Observations On This Intermittent Fasting Adventure

[ecstatichamster]

So I've been intermittent fasting again. I used to enter minute fast while I was doing a low-carb diet. I would fast until 4 PM and then I would eat between 4 and 8 PM.

This time, I'm eating breakfast and lunch and just stop eating after about 2 PM. I'm never that hungry around dinner but it isn't easy and I am hungry especially when I wake up. I feel like later at night I'm not exactly hungry but I kinda missed something to eat or drink. I was just drinking nothing other than some water and yesterday I had a little bit of orange juice at night.

I haven't lost any weight this way at all.

I am geting what I think is plenty of calories during my eating window so it can't be that I'm not getting enough calories.

However I have observed that I have far lower endotoxin challenges and for the first time in quite a while now, my butt doesn't hurt. I don't have inflammation down there basically. So that's a good sign. I've been more lenient on weekends and I take charcoal then, but I don't take it any other time and don't need it.

 

[Jsaute21]

So I've been intermittent fasting again. I used to enter minute fast while I was doing a low-carb diet. I would fast until 4 PM and then I would eat between 4 and 8 PM.

This time, I'm eating breakfast and lunch and just stop eating after about 2 PM. I'm never that hungry around dinner but it isn't easy and I am hungry especially when I wake up. I feel like later at night I'm not exactly hungry but I kinda missed something to eat or drink. I was just drinking nothing other than some water and yesterday I had a little bit of orange juice at night.

I haven't lost any weight this way at all.

I am geting what I think is plenty of calories during my eating window so it can't be that I'm not getting enough calories.

However I have observed that I have far lower endotoxin challenges and for the first time in quite a while now, my butt doesn't hurt. I don't have inflammation down there basically. So that's a good sign. I've been more lenient on weekends and I take charcoal then, but I don't take it any other time and don't need it.

Do you still take thyroid or any supplements? Just curious.

 

[ecstatichamster]

Do you still take thyroid or any supplements? Just curious.

Tyromix and tyronene

Thiamine, niacinamide, collagen, B6, riboflavin, K2, mg threonate

 

[ecstatichamster]

I am IFing about 4 or 5 days a week. Lately been skipping breakfast and lunch and eating dinner for social reasons.

I've been waking up and consuming multiple cups of strong coffee with a ton of sugar (but no milk). And drinking a little juice maybe. So it isn't a complete fast.

Seems to be helpful. I can work and focus all day and feel a lot better overall.

Besides the tyromix/tyronene I also take some K2/A/mitolipin/E topically, and maybe 3 or 4mg of progesterone, and pansterone equalling about 4mg of pregnenolone and 4mg of DHEA topically.

Seems to be stable and helpful. High libido, mental clarity. I am a little tired sometimes which I think may have to do with the coffee, but not sure.

 

[Soren]

What was your original IF experience?

I did it for nearly 2 years and it completely ruined me. Hair loss, baggy eyes, bad skin, insomnia, lack of energy, cold hands and feet. I did not exactly do it perfectly all the time and that I think was a major problem. I went with the muscle through mentality and approach which was a big mistake. Was great at first; fat loss mental clarity, but then it stalled and I found it harder to keep the weight off despite fasting more and more. Sleeping became very difficult due to chronically elevated stress hormones due to under-nourishment.

I think if I were to ever do it again, I'd only do it under circumstances where it was very organized, no missing meals, going to bed at a regular hour etc.

Seems to me though that virtually any version of fasting is pretty anti-peat. Although I am open to trying it again but remain very cautious and skeptical. I'd much rather get my weight down due to an improved metabolic rate.

Are the supplements you're taken designed to mitigate/prevent the rising of stress hormones that fasting inevitably brings about. I'm thinking of cortisol, adrenaline etc. Could the mental clarity be down to the rise in stress hormones? There are many who argue that this is what causes the IF mental clarity/libido effect.

Are you not worried about fat loss rebound effect? I don't know about for the short term but I know after doing IF for nearly 2 years when I went back to eating regularly I put on a lot of weight.

Is your plan to do this for a short period of time or as a lifestyle change?

 

[raypeatclips]

I have recently not been eating after dinner (7-8pm) and going to bed and waking up around 10am and then eating breakfast, so sometimes going 14 hours without food. I "feel" like not constantly eating would be good for digestion, allowing the gut to have a break, but not noticed anything that would suggest this that I can tell. My stomach looks nice and flat on a morning. I have noticed that doing this induces a bowel movement shortly after eating, so within 30-60 minutes of my breakfast im on the toilet. Not sure what this signifies however.

 

[lvysaur]

What I know for sure is that I never get gas when I'm hungry.

If I eat when I'm not hungry, I can get gas, which probably means endotoxin.

 

[CLASH]

I have been doing a 14-16 hour fast as well out of neccesity for my current job situation. I work from 3-11pm and most nights i dont get home till 1 or 2am so I wind up waking up at 10am and then i shower and cook so I dont eat till 11am. I have my last meal around 8 or 9 most nights. Doing this I have noticed that my bowels have been significantly better overall (on top of removing starch, dairy and most vegetables besides carrots). I also leave 3-4 hours between meals so I wind up eating 3 meals a day. With this all in mind I did a little reading as to why this may be helping with the bowels. Apparently the intestine has a system of timed electrical activity corresponding to muscular contraction called the migrating motor complex. These cyclical contractions carry bacteria and food throughout the small intestine to the large intestine (the food only if its not digested). The migrating motor complex takes about 180 minutes for a full cycle. So basically 3 hours from when you finish eating. I think that part of peoples SIBO issues is from eating too often. Everytime food hits the stomach again the migrating motor complex is inhibited. So to limit endotoxin and bacterial issues overall it seems it would be prudent to spread eating times to 3 hours apart from the end of the last meal till the beginning of the next meal. This in conjunction with avoiding starch, and taking in fruit juice and some non-irritating vegetable fibers like carrot would compound the effect I think (i have been doing this for a few months now and I feel significantly better, the reason I stipulate “I think” is because Im currently experimenting with different juices so I can get off the soda).

This leads us to the issue with this method: lasting between meals. Luckily before I did this I did some reading and hypothesizing (you can see this in kreeese’s thread on losing fat), and what i did was increase my saturated fat intake dramatically. I am currently eating 140-160g of saturated fat from beef tallow and meat a day. Doing this I not only dropped 7lbs of water weight off of my abdomen in a week, I also last longer between meals, am warmer, have no more adrenaline rushes, my intestines work much better with regular bowel movements and no bloating, and I have been mentally much clearer. In conjunction to the 140-160g beef fat I have been taking in 250g of sugar from soda (im switching to juice now) and 120g of protein from red meat (fiber is from carrots). I did this diet for 2 months straight only deviating to eat a little chocolate here and there (i also tried to incorporate kale 2x and spinach once but they both slowed my digestion and gave me tinnitus and sores in my mouth??). Once I add juice the only significant nutrient that will be missing missing from the diet is calcium (leaved and dairy are off the table).

 

[Soren]

Anyone try the 5:2 version of fasting? 5 days a week of normal eating and 2 days of "fasting". Its basically just dieting to very low calories two days a week. So instead of having a calorie deficit everyday that constantly increases stress hormones. You have two days where you eat only 500 calories. I'm still not convinced that this is healthy but it might be better than daily having the body in a fasted state whereby stress hormones are constantly elevated.

Study:
Weekly 2-Day Fast (5:2 Diet) as Effective for Losing Weight and Waist as Continuous Dieting (-500kcal Every Day)

 

[Soren]

Pretty decent article on the varying forms of Intermittent fasting for lifters. Talks a good amount about the issue of cortisol.

Why Intermittent fasting fails most people

Fasting, Cortisol, Personality, and Gains
"If someone produces more cortisol it will be damn near impossible for them to build muscle with IF. And someone who produces a low amount of cortisol will have an easier time building it while fasting."

"Think of these low cortisol producers as the neuro type 1A and 1B personalities. These are people who have a high level of confidence, are very competitive, and don't get stressed easily.
Type 2A can gain a small amount of muscle with IF while Type 2B and 3 will lose muscle on it. These guys are people pleasers. Those who have less self-confidence and need others to like them. They need to feel respected to feel good about themselves. They want to be good and look good, but not because they're competitive, rather because they need the respect and admiration of others."

"Type 3 are also more likely to gain fat from IF. Why? Because they have the highest cortisol levels of all; it's constantly elevated. Systemic cortisol elevation can decrease T3 (active thyroid hormone) by decreasing the T4 to T3 conversion. And it can also make you insulin resistant.
Both responses will make it harder to lose fat and easier to gain it. These guys are those with the most anxiety. They are routine-based people, they prefer to always do the same thing over and over and follow a plan or structure. They often worry a lot because they can't switch off their brains, which often makes it hard for them to sleep properly."

 

[ecstatichamster]

I'm still occasionally doing IFing, mostly drinking coffee with a lot of sugar, and some juice, until dinner time. I don't think this helps fat loss much for me but I feel better. I think my gut is less problematic when I do it. It has been shown to lower endotoxins.