Almost Everyone On This Forum Is Highly Misinformed

[TheSir]

ut the problem is, not many people even here really know why your health is so messed up. You want to know why? It's simple, your food and water is devoid of nutrition at the source and is contaminated with chemicals, pesticides, herbicides, and worst of all endocrine disruptors. The air you breath is polluted. You're bombarded with EMFs 24/7 and light pollution that disrupts your sleep and doesn't let you see the vastness of the stars (this latter part is very important for your mental health that no one seems to talk about). You probably don't get enough sun light and you probably never walk on bare Earth. You probably work some modern, pointless, and stressful job and don't enjoy the little moments with your family enough.

Many of the things you list are mere fine-tuning. Things that look bad on paper, but have really insignificant effect in the big picture.

 

[Quelsatron]

what's the obession with farms? at least have a cool reactionary obsession, like going to war

 

[kyle]

Who says you need a farm? A small garden plot can yield heaps of the veggies and mushrooms. The average suburban lot can have several fruit trees and berry patches for ripe fruit that you simply can't find at the store. With a little creativity you can sneak in some quail that live off table scraps. Go a little more rural with a couple acres and the possibilities really open up.

Something as simple as unplugging, trying to grow your own food and generally 'back-to-nature' in some fashion, as trite as it sounds, isn't a bad idea whatever the circumstances.

The activity of planning, working outdoors and reaping the rewards serves many 'health' purposes. And it seems completely reasonable that it can be a path toward tossing out the pill bottles.

 

[aguineapig]

Looooool

Not that I totally disagree with your criticism. But someday perhaps you will self reflect on your own religious zeal.

Being part of the hippy back to the land subculture I've known many who espouse exactly what you've described and they are just as phuqed as all the rest. But are as obnoxious as religious fundamentalist.

 

[pro marker]

first of all, op is right, I don't understand why everyone is so mad. maybe it's his tone?
obviously, you are right. but it's just not realistic for most people. leaving all social circles, the isolation, the long adaption from city work to farm work etc would have many negative effects.
i think the fact that we have no tribal spiritualism or religion to deal with the fact that we are too smart for our own good is a huge contributor to depression. also not living in tribes or big families. living around many different races is extremely stressful to me and probably the most overlooked factor in this day and age

im currently saving up as much money as I can to create the perfect balance. my plan is to get a house far away from heavy emf areas, close to nature, but also close enough to a city that I can drive there multiple times a week as to not miss out on all the fun there is to be had. ill have a farm close by, where ill give a couple of immigrants free housing in exchange for them to take care of a couple of cows/goats chickens etc... ill provide them with a shitty car so they can deliver milk and eggs to me every morning. the leftovers will be theirs to eat, along with some cheap pufa foods, they seem to love that stuff lol. a man and his wife, maybe two kids... doesn't seem that unrealistic that id find someone willing to live there 24/7 and take care of everything for me. i know many immigrants who would be content with that life.

a man can dream...

 

[Geronimo]

Wow ... so many salty responses to OP! I don’t think he’s at all wrong in pinpointing many causes of poor health in modern man. And I don’t think he’s suggesting that the solution is easy or cheap — just that, in his opinion, isolating certain factors and twiddling with them seems myopic and ineffective given the scale of the environmental problems modern man faces that are damaging his health.

No, it isn’t easy to give up modern conveniences and live away from society. It is also becoming more expensive (though, if you are determined and prepared to move, you can find a way, at least in America where there are still some somewhat inexpensive pieces of land. Also look into land and home foreclosures).

Nothing is easy. Everything is a trade off. Some people want/need to adapt to the environment they are in, contaminants and all. Others are open to a radical shift, a big gamble. Some people even try to go back to living as our ancestors did (I think there’s a German woman I saw on YouTube who does like Stone Age living retreats ... they’re out there!). It is not a guarantee of health, but maybe the problems that come with such a lifestyle are more bearable for other reasons (ie it’s nature that’s screwing you over, not some big corporation. Must be easier to handle mentally — we are all powerless against nature in many ways, so it’s easier to accept one’s inferior position, and maybe even come to respect what we can’t fully understand or alter. But to be pushed around unjustly by a human creation is much more difficult to deal with. So many things in society can create A sense of learned helplessness in those who are unwell to begin with.)

I would also just add to the list of things that are leading to degrading health in modern humans:
- loss of a true sense of community
- loss of a true sense of spirituality and meaning beyond one’s own life
- loss of methods of community catharsis (singing, dancing, celebration of non consumer related events)
- aseptic, institutional methods of child care and education, twisting outcomes in development
- loss of essential purpose with regards to our bodies, in particular with women losing connection with childbearing role and men with using their bodies for more than just sitting at a desk or staring at a screen. Wrt women, this was started with birth control, but now, given the skyrocketing rates of infertility and reproductive disease, many can’t become mothers even if they wanted.
- loss of essential certainty
- atomization and isolation

All of the above has led to a more stressed and fragile creature.

I completely agree with you on this in every sense, except OP was horribly reductionist and simplified one of the most complex situations in human history: navigating human health in a toxic and misinformed world. I do believe his ideas are generally healthy, but the idea of just buying a farm instead of studying nutrition is ludicrous. I know this because I live on a farm and study nutrition. The amount of capital and then work for a modern farmer needed to sustain themselves and make a living is astronomical. It's why farm families had 12 kids, like my dad's family. I grew up in and now again reside in farm country. It's not impossible, but good luck lol.

 

[MitchMitchell]

I strongly doubt OP knows a farmer to begin with. My BIL is literally a cowboy, pretty successful, yeah robust build good hair all that jazz, doesn’t care about nutrition eats hearty foods isn’t fat yadda yadda. Recently broke down like never before. Total burnout.

I suppose OP has fantasies about this back to nature fallacy. It’s not the external environment that must be fixed. The real goal is internal peace, reaching a point that makes the environment irrelevant.

 

[animalcule]

I completely agree with you on this in every sense, except OP was horribly reductionist and simplified one of the most complex situations in human history: navigating human health in a toxic and misinformed world. I do believe his ideas are generally healthy, but the idea of just buying a farm instead of studying nutrition is ludicrous. I know this because I live on a farm and study nutrition. The amount of capital and then work for a modern farmer needed to sustain themselves and make a living is astronomical. It's why farm families had 12 kids, like my dad's family. I grew up in and now again reside in farm country. It's not impossible, but good luck lol.

Sure, it's more complicated than taking modern man and sticking him on a rural homestead -- that's no guarantee of health, and requires a lot of effort, especially if you need to make a living off of it. But I'm still very sympathetic and open to his line of thinking.

Lifelong research is great, but it can also lead us down rabbit holes, and we run the risk of losing sight of the bigger picture, and forming unwarranted certainty about things. It can also have the effect of narrowing and rigidifying beliefs (not always) and closing us off from certain ideas. For example, how many times do you hear people saying, "I trust science/Where's the evidence?/I'm a rational thinker, where's your proof?" They've maybe dipped the edge of their pinkie toe into scientific literature, and barely given a thought to the philosophy of science, but they're willing to farm out their thinking to a handful of scientists, whose work is limited by modern technology and current paradigms, and may or may not prove to be sound in the next 50 years. To a person like this, he will need to see research on the positive effects of sunlight before he considers it a good idea to spend some time outside, or a paper on the mentally degenerative effects of busywork on the human mind before he would agree that spending a lifetime doing it may be harmful to mental health, or a paper on how even low levels of constant noise like you find in a city increase stress response in inhabitants ...

The more divorced we are from a "natural" environment, the less we're able to identify what is missing, because we don't know that it is gone. The more reliant we become on science to explain the world, the more we run the risk of becoming too rigid and too arrogant to acknowledge what a less educated but more grounded individual would consider plain truth, even if he couldn't give evidence beyond his own experience, or describe the exact mechanisms behind the phenomena.

We can't lean too heavily on one method/outlook, and risk discounting or forgetting the other.

 

[animalcule]

It’s not the external environment that must be fixed. The real goal is internal peace, reaching a point that makes the environment irrelevant.

No offense, but that sounds like a recipe for psychosis. I understand the approach, but I recall a little segment Danny Roddy did recently where he brought up the negative effects of meditation on mental health. Tbh, I didn't think either he or Dinkov really spoke well on this topic, I don't think they did enough research or understood much about meditation. Still, we are always in communication with our environment. I wonder if a healthier take is using the external environment as a way to approach the internal, rather than focussing on separating the internal from the external.

 

[Peatogenic]

I've used Androsterone + DHEA + pregnenolone + Vit A because they changed my life a couple years ago. Recently, I've gotten to where I can eat foods I experienced negative symptoms from with no issues. I feel I can eat anything now. I have really zero of the symptoms I started experiencing 8 years ago....which led me to Peat....which led me to the Rubins, who are considered Peat practitioners, but actually detoured a lot from Peat and really created their own unique philosophy, and approach things completely differently than most Peat followers. Then I was led to hormone therapies, as I mention at the beginning.

It feels like it can't be anything other than an evolution. I am extremely resilient towards stress now, like really prolonged psychologically tortuous stress too....whereas before I got to the point of completely leaving my body and feeling paralyzed at the slightest stressor. I think of Peat's quote often that it's more important to just eat something no matter how great it is. And I think this ties into a core focus for Peat is that the goal is to get the body more resilient to the stress...to become a sort of solid defense against stress......meaning that if our metabolism is working well, we are healthier eating the GMO than someone not eating the GMO and having no defense against stress.

 

[MitchMitchell]

No offense, but that sounds like a recipe for psychosis. I understand the approach, but I recall a little segment Danny Roddy did recently where he brought up the negative effects of meditation on mental health. Tbh, I didn't think either he or Dinkov really spoke well on this topic, I don't think they did enough research or understood much about meditation. Still, we are always in communication with our environment. I wonder if a healthier take is using the external environment as a way to approach the internal, rather than focussing on separating the internal from the external.

not offended, since I’m not the one who separates the internal from the external. It’s those people who blame the environment for their shortcomings that do. The vast majority of people do not understand what it means to look inside, and are actually scared to do so. FYI focusing on the internal =! Meditation or whatever. I’m a strong extrovert, I hate meditation. I know what I need to feel good, I need positive stimulation. You know what felt amazing back in the pre-covid days? Rushing to Newark to hop on a plane and fly to my GF’s city. Penn station at peak hour!! Amazingly alive. Of course my introvert friends don’t have a clue what I mean by that.

All I’m saying is both sides of the same coin must be factored in. Blue zones may have some solid diet and favorable environments, they first and foremost have strong values. All of them.

Barring extreme circumstances- stress comes from within. 2 people doing the same job might be either the chill, dgaf or the overtly anxious, analytic type. Which one is the most likely to have insomnia? Headaches? Blaming pollution and EMF?

 

[YourUniverse]

Think we're laying it on a little thick...

 

[rei]

To sum it up, you are right in some of the causes you mention but completely clueless with your criticism of the solutions. It's as simple as that.

Ray Peat's "principles" and the "bioenergetic view" is the only paradigm that offers a solution.

 

[R J]

I strongly doubt OP knows a farmer to begin with. My BIL is literally a cowboy, pretty successful, yeah robust build good hair all that jazz, doesn’t care about nutrition eats hearty foods isn’t fat yadda yadda. Recently broke down like never before. Total burnout.

I suppose OP has fantasies about this back to nature fallacy. It’s not the external environment that must be fixed. The real goal is internal peace, reaching a point that makes the environment irrelevant.

Your brother had a health crisis? Exhaustion?

 

['peataphysique]

My expectations from the thread title vs the actual content

 

[retroactive]

Oh well ya moving to the country could help. Knock yourself out. But it just isn't an option for many. So what are they supposed to do? Give up? Or do the best they can to enhance their health and metabolism? I hope they keep on learning and fighting

 

[Geronimo]

Oh well ya moving to the country could help. Knock yourself out. But it just isn't an option for many. So what are they supposed to do? Give up? Or do the best they can to enhance their health and metabolism? I hope they keep on learning and fighting

Right. You'd better learn a trade, learn to farm, work from home or start over and find a different job in the nearest town. These are the majority of the options in rural areas. This describes 90% of the people I know around me, in rural Central Minnesota. Growing up here and assimilating is pretty smooth, if you never left. I lived in Minneapolis for ten years and recently came back. To come from the city to here will require one of those paths. Most office jobs will be very hard to transfer. Money goes a long way out here as far as houses go, but land is still expensive, especially farmable land.

 

[TheBeard]

I know why most people are on this forum in the first place because I'm here for the same reason. Our health was messed up so we started scouring the net trying to look for answers that western medicine couldn't give.

But the problem is, not many people even here really know why your health is so messed up. You want to know why? It's simple, your food and water is devoid of nutrition at the source and is contaminated with chemicals, pesticides, herbicides, and worst of all endocrine disruptors. The air you breath is polluted. You're bombarded with EMFs 24/7 and light pollution that disrupts your sleep and doesn't let you see the vastness of the stars (this latter part is very important for your mental health that no one seems to talk about). You probably don't get enough sun light and you probably never walk on bare Earth. You probably work some modern, pointless, and stressful job and don't enjoy the little moments with your family enough.

To sum it up, you are living a very corrupted modern life, far removed from our ancestors. It's as simple as that.

But you probably know all that already, the problem with this forum is the 'solutions' offered for this issue.

There's no magic pill or supplement that is going to fix this. No, aspirin, a man made synthetic chemical with dangerous side effects, is not going to fix this. No, progesterone, a female hormone often used to change your gender, is not going to fix this. No, red light therapy or some other bull**** you order on Amazon from your little room that comes in a plastic box from a lifeless factory, is not going to fix this.

I know we are all desperate here and we just want a quick solution that works but there is no such thing in life ever.

You want to truly fix these problems? Get out of the city, go live on a farm, grow your food and raise your own animals, drink pure water, walk on earth, swim in a lake with the sun beating down on you and stare up at the stars and galaxies as you fall asleep.

Frank Tufano, is this you?

 

[Grischbal]

I am sweating in winter and have to go around at home without shirt and feel highly energetic

 

[Grischbal]

I completely agree with you on this in every sense, except OP was horribly reductionist and simplified one of the most complex situations in human history: navigating human health in a toxic and misinformed world. I do believe his ideas are generally healthy, but the idea of just buying a farm instead of studying nutrition is ludicrous. I know this because I live on a farm and study nutrition. The amount of capital and then work for a modern farmer needed to sustain themselves and make a living is astronomical. It's why farm families had 12 kids, like my dad's family. I grew up in and now again reside in farm country. It's not impossible, but good luck lol.

I am also from a (an organic) farm.
Cows/dairy and fruits are so much superior to growing vegetables, nuts and seeds. Not only from the nutritional aspect.
Unfortunately I only browse this forum on my mobile while in public. Would like to contribute more