Piperine from black pepper is Anti-testosterone & progesterone - toxic and serotonergic

[cs3000]

Piperine is added to some supplements, and black pepper is common in food cupboards / with dinners. Apparently can be 3% piperine - 5% piperine in black pepper but varies alot

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/318704358_Reversible_Testicular_Toxicity_of_Piperine_on_Male_Albino_Rats

Feeding ~100mg-150mg piperine human equivalent to rats is toxic to testicles. lowers testosterone (+ progesterone) & leydig cell function

Our study result suggests that piperine disrupted the functional integrity of the testis by altering the germ cell markers, antioxidant
status, and testicular hormones. These biochemical study results were further reinforced by histopathological observation of hypospermatogenesis on piperine treatment.
However, the toxic effects of piperine were reversed affer the drug‑free withdrawal period of 60 days.

Feeding every 4 days shows significant toxic effect on testicles & testosterone / progesterone.
and 1x a week milder but still a toxic effect, -10% testosterone

the 1x a week dose is closest to typical intake for someone who eats black pepper multiple times a week or takes a supplement with piperine

so assuming spread out has same impact, ~15mg a day for the E7D damage level. or ~30mg for the E4D damage / testosterone reducing level

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in vitro studies have shown anti growth effects on cancers, but its not just the toxicity because some state estrogen B receptor increases with estrogen A decrease.
estrogen receptor part different than what i expected. wonder if its estrogenic in normal brain cells or not

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Its serotonergic so has potential to raise irritability dissociation depression etc
Antidepressant-like effects of piperine and its derivative, antiepilepsirine - PubMed

In contrast, chronic treatment of PIP only enhanced the serotonin level in the hypothalamus and hippocampus but did not influence the dopamine level. The MAO activity assay also indicated that PIP and AES showed a minor MAO inhibitory activity

^
shows raises serotonin without raising dopamine ,
might think serotonin is rising because of receptor antagonism some studies reference it but from personal experience the acute effect is very serotonergic. and not anti depressant
so if there is a different longer term effect through 5ht1a (anti serotonin) receptor increase as response to the serotonin increase, its a shitty way to get there with a toxic molecule. and if its the bdnf response theres other things that create that
also complexities to consider about where the serotonin is being raised preferably

I did an experiment a while ago trying black pepper for unrefreshing sleep. think it was 1/2 or 1/4 teaspoon.
it didnt help sleep quality and i felt absolutely SH*T for 2 days after,
Clearly potent serotonergic state which was very recognisable -
it caused major irritability + drowsy fatigue + flat mood + dissociated weird quality to experience. I said out loud "man i actually feel autistic rn wtf". then i looked into it and read the link between mao-a inhibition and serotonin rise, and autism - serotonin - mao-a loss association.

Aggressive Behavior and Altered Amounts of Brain Serotonin and Norepinephrine in Mice Lacking MAOA
Cloning, after cloning, knock-out mice, and physiological functions of MAO A and B
From aggression to autism: new perspectives on the behavioral sequelae of monoamine oxidase deficiency

 

[xeliex]

Wow, thanks for sharing.
How does that translate into practical life with the quantity equivalents?
Might taking a couple of supplements that have Piperine in the ingredients pose such risks?

 

[tasfarelel]

Reading the following should tell you that you cannot establish any negative/positive properties of a substance based on one study:

Diverged Effects of Piperine on Testicular Development: Stimulating Leydig Cell Development but Inhibiting Spermatogenesis in Rats

Background: Piperine is the primary pungent alkaloid isolated from the fruit of black peppercorns. Piperine is used frequently in dietary supplements and traditional medicines. The objective of the present study was to investigate the effects of piperine ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I'm 98,56% that piperidine is largely neutral. I had to take around 2g 98% pure piperidine in one day to feel any adverse effects. This was for my usual sensitivity test when I have a new substance.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

I love black pepper, but gave it up because it is on the list of things to avoid for my blood-type. Ray Peat also says to avoid it. And now with what you posted here @cs3000 it’s a three strikes and you’re out pepper!