*Why* Does Gelatin And Collagen Give Me A Headache And Insomnia?

[ReneeAnn]

I am a newbie and have been reading through Peat's articles and came across this one:

Gelatin, stress, longevity

I've known how healthy gelatin is for a long time and had it daily for years until I finally found out that it gives me headaches and insomnia. My guess is that it is the glutamate in broth, but I don't know if there is glutamate in Great Lakes collagen (green canister) and it also gives me a headache and insomnia. I even get a slight headache and insomnia from eating fatty roast beef. I'm fine if I carefully trim the fat, which I do.

I really want to heal whatever is stopping me from eating gelatin, so if anyone has any ideas of why it gives me headaches and how to get over it, I would really appreciate it.

 

[Elephanto]

Gelatin has twice the arginine of other animal protein sources. That may be why. You could try taking a lysine supplement (competitive inhibitor of arginine) with it to see if it prevents headaches or just use a glycine supplement instead of gelatin.

 

[ReneeAnn]

Oh! Thank you so much, @Elephanto !!! I'll keep in mind to supplement with glycine if lysine doesn't help me. I *love* soup and would love to be able to have broth again. I'll get some lysine. I don't think I've ever tried that for anything before. Thanks again!

 

[whit]

I am a newbie and have been reading through Peat's articles and came across this one:

Gelatin, stress, longevity

I've known how healthy gelatin is for a long time and had it daily for years until I finally found out that it gives me headaches and insomnia. My guess is that it is the glutamate in broth, but I don't know if there is glutamate in Great Lakes collagen (green canister) and it also gives me a headache and insomnia. I even get a slight headache and insomnia from eating fatty roast beef. I'm fine if I carefully trim the fat, which I do.

I really want to heal whatever is stopping me from eating gelatin, so if anyone has any ideas of why it gives me headaches and how to get over it, I would really appreciate it.

There's also a tendency to overcook broths which will increase glutamine content.
Many have spent time dialing in how to make broths the right way.
There are a few threads here on the topic.
Lysine by itself can spike insulin at higher doses so be warned. Glycine is preferred in this case.
Collagen also needs to be fully hydrated or it can give digestive issues to some.
Hope this helps.

 

[achillea]

Neurologist Dr. Blaylock has spent 30 years studying glutamate and says it is best to stay away from gelatin if it effects you negatively. You need glutamate but not much of it. If you will notice Great Lakes says it has no MSG in it which is good but the imbalance of aspartate and arginine and glutamic acid is bad news. For some gelatin and collagen can be an unbearable excitotoxin. Excitotoxins can lead to headaches and insomnia as well as more dire health issues. Excitatoxins in the form of MSG, aspartate, natural flavors,hydrolyzed protein, carageenen and many other additives as well as gelatin and collagen are something to try to stay away from especially if you get headaches and/or insomnia.

 

[EIRE24]

Neurologist Dr. Blaylock has spent 30 years studying glutamate and says it is best to stay away from gelatin if it effects you negatively. You need glutamate but not much of it. If you will notice Great Lakes says it has no MSG in it which is good but the imbalance of aspartate and arginine and glutamic acid is bad news. For some gelatin and collagen can be an unbearable excitotoxin. Excitotoxins can lead to headaches and insomnia as well as more dire health issues. Excitatoxins in the form of MSG, aspartate, natural flavors,hydrolyzed protein, carageenen and many other additives as well as gelatin and collagen are something to try to stay away from especially if you get headaches and/or insomnia.

I know for a fact it was gelatin that was not prepared properly while I was making jello that made me violently sick. Ever since I've had awful acne and can not get rid of it

 

[ReneeAnn]

@whit , thanks I'll look up the broth cooking threads. I had heard about over cooking and experimented with 45 minutes in a pressure cooker, but still had the same results. Thanks for the lysine insulin spike tip. I have normal insulin and glucose test results. I have a glucometer at home. Would that give me a hint for raised insulin? If I try collagen again, I'll make sure it is fully hydrated. If I can drink broth, I will stick with that.

@achillea , thanks! Yes, I have been avoiding. Not a fan of headaches. If I can get the broth to work, I will stick with that. I was experimenting with the collagen out of desperation not being able to tolerate homemade broth.

Wow, @EIRE24 , that sucks.

 

[EIRE24]

@whit , thanks I'll look up the broth cooking threads. I had heard about over cooking and experimented with 45 minutes in a pressure cooker, but still had the same results. Thanks for the lysine insulin spike tip. I have normal insulin and glucose test results. I have a glucometer at home. Would that give me a hint for raised insulin? If I try collagen again, I'll make sure it is fully hydrated. If I can drink broth, I will stick with that.

@achillea , thanks! Yes, I have been avoiding. Not a fan of headaches. If I can get the broth to work, I will stick with that. I was experimenting with the collagen out of desperation not being able to tolerate homemade broth.

Wow, @EIRE24 , that sucks.

Ya sure does. I'm pretty sure it was some sort of endotoxin or other contaminants that were in it. Still haven't had a clear face for a full week since.

 

[ReneeAnn]

@EIRE24 , I first learned that even natural glutamate in broth can be harmful to some people in this article. Not Ray Peat, but Chris Kresser is pretty trustworthy. Of course, it could be other contaminants as you said. Just something to watch out for since you had such a bad reaction.

Beyond MSG: Could Hidden Sources of Glutamate Be Harming Your Health?

 

[superhuman]

its because you dont dissolve it properly

 

[ReneeAnn]

@superhuman , the main thing is real homemade broth. There is nothing to dissolve. You simmer bones in filtered water.

 

[superhuman]

@ReneeAnn ahh ok sorry. Then for people using gelatin powder be sure to do that :P because i had the sickest headaches ever imagine when i did not dissolve it properly

 

[ReneeAnn]

 

[milk_lover]

I am starting to question glycine supplements. I've tried it many times and each time it bloats me and gives me water retention. It's pure glycine powder from Now Foods. Taurine on the other hand, although it has additives (GNC brand), heats me up and it gives me positive results generally speaking. For glycine, why don't you stick with gelatinous cuts of lamb or beef? They are usually easier to digest. Glycine/gelatin has always been a tricky issue for me tbh.

 

[ReneeAnn]

@milk_lover , Some supplements just depend on the person. I think I do well with glycine, but will know more tomorrow after taking it with meals today, but taurine gives me a headache.

I'd much rather rely on homemade broths and gelatinous cuts of beef, but they give me a headache, while lean beef does not. That is exactly the problem I'm trying to solve. I've ordered some lysine to experiment with, too.

 

[Sucrates]

High endotoxin isn't uncommon in gelatin. Some people do better with other brands.

 

[lollipop]

High endotoxin isn't uncommon in gelatin. Some people do better with other brands.

Interesting and makes sense. From the processing? From the quality of the animals and what they are fed?

 

[ecstatichamster]

Home made broths can be high in histamine which bothers many people.

 

[ReneeAnn]

@ecstatichamster , histamine does bother me. Would the Great Lakes green can gelatin also be high histamine? And, fatty meats? I get headaches from all of these, but eat lean beef just fine.

 

[ecstatichamster]

i think any product that comes from animals that sit around will create histamine. I think collagen and gelatine probably has histamine

Does Processed Gelatin Have Histamine in it? - Ray Peat Q&A