Loosing hair and feeling confused! Newbie of Peat diet.

[j.]

If cholesterol is low, maybe pregnenolone production suffered, so maybe take pregnenolone.

 

[Mittir]

T3 can increase conversion of cholesterol to pregnenolone, DHEA, progesterone
with the help of vitamin A. So only T3 use can lower cholesterol.

 

[north]

Would it be bad to take T4 even if cholesterol is low?
Or how long would be reasonable to wait before testing cholesterol again?
Im getting a bit frustrated of my changing mood, i want to feel better faster, ups and downs are affecting me to much in everydaylife.

 

[staytuned]

My experience it isn't too hard to raise cholesterol... just add some butter, coconut oil and full-fat dairy plus the usual fish, etc.

That being said, cynoplus may make you feel great if this is all driven by thyroid... have you had a full blood panel done?

 

[north]

I've been on peat (high sugar high saturated fat) since December. Measured cholesterol mid feb. Maybe it takes longer then that for it to get higher.

I have had the tests I posted earlier, but they are very reluctant to give me complete tests here and even the private lab I've found doesn't even offer total t3/4 only free, and no rT3. When I was at the endocrine doc she told me "cholesterol doesn't have anything to do with thyroid!! You shouldn't read stuff online go on with your everyday life!" :-/
I'm going to a new place Monday morning to try and get t3 to complement t4 with.

 

[Mittir]

High cholesterol is one of the most common symptoms of hypothyroidism.
Some people do have low cholesterol while hypothyroid. RP commented that
high starch consumption is a common cause and hypothyroidism also can
cause this by weakening liver. Because thyroid supports liver's ability to
make cholesterol. He thinks fruit juice is the best way to raise cholesterol.

 

[north]

Will keep OJ as high as possible. Currently about 1,5 - 2L per day with about 1g sodium per L. Also doing coconut oil about 40-60g per day. How long should I wait before testing cholesterol again?

 

[j.]

cholesterol doesn't have anything to do with thyroid!!

wow. which country is this?

 

[j.]

Would it be bad to take T4 even if cholesterol is low?

Peat usually advises against taking T4 without T3.

 

[Mittir]

This following study showed significant increase in cholesterol in 2 weeks with Fructose and
HFCS ,but not with glucose. Replacing fat intake with sugar can help here.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3200248/
Your cholesterol level is very close to cut off value.
RP mentioned that starting with very small dose of T3
with meal will give an idea how it is working.
Sometime few days of using T3 can break the stress cycle
and let thyroid fix itself. Otherwise you will be able to convert
T3 dose into T3 and T4 mix. In your case small amount of T3 can
energize your liver. You can also start with small dose T4+T3 mix.
Even without supplement, you can try fish head or chicken neck
soup as test. It works just like thyroid supplement.

RP's description of thyroid dosing.

THYROID (DOSE/BRANDS)

Are there any combination products, such as Thyrolar or Cynoplus, that you can get in Spain? It's good to start with a small amount, such as 5 mcg of T3 twice a day, while watching for changes in your pulse rate, temperature, and ability to sleep. Half a grain of Armour, or about 30 mcg of T4 and 7.5 mcg of T3, is traditionally a common starting dose; it should be taken with a meal, so that it absorbs slowly. Taking a very small amount at bedtime usually helps with insomnia.

Try a sixth of a 25 mcg cynomel tablet at first, and watch for the effects in the first two hours. According to what you notice, you could continue that once a day, or twice a day, for about 10 days, then you could try some with each meal, for another week. #2 and #3: when you find out how the T3 affects you, you could change to the combination (Armour or Thyrolar or Cynoplus); the amounts I mentioned would be similar to 12 mcg of T3 per day.

It depends on what you notice from taking a small amount with meals. If it makes you feel pleasant, calm, confident, then trying it at bedtime would be right.

25 mcg of T3 has approximately the activity of a grain (65 mg) of thyroid gland; is ERFA the only one available? A synthetic thyroxine could be combined with the Cynomel. Since the European products aren't necessarily the same as those made elsewhere, and a person's requirements are variable, it's essential to start with small amounts, watching for the effects, including pulse rate and temperature. T4 builds up slowly in the tissues, over about 14 days, but the T3 acts immediately. With any product, a single dose of T3 of about 4 mcg is close to the physiological range; sometimes a smaller amount is enough.

As long as it's divided so that you don't get a big dose of T3 all at once it should be o.k. to take a total of 25 mcg T3 and 100 of T4.That would be similar to the traditional 2 grain dose of Armour thyroid. A healthy person should produce the equivalent of about four grains per day, so with 2 grains of supplement, or the equivalent, there isn't a risk of over-dosing.

I use Cynomel and Cynoplus mostly, but they come in only one size, so I cut the tablets into about ten parts.

Thyroid is the only thing that safely lowers cholesterol, but when your stress hormones are very high, you shouldn't take more than about one microgram of Cytomel at a time, and should accompany it with things like milk and orange juice.

Twice a day should be o.k., [CYTOMEL] but every day you should make a note of your pulse rate and temperature, and in a week or ten days you should be able to see a progression.

Sometimes it takes many months to get the metabolic rate stable at a higher level, and it's often necessary to use a thyroid supplement.

It [CYTOMEL] improves the retention of magnesium, and cellular relaxation, and some people want to have a nap in the afternoon when their thyroid is good.

If you use some T3 (such as Cytomel or Cynomel) it's important to keep each dose small, while watching for changes in your pulse and temperature. Usually 4 or 5 mcg at a time is o.k. (the body makes about 4 mcg per hour). I don't think there's likely to be any problem using desiccated thyroid if the product is good, but because of changing manufacturing methods, that's largely a matter of trial and error. Low ferritin is often a result of hypothyroidism. The need for thyroid increases greatly during the winter in high latitudes, for example when I needed half a grain in the summer, I had to increase it to two grains during the winter. When cholesterol is high, that can make it easier to adapt to a thyroid supplement, since the thyroid will stimulate the conversion of cholesterol into progesterone and the adrenal hormones.

I have heard from a few people using it, one thinks it doesn't work , but I haven't heard enough details to form an opinion yet. [THIROYD by Greater Pharma]

Armour thyroid, USP, was the standard thyroid used widely for about 80 years. Since ownership of the product name was bought by Revlon and then a series of other companies, I'm not sure anything of the simple original formula remains; maybe magnesium stearate, I haven't looked lately.

With your TSH so high, you should probably add a thyroid supplement, until you get it down to about 1.0, or less. (The normal range, according to the American Association of Clinical Endocrinologists, is from 0.3 to 3.0.)

A few years ago I had some communication from a pharmacist at Forest Pharmaceutical, and he said that over ten years ago they began having thyrocalcitonin extracted from the pig thyroid powder to sell separately as a new drug. I think that left stearic acid as the only ingredient the current product might have in common with traditional Armour thyroid, USP. I don't use any product containing fumed or colloidal silica, or titanium, or various novel polymers, or coloring agents

I use Cynoplus (contains T4 and T3) and Cynomel (T3 only) that I usually get from http://www.mymexicandrugstore.mx. There is only one size tablet, and a fourth of a tablet is a typical starting dose.

T3, by lowering stress, sometimes reveals a low basal metabolic rate, that was hidden by high stress hormones. The body produces about 4 mcg of T3 per hour, so taking more than that can interfere with regulatory processes. It's helpful to use the resting pulse rate, and the 24 hour temperature curve, along with other signs, such as mood, appearance of veins on the hands, etc. The peak temperature should be in the afternoon.

I occasionally see that happen [T3 WILL CAUSE LOW TEMP/PULSE]; sometimes people have had their pulse rate decrease 40 or 50 beats per minute. The temperature of your fingers, toes, and nose helps to interpret the balance between stress and thyroid; your fingers should be less cold as your metabolic rate comes up. In extreme hypothyroidism, the hands and feet can be very cold while the oral temperature looks o.k.; then as the metabolic rate increases, the difference between fingers and mouth decreases.

When I used only Cytomel, any little stress would make me suddenly hypothyroid, and my heart would stop several times in a minute; when I started using some thyroid, USP, that contained both T4 and T3 it stopped happening.

Experimenters using isotopes gave large doses of thyroid until the subjects' glands were completely shut off, and when they stopped giving the doses, everyone's gland returned to normal activity in just 2 or 3 days. The gland is extremely quick to adjust its activity, both up and down, except when it's inhibited by stress, or PUFA, or estrogen, etc. [TAKING THYROID WILL HAVE LONG-TERM EFFECTS]

The temperature rise during the day is the most important thing, since nocturnal stress hormones can give a misleading impression in the morning. Resting pulse rate is another good indicator. Milk and cheese are the best calcium sources.

NOT RESPONDING TO THYROID

If you are eating enough protein, about 100 grams, and salt and thyroid, then I would consider the steroids--something might be interfering with your production of pregnenolone and DHEA. Things that could do that would be very low cholesterol, or a deficiency of vitamin A (retinol), or possibly other deficiencies.

If your cholesterol is above 200, and the thyroid supplements didn't warm you up, it's possible that something is interfering with your steroid synthesis, which might be a deficiency of something like vitamin A, or interference from something like iron or carotene. Have you tried a supplement of pregnenolone or DHEA? Were any other hormones, such as prolactin, measured? If you are taking the aspirin regularly, you should make sure to get vitamin K, from kale, liver, or a supplement. Anemia, like cold feet, is a common sign of low thyroid function.

 

[north]

Update:
Things ive noticed.
Every now and then i get the feeling of breathlessness. This didnt happen before Peat.
Is this good or bad? What are the causes?
I have the feeling that any change is good so im hoping this will get better in time.

My temperature is very up and down. I can get very hot for a while sometimes, like sweaty and stuff just by walking or something. But it varies a LOT.

I usually get hot during night, and especially my feet. So weird. Totally opposite from daytime. I guess this is from cortisol or adrenaline. Sugar and salt doesnt really help.

I usually get pale easily.

I think i easily get very high cortisol. I have a history of excessive training.
This matches what ive felt like, Id say 85% of the list.
http://www.functionalps.com/blog/2012/0 ... drenaline/
_
In general:
Im currently eating a bit more liver.
And im thinking about lowering coffee, maybe it contributes to high cortisol. Been having like 5ish cups a day.
Ive gained some fat. Not very surprising tho since im usually over my calorie need caus im trying to up metabolism. Starting to bother me a bit tho. Thinking i should start to count better, the amounts i eat.

_
Edit:

I just found this:
"In the adrenal glands, renewing cells stream from the capsule on the surface of the gland toward the center of the gland. The first cells to be produced in a regenerating gland are those that produce aldosterone, the next in the stream are the cortisol producing cells, and the last to be formed are the cells that produce the sex hormones, the androgens, including DHEA, and progesterone. In aging, after the age of thirty, the renewal slows, but the dissolution of the sex hormone zone continues, so the proportion shifts, increasing the ration of aldosterone and cortisol producing cells to the layer that produces the protective androgens and progesterone (Parker, et al., 1997). -Ray Peat, PhD"

Maybe my high/low temps and high/low moodswings is caused by higher cortisol if that is starting to "regenerate". Maybe its a step forward? Maybe maybe maybe, sex hormones/androgens will come along later on(?)

 

[jyb]

If you drink coffee and notice you become breathless, then that's due to stress from having too little energy stores. If I do coffee while neglecting getting enough nutrients, breathlessness is a symptom I expect. If under-nourished, its worth not taking coffee until that's fixed, or switching from instant coffee / espresso to filter / low pressure coffee, which has a lot less caffeine but a lot of good nutrients.

 

[north]

I get it every now and then, even in times when i havent had coffee, and i always have low pressure (filter drip) coffee.
Like last night after workout, even tho i ate like 300g carb and 60g protein and coconut oil. I would feel very breathless just chilling in the sofa. Such a weird feeling.

 

[marikay]

Hi prototypejohn. Are you living at low altitude? If so, I can suggest you try bag breathing when you feel breathless. When I started Peat I lived at high altitude, and then moved to low altitude and noticed all sorts of bad things happening. Bag breathing made all the difference for me. Also seems to help with the hair loss. Cheers, Mary

 

[litespirit]

cholesterol doesn't have anything to do with thyroid!!

wow. which country is this?

This is bizarre, coming from an endocrinologist in Sweden, really.

 

[north]

Update:
Will do the bagbreathing at least twice a day.
Lower coffee a bit, like 1-2 cups per day would be enough.

Read stuff about niacinamide again, and got re-convinced so
niacinamide 100-200mg x day
aspirin 125-250mg x3 day

And, interesting, i just read up on coconutoil again (a while since last time) and i just decided to try a big chunk of it. I would guess like 50g-70g at once. Man, it warmed me up pretty good, even my feet. Will try again tomorrow and take a ton of C oil with breakfast.

Got an appointment with a private doc in june, trying to get t3 from regular healthcare but seems very hard ((
Ive been to numerous, and i dont know how to convince them to consider t3 combo.
Guess i gotta wait (and pay) for the private doc.

 

[Blossom]

The red light you are getting is also good for stopping / preventing hair loss. At least that is one of the measures recommended in Hair Like a Fox by Danny Roddy. I hardly ever have any shedding anymore and before Peat I would lose it in disturbingly large clumps.

 

[north]

Good news :)
I went back to my GP, said that my endo doc was an idiot, and that id prefer just get her to help me out.
I was there for 45 min and had a pretty intense, but "friendly" discussion, she is really kind. At least she listened to everything, even tho she said that i was wrong and she doubt that i will get any benefit from thyroid (t3 specifically).
I brought about 10 different studies which showed that t3+t4 combo was more effective, as well as i draw parallells to quotes from Peat. I left, and didnt get any t3 but i gave her all the references and 2 articles from Peat.

2 days later she calls me back saying she read it all and that she found some way to prescribe t3 (even tho its not recommended/standard in the public system).

So basically, she believed me in the end.
I didnt get the t3 yet, since for some reason the prescription didnt get to the pharmacy's computersystem and now its holiday so ill have to wait until tuesday.

What should i think of when i start thyroid? I thought id start with 25mcg T4 (caus i have them in that amount) and maybe 7-8 mcg t3 per day. I guess 1 25mcg t4 + 4mcg t3 in the morning, then some t3 throughout the day.
Man cant wait til tuesday!!

Anyway, status update: Lately ive had some aches in joints, knees and lower back. Ive read others getting those symptoms when they started thyroid on a to low dose. My guess is that my thyroid has improved somewhat by diet but still not enough and maybe thats why. Otherwise i feel good, my overall situation is slow but steadily improving otherwise.

 

[charlie]

prototypejohn, fantastic work! Thats really awesome your GP took the time and read through the stuff you gave her. Really shows that she cares about her patients. Awesome!

 

[charlie]

I left, and didnt get any t3 but i gave her all the references and 2 articles from Peat.
2 days later she calls me back saying she read it all and that she found some way to prescribe t3 (even tho its not recommended/standard in the public system).

Imagine that.