Bicarbonate Vs. PaCO2 Blood Tests

[gbolduev]

DD9

WIlson is not quite sane. Some of his articles are mental institution category. He has nothing to do with ARL by the way. He is not a biochemist. I am not coming from ARL or from Wilson. I just used hairtests but mostly I interpret them myself. But it took over 1000s of them and matching blood to figure out stuff. Eck is dead, so I cant ask questions. Watts is alive at traceelements, but I tried to talk to him, he made no sense to me. It looks like Eck did the whole work and was the only one with skills.

You wont burn out your son with fruit. Fast oxidizers run low on sugar. Sugar increases CO2 and will slow down metabolism. That is why it is a no no for slow oxidizer. If slow oxidizers starts eating fruit, they will get their metabolism from sugar to fats, since body will turn off insulin in attempt to slow you down


Check out Wilsons article where he tells people to have sex in kitty litter box for modesty)) or how you need to clean your woman 5 times a day , since women are dirty entities))) HE lOST it totally, may be he interprets his tests not correctly.

 

[haidut]

I never used MB. I suspect it has antibiotic properties. If that is the case, I personally would not use it. The flora effects MAOs and when you damage the flora you damage vitamin B2 .And B2 and copper are needed for MAO A to break down serotonin.

I did not research MB , so I dont know about it. Ask Haidut he seems to know about this MB . Interesting to see what he has to say about good flora in this case.

MB is MAO-A inhibitor in higher doses (15mg+ in single dose). So, I would not use it in doses higher than even though it increases oxygen consumption several fold and cytochrome C oxidase activity by 400%+ in doses of 60mg daily. Optimal doses seem to be around 15mg daily in terms of increasing NAD/NADH ratio, reversing liver fibrosis, curing depression, etc. I think it has J-shape curve for benefits, so for me optimal doses would be 15mg daily unless I see evidence that a specific disease demands higher doses. Alzheimers disease is one such example but I have not seen other examples.
As far as gut flora and serotonin - I posted a study showing germ-free rats due to antibiotics have 90% less serotonin synthesis.
viewtopic.php?f=75&t=6409
I don't know if this reduced level of serotonin is beneficial in the long run but charcoal, which also lowers gut serotonin, prolongs life in animals. But that may be due to lower endotoxin as well.
Just my 2c.

 

[Tarmander]

I followed Wilson's advice for a couple years and did hair tests every few months. I liked his hair tests, and in the time I was on his diet, I definitely improved some aspects of my life. However my hair test person really emphasized the detoxing... aka feeling bad...but it is good for you! He would also say how I needed to do it for years and years to get out all the "hidden" toxins and heavy metals.

After awhile it started to move away from science and function and towards this idealized state that you reach only after feeling like balls for a decade.

Wilson's lifestyle choices can seem a bit odd, especially the ones about sex. From my reading of him, it seems like he is the backlash against our current salacious society. Some of his points about the harm of over sexualizing people I think are right on. I know since I moved away from constant sexual stimulation which is pretty much the norm for Americans, I have been healthier...but then he goes off the deep end on a lot of stuff. If you get really deep into his writing, it all starts to be the old Christian stuff about having a dirty soul/body and having to purify it over and over again and the more you hurt the better it is for you. Only you never...quite...get clean

 

[dd99]

DD9

WIlson is not quite sane. Some of his articles are mental institution category. He has nothing to do with ARL by the way. He is not a biochemist. I am not coming from ARL or from Wilson. I just used hairtests but mostly I interpret them myself. But it took over 1000s of them and matching blood to figure out stuff. Eck is dead, so I cant ask questions. Watts is alive at traceelements, but I tried to talk to him, he made no sense to me. It looks like Eck did the whole work and was the only one with skills.

You wont burn out your son with fruit. Fast oxidizers run low on sugar. Sugar increases CO2 and will slow down metabolism. That is why it is a no no for slow oxidizer. If slow oxidizers starts eating fruit, they will get their metabolism from sugar to fats, since body will turn off insulin in attempt to slow you down

Thanks for the info, gbolduev. Is there any site or resource you would recommend to learn a bit more about this stuff?

 

[sunmountain]

Hi Gbolduev,

I got my PHF plankton in the mail today. It's expensive, so I want to make sure to use it effectively. Are there any foods or supps I should avoid that might reduce its effectiveness.

Haidut -- what is the half life of MB? I took it again today, and want it to clear my system before I start on the plankton.

Thanks!

 

[NathanK]

Thanks for the info, gbolduev. Is there any site or resource you would recommend to learn a bit more about this stuff?

I was reading this site tonight and seems to talk a lot about what gbolduev was speaking: http://www.breathing.com/articles/Default.htm

I was particularly reading the sections on C02 (http://www.breathing.com/articles/carbon-dioxide.htm), Breathing, Respiratory Chemistry, Breathing Problems and Dysfunction. The site/Dr. even recommends plankton/algae (http://www.breathing.com/e3live.htm).

I find it all philosophically contrary to RP (not that challenging assumptions are wrong).

For balance, here's Dr. Sircus and bicarbonate. I notice he even quoted Dr. Peat and I didn't know he was a fan: http://drsircus.com/medicine/wonderful- ... te-and-co2

 

[dd99]

Thanks, NathanK.

 

[gbolduev]

Hi Gbolduev,

I got my PHF plankton in the mail today. It's expensive, so I want to make sure to use it effectively. Are there any foods or supps I should avoid that might reduce its effectiveness.

Haidut -- what is the half life of MB? I took it again today, and want it to clear my system before I start on the plankton.

Thanks!

Just start slow with it. It could cause slight detox at first. As far as food, try to create balanced diet on https://cronometer.com/. You can try to adjust your Peats diet to create more balanced diet.

I know it is expensive. I think the ideal way to heal would be to fast on it for a month or so. I am planning to do this myself soon but I assume it would take at least 50-100 grams a day which will run really expensive.
Actually I am thinking of growing this stuff myself one day)))

I think you should minimize all supplements when you take plankton

 

[sunmountain]

Hi Gbolduev,

I'm almost through one bottle. Taking about 12 capsules/day. My joints are better and muscles worse. Feeling very tired today. No difference in sibo.

BUT I also just found out I'm positive for two autoantibodies: Hu and AchR, which could explain the fatigue and muscle stiffness/pain. I'm scheduled for chest/thymus CT and liver ultrasound, and EMG nerve study.

Overall, I got more of an energy boost from a drop of Methylene Blue. I know one week is not a fair trial, but I really don't know what's going to happen next, given what comes out of the upcoming tests. And at $40+ each bottle of plankton, it's a lot for me.

So wanna thank you for your help. Your posts are appreciated on this forum, so hope you continue. And good luck with the plankton farm/tank!

 

[tara]

@Gbolduev,
Do you want to say something about the proposed mechanism for how marine plankton would help against archaea or other SI microbes?? Do you expect it to directly undermine them, or is it more about supporting the human tissue to deal with them? Do you see the chlorophyll, minerals and proteins as nutrients as the most important factors, or other components?

 

[gbolduev]

sunmountain


12 capsules a day , that is too much to start at. I was detoxing for 3 weeks on it on very little dosage. It is normal . I had crazy flu like symptoms for 2 weeks , increased fatique, could not move much at all.I guess your detox did not even hit yet, since you will have the craziest flu like pneumonia if you have any kind of infections. It is acetyldehyde, I assume. Plus chelation of lead which I found on the hairtest following plankton. My lead levels screamed up in blood. YOu need to stick to it for a month at least. I am sure it will work


Tara . The way plantkon gets rid of infections is the same as shilajit. It improves immune system by making copper more bioavailable . Copper kills them all on contact. Plankton has tons of minerals in it. And rare ones that push out mercury lead aluminium out of the cells. Lets say if you have tons of mercury you will be super low on gold or thalium , when you take plankton your thalium will go up and it wIll push out lead and mercury into the blood. Same will be done by gold. That is why fulvic minerals like shilajit or sea minerals are the best chelators, not because they bind something. NO. Because they have rare metals, Check out Mendeleevs periodic table, and see what is next to mercury lead, arsenic. etc. DO you get them in your multivitamin? NO when gold is increased in blood, mercury can come out into blood. This will cause weakness big time.

Mercury and lead are estrogen mimics. When you take them down with gold and thalium, your estrogen will go up in blood since body will think that you run low on copper and copper will become available killing most of the parasites infections etc. The actual problems that most people have is low estrogen, which causes low ceruloplasmin. Copper is not being bound and gets stored in the liver instead. When you get rid of estrogen mimics, your estrogen and ceruloplasmin will go up asking for copper into the blood

ANd if you have many estrogen mimics in the body , body thinks you have too much copper in the cell and lowers ceruloplasmin. But you have low copper in the cell and high copper in the liver. That is how people get grey hairs. Too much peroxide in the hair since it lacks copper

SO basically mercury substitutes copper in the cell making your body think that you have copper. And your copper keeps accumulating in the liver and does not get bound and slowly impairs livers ability to detox.

Many people drink ionic gold to detox mercury and I am sure it works better than DMSA or other bs chelators, but it is best to take balanced ionic supplement like shilajit or plankton or any fulvic mineral thing and it will balance everything out over time. It might take a year or so and tons of detox reactions




I hope it makes sense

 

[haidut]

sunmountain


12 capsules a day , that is too much to start at. I was detoxing for 3 weeks on it on very little dosage. It is normal . I had crazy flu like symptoms for 2 weeks , increased fatique, could not move much at all.I guess your detox did not even hit yet, since you will have the craziest flu like pneumonia if you have any kind of infections. It is acetyldehyde, I assume. Plus chelation of lead which I found on the hairtest following plankton. My lead levels screamed up in blood. YOu need to stick to it for a month at least. I am sure it will work


Tara . The way plantkon gets rid of infections is the same as shilajit. It improves immune system by making copper more bioavailable . Copper kills them all on contact. Plankton has tons of minerals in it. And rare ones that push out mercury lead aluminium out of the cells. Lets say if you have tons of mercury you will be super low on gold or thalium , when you take plankton your thalium will go up and it wIll push out lead and mercury into the blood. Same will be done by gold. That is why fulvic minerals like shilajit or sea minerals are the best chelators, not because they bind something. NO. Because they have rare metals, Check out Mendeleevs periodic table, and see what is next to mercury lead, arsenic. etc. DO you get them in your multivitamin? NO when gold is increased in blood, mercury can come out into blood. This will cause weakness big time.

Mercury and lead are estrogen mimics. When you take them down with gold and thalium, your estrogen will go up in blood since body will think that you run low on copper and copper will become available killing most of the parasites infections etc. The actual problems that most people have is low estrogen, which causes low ceruloplasmin. Copper is not being bound and gets stored in the liver instead. When you get rid of estrogen mimics, your estrogen and ceruloplasmin will go up asking for copper into the blood

ANd if you have many estrogen mimics in the body , body thinks you have too much copper in the cell and lowers ceruloplasmin. But you have low copper in the cell and high copper in the liver. That is how people get grey hairs. Too much peroxide in the hair since it lacks copper

SO basically mercury substitutes copper in the cell making your body think that you have copper. And your copper keeps accumulating in the liver and does not get bound and slowly impairs livers ability to detox.

Many people drink ionic gold to detox mercury and I am sure it works better than DMSA or other bs chelators, but it is best to take balanced ionic supplement like shilajit or plankton or any fulvic mineral thing and it will balance everything out over time. It might take a year or so and tons of detox reactions




I hope it makes sense

Another way to raise ceruloplasmin is to lower iron. Since iron and copper partly substitute for each other in cells, when you lower iron the body will compensate by increasing ceruloplasmin to get copper into the cells instead. But I would be careful when lowering iron since it seems to have a sweet spot. Iron saturation below 20% makes people very fatigued. IMO opinion Peat's recommendations on lowering iron should have a lower bound as well. He said below 25% saturation is good, but he did not say if below 20% is also good. In my experience and people I have seen, iron saturation below 20% results in poor blood oxygenation, fatigue and direct symptoms of iron deficiency. In addition, once iron saturation drops below 20%, in most people transferrin and TIBC will go above the upper limit of the normal range. If the normal range is to be taken seriously then this would indicate that the body interprets iron saturation below 20% to be a state of deficiency even though other hematological parameters like CBC come back normal.
Just my 2c.

 

[gbolduev]

Copper is needed to lower iron, Most people have low bound iron in the cell, since most people have low bioavailable copper. Unbound iron is the culpit of the problems, bound iron is needed and very good for you . And everyone is low on it. Look at hairtests, 90 out of 100 will have low iron not high. SO when you have ceruloplasmin iron will be put on trasnferrin and to me it has nothing to do with saturation at all. Iron is good in the cell, we dont have it there, we have it in the liver spilling into blood in free form and then it gets into organs in free form.. That is way different.


If you will run low on iron , your thyroid will be down and cerulo wont rise. Manganese and copper lower iron in the liver by making it available to the body to the cell. Molybdenum and b2 are also needed for this. Since they mobilyze iron from the liver stores and then copper converts it into usable form and then it is put onto transferrin.

Haidut , it is not about chelating or stoping iron, you are low on it in the cell, as everyone else. It is about making it go into the cell, instead of growing bigger and bigger in the liver, decreasing and decreasing manganese and impairing detox and spilling into kindeys pancreas and other organs in free form


And ferritin says nothing about your liver stores, if you are low on manganese you simply dont make ferritin and you make much less ceruloplasmin . As an example Your ferritin says 10. Doctor gives you iron, and you kill yourself further)).. Your liver is full of it, you take manganese and your ferritin will rise without even taking iron since ferritin was not being made without manganese

 

[haidut]

Copper is needed to lower iron, Most people have low bound iron in the cell, since most people have low bioavailable copper. Unbound iron is the culpit of the problems, bound iron is needed and very good for you . And everyone is low on it. Look at hairtests, 90 out of 100 will have low iron not high. SO when you have ceruloplasmin iron will be put on trasnferrin and to me it has nothing to do with saturation at all. Iron is good in the cell, we dont have it there, we have it in the liver spilling into blood in free form and then it gets into organs in free form.. That is way different.


If you will run low on iron , your thyroid will be down and cerulo wont rise. Manganese and copper lower iron in the liver by making it available to the body to the cell. Molybdenum and b2 are also needed for this. Since they mobilyze iron from the liver stores and then copper converts it into usable form and then it is put onto transferrin.

Haidut , it is not about chelating or stoping iron, you are low on it in the cell, as everyone else. It is about making it go into the cell, instead of growing bigger and bigger in the liver, decreasing and decreasing manganese and impairing detox and spilling into kindeys pancreas and other organs in free form


And ferritin says nothing about your liver stores, if you are low on manganese you simply dont make ferritin and you make much less ceruloplasmin . As an example Your ferritin says 10. Doctor gives you iron, and you kill yourself further)).. Your liver is full of it, you take manganese and your ferritin will rise without even taking iron since ferritin was not being made without manganese

So, are you saying that the blood tests for iron are basically useless? Are hair tests the only way to go? What about nail tests or skin biopsy?

In my experience ferritin, transferrin and iron saturation index correspond quite well to tissue levels of iron. I have seen biopsies of skin and muscle and if ferritin is low, iron saturation is low, but transferrin high it always shows as low iron in cells as well. Serum iron is normal in most people unless there is liver disease and they cannot produce iron-carrying proteins. So the iron toxicity you mention (i.e. high plasma iron but low bioavailability due to low ferritin) is actually rare. Most often plasma iron would be normal and one or more of the iron carrying proteins would be out of range. Anemia of chronic disease will have low/normal plasma iron, low transferrin and high ferritin. I am not sure why it is called "anemia", since the high ferritin implies iron overload in the cell. Iron deficiency anemia will usually (in people with healthy livers) show as normal/low serum iron, low ferritin, high transferrin, and low iron saturation index.
This is consistent with what ferritin, transferrin, etc are supposed to measure. Giving people iron usually raises ferritin and iron saturation, and lowers transferrin and ceruloplasmin. The exceptions are anemia of chronic disease and liver diseases, both of which are made worse by supplementing iron. This is consistent with Peat saying iron and copper will rise reciprocally to compensate for deficiency of each other.
I agree on the manganese, it is crucial for the detox enzymes. As far as I know manganese antagonizes iron just like copper. But I am not sure it is needed in people with healthy livers, since they can produce ferritin just fine.

 

[gbolduev]

You are wrong, Anemia of chronic disease does not have high iron in the cell. I had it. My iron was super low in hair nails . My ferritin was 400. My iron in the cell was low. I am not talking about plasma iron, free iron wont be in blood, but it will spill. Most people have iron overload in the liver. may be over 90 percent of them and most of these people are low in iron in the cell.

CELL IRON is low in most people, high or low ferritin. Ferritin does not correspond to even liver stores of iron. It is a fact

Actually the best indicator that you are getting better on hairtests when your iron gets higher.

Also ferritin shows absolutely nothing . Just take T3 hormones and check it , you will be suprised, Ferritin will skyrocket ))) WHY? Since if you are not hypothyroid, body will take iron out of blood ASAP

Also if you have infection, body will store iron in the liver and take it out of blood, and put copper there.

Blood tests alone are nonsense in this case. It gets much easier to read the patient if you have tissue plus blood.

 

[haidut]

You are wrong, Anemia of chronic disease does not have high iron in the cell. I had it. My iron was super low in hair nails . My ferritin was 400. My iron in the cell was low. I am not talking about plasma iron, free iron wont be in blood, but it will spill. Most people have iron overload in the liver. may be over 90 percent of them and most of these people are low in iron in the cell.

CELL IRON is low in most people, high or low ferritin. Ferritin does not correspond to even liver stores of iron. It is a fact

Actually the best indicator that you are getting better on hairtests when your iron gets higher.

Also ferritin shows absolutely nothing . Just take T3 hormones and check it , you will be suprised, Ferritin will skyrocket ))) WHY? Since if you are not hypothyroid, body will take iron out of blood ASAP

Also if you have infection, body will store iron in the liver and take it out of blood, and put copper there.

Blood tests alone are nonsense in this case. It gets much easier to read the patient if you have tissue plus blood.

I did not mean anemia of chronic disease has high iron in cells, I meant that if ferritin is high it is misleading/incorrect to call it anemia. It should probably be called "overload of biounavailable iron", and since it is an "overload" it would not be technically anemia.
In most cases high ferritin does mean iron overload. The anemia of chronic disease can be ruled out by additional tests like CRP and ESR. But in most cases, high ferritin means high cell iron.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferritin
"...If ferritin is high, there is iron in excess or else there is an acute inflammatory reaction in which ferritin is mobilized without iron excess. For example, ferritins may be high in infection without signaling body iron overload. Ferritin is also used as a marker for iron overload disorders, such as hemochromatosis or hemosiderosis. Adult-onset Still's disease, some porphyrias, and hemophagocytic lymphohistiocytosis/macrophage activation syndrome are diseases in which the ferritin level may be abnormally raised."

If you think ferritin is useless as a signal of cell iron then what else can be measured in blood? Ferritin is intracellular protein, so if it is unreliable then what other test shows bioavailable iron in cell? Again, are you saying that blood tests are useless and one can only do hair/nails or biopsy to get realiable info?

 

[sunmountain]

Gbolduev,

Yes, 12 capsules per day turned out to be too many. As I later realized, I was having symptoms of too much ammonia again, just as I had when on high protein diet. Stopping plankton and 1/4 tsp of ceylon cinnamon (thanks Giraffe for pointing me to Haidut's post on cinnamon), cleared ammonia symtpoms, mainly joint pain and bad memory and heaviness in body.

It's entirely possible that lower dose of say 4-6 per day or even less would work better over a month's time. Problem is now two ab have come positive: Hu and AchR, which are associated with neurological problems and cancer. Today I did CT scan and waiting for results, and July 28 is EMG study.

If the ab indicate that the immune is attacking the nervous system (?), then is it a good idea to strengthen immune via plankton?

Somehow I feel that this autoantibody business happened because of having sibo over many months, maybe a year, and toxins released by bugs caused it. Just my layperson superstition, maybe. What I read on the internet on these two ab is terrible. Even if the CT comes negative, I don't want my muscles and nerves deteriorating, perhaps even quickly.

So I want to kill Archaea asap. I know rifaximin plus berberine might not work; then I will try garlic and berberine which has some evidence. The GI thinks rifaximin plus berberine plus fodmaps will work.

Also, I am feeling intense fatigue today. Could be due to CT scan with dye.

I know you and Haidut agree and disagree on many things. I just want you to know that our forum is richer for these discussions between you both.

 

[gbolduev]

Haidut

BLood tests are useless for this. Not ceruloplasmin nor ferritin give mineral status, they do other things. They are regulatory also. That is why no matter what tests you do for WIlsons, or hemochroma - end result biopsy always

 

[gbolduev]

Sunmountain


Plankton regulates immune system, you have 2 immune systems , viral and bacterial. Plantkon will increase the one needed. Some CFS patients are stuck with both bacterial and viral load. THat is why they are stuck. if body raises copper virus goes free, if body raises iron bacteria goes free. That is why people have anemia of chronic disease. Usually it is a state where you had bacterial infection and then you got herpes. BOOM - body gets stuck. End result CFS.

To come out of that, you need to hold off virus while killing bacteria, then let go the virus and support the antiviral immune system. Not easy to do actually but possible. Usually olive leaf can hold off viruses while you kill bacteria. That is why in cancer , the best way is to swing PHs

In any case, I would not worry about certain infections in your case. You can have tons of them here and there .Usually people have up to 12-20 chronic places in the body. And to chase them makes no sense. Just strengthen the body, they will go away.

This is why you feel weak on plankton , it is working. Ammonia could be a problem at first , it will get better though. I would give plankton a chance here for a month

 

[haidut]

Haidut

BLood tests are useless for this. Not ceruloplasmin nor ferritin give mineral status, they do other things. They are regulatory also. That is why no matter what tests you do for WIlsons, or hemochroma - end result biopsy always

Understood.
So, which one is better - hair or nail analysis? Which one corresponds better to findings from biopsy?