with discord.
Had Georgi defended Progest-e and Kenogen right then and there when Mercola expressed his thoughts, the misunderstanding / bad intentions could have been nipped in the bud and the civil war prevented.

 

[InChristAlone]

If people are against Mercola making his own progesterone product why are people okay with Haidut having his own progesterone product?

 

[Peatful]

Now instead of a proper apology for these baseless slanderous statements he threatens to sue Danny for slander?

Oh…No….

Is this true?

Source? <- sorry to ask this

 

[xeliex]

Oh…No….

Is this true?

Source? <- sorry to ask this

no worries

 

[Arnau]

Oh…No….

Is this true?

Source? <- sorry to ask this

Danny Roddy

You can view and join @dannyroddy right away.

t.me

 

[gd81]

If people are against Mercola making his own progesterone product why are people okay with Haidut having his own progesterone product?

Probably because he never said untrue things about Kenogen's product and because it's a different formulation.

 

[Peatful]

no worries

View attachment 60658

Danny Roddy

You can view and join @dannyroddy right away.

t.me

I had no idea
and I’m sad

Thank you both

 

[InChristAlone]

Probably because he never said untrue things about Kenogen's product and because it's a different formulation.

Expecting Mercola to now be a 'follower' of Ray Peat is ridiculous though. He wants to be his own guru not come under the wing of someone else. So he was stating what he thought about the product. He has no allegiance to Kenogen. We need to stop acting so cultish. Honestly the bottle is pretty crap. It gets nasty over time. I preferred Health Natura's and switched to that when I was using it.

 

[gd81]

Expecting Mercola to now be a 'follower' of Ray Peat is ridiculous though. He wants to be his own guru not come under the wing of someone else. So he was stating what he thought about the product. He has no allegiance to Kenogen. We need to stop acting so cultish. Honestly the bottle is pretty crap. It gets nasty over time. I preferred Health Natura's and switched to that when I was using it.

Don't know what any of that has to do with untrue claims being levelled at a certain product, which is what people are protesting.

 

[InChristAlone]

Don't know what any of that has to do with untrue claims being levelled at a certain product, which is what people are protesting.

So he thought it was bad plastic and doesn't recommend it so that's why everyone is weeping? I really am not trying to create enemies, I just don't understand the infighting going on.

 

[tastyfood]

Had Georgi defended Progest-e and Kenogen right then and there when Mercola expressed his thoughts, the misunderstanding / bad intentions could have been nipped in the bud and the civil war prevented.

So true. I wish we could go back in time Avengers style and change that.

 

[vocedilegno]

I am OK with you believing that.

As far as I remember, that is the story — he became aware of the importance of the calcium/phosphate ratio due to that same failed wheat-germ only diet experiment. And that only after that did his heavy emphasis on milk come into play.

He still had several teeth left at the end — presumably they survived the vitamin A, somehow. Worth noting that his dental outcome could have been a lot worse for an 85-year-old who drank so much orange juice and coke and ice cream AND never got dental x-rays for a good portion of his adult life.

 

[charlie]

As far as I remember, that is the story — he became aware of the importance of the calcium/phosphate ratio due to that same failed wheat-germ only diet experiment. And that only after that did his heavy emphasis on milk come into play.

He still had several teeth left at the end — presumably they survived the vitamin A, somehow. Worth noting that his dental outcome could have been a lot worse for an 85-year-old who drank so much orange juice and coke and ice cream AND never got dental x-rays for a good portion of his adult life.

The cope is real. Many people speak of their teeth falling apart on the Ray Peat diet. Here is a recent thread in the last couple days with the OP saying his teeth are going south on the Ray Peat diet then others chime in saying the same.

Ideal diet for oral health?

Hey everyone! What would an ideal diet look like in orther to reminalize and emphasize oral health? I've been experiencing some tooth decay and gum sensitivity on a 'peaty' diet. I need a lot of calories (from 4000 to 5000) per day, I feel like sugar wrecks my teeth and am not sure what to...

raypeatforum.com

 

[Pete Rey]

Expecting Mercola to now be a 'follower' of Ray Peat is ridiculous though. He wants to be his own guru not come under the wing of someone else.

So he thought it was bad plastic and doesn't recommend it so that's why everyone is weeping? I really am not trying to create enemies, I just don't understand the infighting going on.

Put these two thoughts together. Mercola is owner and CEO of an empire. He is a shrewd businessman with a team of lawyers at his disposal. For decades his name has been at the front of the supplement industry which is a $150B/year industry. What characteristic has every tycoon shared that elevated them to the top? They are great opportunists.

Ever notice that every "brand" on Amazon looks like some random letters smashed together. That's because there's no point in having a real brand because anything that sells for long enough, Amazon will copy, sell 1000x, smash the margin, and evaporate any brand equity you thought you had. This is what made Bezos the (publicly) richest man in the world. This is the business that guys like he and Mercola are in.

Opportunity: The fact that Ray has such a following, but at the same time still quite niche, and actually invented a supplement with an expired patent that is only being manufactured by a small independent operation. The fact the Idealabs is also a small independent operation, but has proven market demand for dozens of related supplements. Mercola could make Georgi rich and his family set for life, and take another huge bite out of that $150B market cap just by throwing around the name Ray Peat.

So, you see, it has nothing to do with plastic.

 

[InChristAlone]

Put these two thoughts together. Mercola is owner and CEO of an empire. He is a shrewd businessman with a team of lawyers at his disposal. For decades his name has been at the front of the supplement industry which is a $150B/year industry. What characteristic has every tycoon shared that elevated them to the top? They are great opportunists.

Ever notice that every "brand" on Amazon looks like some random letters smashed together. That's because there's no point in having a real brand because anything that sells for long enough, Amazon will copy, sell 1000x, smash the margin, and evaporate any brand equity you thought you had. This is what made Bezos the (publicly) richest man in the world. This is the business that guys like he and Mercola are in.

Opportunity: The fact that Ray has such a following, but at the same time still quite niche, and actually invented a supplement with an expired patent that is only being manufactured by a small independent operation. The fact the Idealabs is also a small independent operation, but has proven market demand for dozens of related supplements. Mercola could make Georgi rich and his family set for life, and take another huge bite out of that $150B market cap just by throwing around the name Ray Peat.

So, you see, it has nothing to do with plastic.

Thank-you for helping me understand. I see it now (not that I thought Mercola ever had good intentions).

 

[Mr Joe]

Many people having migraines come into the low vA groups and their migraines go away. Migraines is a symptom of vA toxicity. Teeth melting and jaw melting like Ray Peats teeth and jaw melting is symptoms of vA toxicity. People in the carnivore groups who eat liver experience migraines, and when they stop liver the migraines go away.

"Migraines is a symtom of ......" You can complete this with 999+ different words depending on your current belief.

 

[Audacity17]

So true. I wish we could go back in time Avengers style and change that.

I've seen this a lot on a livestreams/interviews. Someone makes a comment, and it doesn't really register that it needs to be rebutted. Possibly because the guest is surprised, or nervous or thinking about the next point, so they just move on. And then later, they get dragged because they didn't immediately denounce the comment. And then there's like this inquisition where they are supposed to confess and disassociate. It's all childish.

 

[tastyfood]

I've seen this a lot on a livestreams/interviews. Someone makes a comment, and it doesn't really register that it needs to be rebutted. Possibly because the guest is surprised, or nervous or thinking about the next point, so they just move on. And then later, they get dragged because they didn't immediately denounce the comment. And then there's like this inquisition where they are supposed to confess and disassociate. It's all childish.

Yes, you have a point. There is also always the possibility that something was edited out. That doesn't change that in an alternate reality it would have been nice to see the interaction unfold in a different way.