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Finally Cured From Post Finasteride Syndrome

Diddleum

Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2015
Messages
201
high shbg, usually means high prolactin. Use vitamin b6 in bit higher doses, b6 decrease prolactin. Also progesterone decreases prolactin. HCG will only increase your prolactin and shbg levels., so will increase depression.
Thanks, my prolactin is top of normal range.

Have tried Caber in the past, as well as b6, both did absolutely nothing.

Have slapped on tons of progest E and other progesterone creams with ZERO effect.
 

ecaltabi

New Member
Joined
May 31, 2021
Messages
3
I also suffer from persistent super high SHBG, always over 80, close to a 100 sometimes. I get good reductions using Ostarine and Boron. Fortunately, that doesn't shut my HPTA down but I take resting periods with higher Boron dosages. Those cycles keep my SHBG under 45.
 

Mister

Member
Joined
Aug 12, 2020
Messages
224
I found this interesting, that proviron may not attach to the AR, especially in low doses. Perhaps why the high doses have worked. Perhaps why other DHT derivatives have worked better for me. Perhaps PFS sufferers should try a different steroid.
Very interesting.

Couple or recoveries with Masteron too that I found:


"Get blood work done, your estrogen is probably very high. Mine was after I got off finasteride. This is what I did to to feel normal after fin. I did 150mg Test cyp along with 400mg Mast E every week along with 75mg Proviron ED and 12.5mg Aromasin three times a week. It took a few weeks but I started feeling normal again and then I Pct'd as normal and have been good ever since(this was about 8-10yrs ago). I'd get blood work before anything though."

Also another pfs guy in that thread reporting improvements thanks to Masteron.


"Was on Propecia for 6 years before I crashed, I experienced Gyno, impotence, shrunken genitals and zero sex drive. It remains that way for 3 years, with a slight improvement with sex drive only. I have never seen a doctor out of shame (I know I should) I have tried doses of tamoxifen and letro over extended periods with no real improvement.


Have now been on Masteron for 4 weeks (its a derivative of DHT) and my life has changed. My genitals have returned to normal size, sex drive is through the roof and everything is great.


I am on 300mg week"


"Decided after prior experience with test boosters that that route was a meme and decided to stick a pin in my ****. 200mg split into daily injection, also added Masteron (DHT derivative) at 200mg as an ancillerary. libido came back in waves, some good moments (literally periods of a minute or two sometimes) and periods of zero libido. eventually, the good periods became longer and the bad periods became shorter over the period of a couple of months until I just stopped thinking about it."

I even personally talked to this guy, he is (was) on the big PFS whatsapp group. He recovered with 200mg testosteron enanthate + 200mg masteron devided over one week.


I still advise trying proviron first (in higher doses) because it's not hard on the liver and one of the "safest" androgens you can take. If that doens't work you can move on to masteron, anavar,... or any of the other DHT derivatives.
 

Mister

Member
Joined
Aug 12, 2020
Messages
224
Does HCG make anyone super depressed at the start? Does it pass?
Everything disrupting your endocrine system can make you depressed (or super good). Clomid or nolvadex is a classic example making many feel like sh*t. Same with AI's like arimidex, I took that one and was on a too high dose and nuked my e, I was super depressed for a couple of weeks, almost wanted to cry at certain moments...

HCG can have the same effect for some. Of course do bloodwork to know what's happening in your body and adjust dosage. But I also want to note some with PFS also felt like sh*t on certain regimens (like PAL taking proviron) and recovered afterwards. Feeling depressed on these meds, roids,... isn't necessarily a bad thing.
 
Last edited:

Diddleum

Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2015
Messages
201
Very interesting.

Couple or recoveries with Masteron too that I found:


"Get blood work done, your estrogen is probably very high. Mine was after I got off finasteride. This is what I did to to feel normal after fin. I did 150mg Test cyp along with 400mg Mast E every week along with 75mg Proviron ED and 12.5mg Aromasin three times a week. It took a few weeks but I started feeling normal again and then I Pct'd as normal and have been good ever since(this was about 8-10yrs ago). I'd get blood work before anything though."

Also another pfs guy in that thread reporting improvements thanks to Masteron.


"Was on Propecia for 6 years before I crashed, I experienced Gyno, impotence, shrunken genitals and zero sex drive. It remains that way for 3 years, with a slight improvement with sex drive only. I have never seen a doctor out of shame (I know I should) I have tried doses of tamoxifen and letro over extended periods with no real improvement.


Have now been on Masteron for 4 weeks (its a derivative of DHT) and my life has changed. My genitals have returned to normal size, sex drive is through the roof and everything is great.


I am on 300mg week"


"Decided after prior experience with test boosters that that route was a meme and decided to stick a pin in my ****. 200mg split into daily injection, also added Masteron (DHT derivative) at 200mg as an ancillerary. libido came back in waves, some good moments (literally periods of a minute or two sometimes) and periods of zero libido. eventually, the good periods became longer and the bad periods became shorter over the period of a couple of months until I just stopped thinking about it."

I even personally talked to this guy, he is (was) on the big PFS whatsapp group. He recovered with 200mg testosteron enanthate + 200mg masteron devided over one week.


I still advise trying proviron first (in higher doses) because it's not hard on the liver and one of the "safest" androgens you can take. If that doens't work you can move on to masteron, anavar,... or any of the other DHT derivatives.
Neither of those success stories involved HCG,and infact both regimes should completely shut down the users testicles and LH should be minimal. In terms of LH it seems on paper to be the opposite treatment to HCG.

Ive had some short term success with AI monotherapy with Arimidex and Letrozole, initially I feel better in day if not hours, but the effect goes and I end up needing more and more AI to get the same effect to the point where I am popping them like candy and get no effect. I got up to taking 4mg of arimidex and 5mg of letro in a day and it had stopped making the required affect. My balls had grown showing that my LH had increased but I still couldnt fight off what I thought was "Estrogen Side Effects".

Ive later learnt that Estrogen is made directly in the testicles and that AI like arimidex isnt effective in controlling testicular created estrogen.

Now im taking HCG im guessing im creating loads of testicular estrogen and feeling like crap. My balls just create to much estrogen I guess. Don't think theres anything I can do about it other than castration!

That leaves me with supressing my testicles to try, which would be a regime similar to these success stories... I guess I need the minimal amount of test to suppress LH and the testicles and however much masteron.

My shbg is always high suggesting high estrogen, taking HCG makes it even higher.

Feeling this depressed isnt sustainable I Cant push through with HCG

Roughly 60% of circulating estradiol is derived from direct testicular secretion or from conversion of testicular androgens.

Although aromatase inhibition by anastrozole and letrozole is reported to be close to 100%, administration of these inhibitors to men will not suppress plasma estradiol levels completely. In men third-generation aromatase inhibitors will decrease the mean plasma estradiol/testosterone ratio by 77% [28, 29]. This finding probably relates to the high plasma concentrations of testosterone, a major precursor for estradiol synthesis in adult men. As aromatase inhibition is dose dependent it has been suggested that aromatase is less suppressed in the testis compared to adipose and muscle tissue, explaining the incomplete efficacy of aromatase inhibition in men.
 
Joined
Nov 16, 2012
Messages
981
Related to the above.

Since attempting to recover from PFS in the past 2 years I'm stuck in this state where I have super high estrogen or too high estrogen relative to DHT, or whatever, and nothing I do seems to get me out.

At the slightest hint of anything estrogenic, my nipples and hips start to itch, I get midsection bloat, water retention...

I've had dudes here tell me they had low E symptoms and were dying from 3-4 mg of aromasin every other day... Well I take 12.5 mg every day and nothing, joints fine... destroyed my sleep though... mental Estrogen too low I guess, but everywhere else barely made a dent.

Then I took 1 g of celery leaf extract for thyroid... again nipples itching and bloat... just from the phytoestrogens. I even developed a hemoangioma this year.. a type of benign liver tumor normally caused by oral estrogen contraceptives. E2 always high on tests. I'm clueless.
 

TheBeard

Member
Joined
May 16, 2018
Messages
2,503
I have all the common PFS symptoms. Brain Fog,Flat, emotion less, lay in bed all day staring, no motivation, no libido, no erections, numb **** etc.

HAve been like this most of my adult life, I did take accutane aged around 16 and maybe my life has sucked since then (39 now). I have up and down periods, not all awful. Have relied heavily on Viagra but doesnt work so good any more.

Have tried most things you could mention. Huge doses of T I couldnt even feel.

Proviron for several months at 25mg ED made me feel like complete death.

Recently I tried 5-10mg doses of winstrol and felt really good for a few days, then it stops working. I tried a bigger dose of 50mg and felt good for a few days then it stops.

I have sky high SHBG (100+). HAve had this my whole life and slowly increasing with age.

I wonder if my lack of Free T and perhaps DHT has caused my AR to be super sensitive. Proviron a relatively weak derivative made me feel like ***t at 25mg. Winstrol a much stronger dht has given me a window of hope.

I read someone on here has had success using 200mg of proviron, but they felt rubbish in the short term. Could the super strong dht down regulate the AR much much quicker? I am making the huge assumption here that ive had little dht my whole life and thus have super sensitive AR.

Interestingly I am stupidly muscular, Ive looked like a body builder my whole life even when not exercising. If I go to the gym once my muscles swell up and look huge - a massive pump which I only read about with guys on Steroids. I have ridiculously thick beard. Could super sensitive AR cause these?

Been extremely depressed lately, and im loosing hope with a cure. Im willing to try anything.

Seeing as winstrol a strong steriod gave me a few good windows.... Ive decided to try an even stronger steroid...

Just took 50mg of Anadrol (apparently the strongest DHT dervied steroid) and 50mg of Winstrol and some masteron to boot. I will update you all if anyting happens and I havent killed myself!

Im on day 5 of HCG protocol, nothing to report other than perhaps worse depression, and bigger testicles.

Those are also low e2 symptoms.
Try transdermal testosterone or HCG to see if any of the two helps.
 

Diddleum

Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2015
Messages
201
Related to the above.

Since attempting to recover from PFS in the past 2 years I'm stuck in this state where I have super high estrogen or too high estrogen relative to DHT, or whatever, and nothing I do seems to get me out.

At the slightest hint of anything estrogenic, my nipples and hips start to itch, I get midsection bloat, water retention...

I've had dudes here tell me they had low E symptoms and were dying from 3-4 mg of aromasin every other day... Well I take 12.5 mg every day and nothing, joints fine... destroyed my sleep though... mental Estrogen too low I guess, but everywhere else barely made a dent.

Then I took 1 g of celery leaf extract for thyroid... again nipples itching and bloat... just from the phytoestrogens. I even developed a hemoangioma this year.. a type of benign liver tumor normally caused by oral estrogen contraceptives. E2 always high on tests. I'm clueless.
Yup, 4mg arimidex, 5mg letro, 50mg aromasin in a day and im just fine.

I dont have any of the physical estogen sides you do, but perhaps mentally.

Do you have high SHBG? mine is like 120 and goes higher with HCG.

I think our testicles aromatize too much and AIs cant control it when they have the strong signal form LH/HCG to produce.
 
Joined
May 15, 2021
Messages
18
How are you guys getting your progesterone? My understanding is that oral bioavailability sucks because of extensive first-pass metabolism, transdermal basically doesn't work (ends up in the lymphatic system), which really just leaves intramuscular and sublingual. I tried some supposedly bioidentical sublingual stuff off Amazon and it did absolutely nothing lol (blood tests confirmed that).

Has anyone tried intramuscular? I know a lot of people say progesterone did nothing for them, but I wonder how many have actually got the dosing right...
 
Joined
May 15, 2021
Messages
18
Related to the above.

Since attempting to recover from PFS in the past 2 years I'm stuck in this state where I have super high estrogen or too high estrogen relative to DHT, or whatever, and nothing I do seems to get me out.

At the slightest hint of anything estrogenic, my nipples and hips start to itch, I get midsection bloat, water retention...

I've had dudes here tell me they had low E symptoms and were dying from 3-4 mg of aromasin every other day... Well I take 12.5 mg every day and nothing, joints fine... destroyed my sleep though... mental Estrogen too low I guess, but everywhere else barely made a dent.

Then I took 1 g of celery leaf extract for thyroid... again nipples itching and bloat... just from the phytoestrogens. I even developed a hemoangioma this year.. a type of benign liver tumor normally caused by oral estrogen contraceptives. E2 always high on tests. I'm clueless.

Have you found the AIs to help at all with the mental symptoms, or is the disturbed sleep the only effect?
 

Diddleum

Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2015
Messages
201
How are you guys getting your progesterone? My understanding is that oral bioavailability sucks because of extensive first-pass metabolism, transdermal basically doesn't work (ends up in the lymphatic system), which really just leaves intramuscular and sublingual. I tried some supposedly bioidentical sublingual stuff off Amazon and it did absolutely nothing lol (blood tests confirmed that).

Has anyone tried intramuscular? I know a lot of people say progesterone did nothing for them, but I wonder how many have actually got the dosing right...
Oral must work to some degree as it is the basis of the mini pill contraception for women.
 
Joined
Nov 16, 2012
Messages
981
Have you found the AIs to help at all with the mental symptoms, or is the disturbed sleep the only effect?

No... well, in some ways. I am less OCD, less anxious, and give less of a damn about everything incl. hair loss when I tank my E2. However, I wake up very tired, or wake up throughout the night, basically sleep quality suffers, I also tend to lose motivation even more. I think this is because while my mental E2 is low, probably other androgens are even lower so having high E allows me to sleep and somewhat restores my mood, but I also tend towards anxiety and lack of self-confidence when it's not inhibited.

Peripherally my estrogen is off the charts and like I said, even things that have vague anti-androgen or estrogenic action seem to tip me over the edge and give me symptoms like beginning gyno or bloating and water retention etc.
 
Joined
May 15, 2021
Messages
18
Then why has it worked for women?
Progesterone (not analogues hormones) until a few years ago was used in gels for women to reduce knots in breasts and to raise progesterone levels when applied on the arms.

Well it definitely is absorbed into some tissues. My concern is that it doesn't reach the central nervous system in significant quantities, which seems to be the source of most PFS issues. I'm no expert though.

Oral must work to some degree as it is the basis of the mini pill contraception for women.
True. I'm not sure how those differ from bioidentical progesterone though.

No... well, in some ways. I am less OCD, less anxious, and give less of a damn about everything incl. hair loss when I tank my E2. However, I wake up very tired, or wake up throughout the night, basically sleep quality suffers, I also tend to lose motivation even more. I think this is because while my mental E2 is low, probably other androgens are even lower so having high E allows me to sleep and somewhat restores my mood, but I also tend towards anxiety and lack of self-confidence when it's not inhibited.

Peripherally my estrogen is off the charts and like I said, even things that have vague anti-androgen or estrogenic action seem to tip me over the edge and give me symptoms like beginning gyno or bloating and water retention etc.

Huh, did PFS make you more anxious and obsessive? Because it had the opposite effect on me. I'm too tired most of the time to worry endlessly. Do you have T, free T, and E2 numbers you can share?
 
Joined
Nov 16, 2012
Messages
981
Huh, did PFS make you more anxious and obsessive? Because it had the opposite effect on me. I'm too tired most of the time to worry endlessly. Do you have T, free T, and E2 numbers you can share?

Made me more anxious I'd say. My T was in the upper quartile, free T and E2 was high, but those are 1 yr old labs. I should be getting new ones soon.
 
Joined
May 15, 2021
Messages
18
Made me more anxious I'd say. My T was in the upper quartile, free T and E2 was high, but those are 1 yr old labs. I should be getting new ones soon.

Interesting. Did your problems start while on fin or after you quit? Do you know how those values changed from baseline?

One other thing I forgot to mention in my update, I tried anavar and noticed nothing (someone else in this thread was suggesting it, so I included it in my proviron order). I'm going to order progesterone from ADC today.
 
Joined
Nov 16, 2012
Messages
981
Interesting. Did your problems start while on fin or after you quit? Do you know how those values changed from baseline?

One other thing I forgot to mention in my update, I tried anavar and noticed nothing (someone else in this thread was suggesting it, so I included it in my proviron order). I'm going to order progesterone from ADC today.

Most of the worst stuff started after I quit, during Fin use I just had continually worsening gyno.

I took 25 mg of exemestane for the second day now. I wake up feeling like death (very tired), BUT - my joints are fine, libido is still there... and still high E2 symptoms in midsection, so that's quite incredible. Most guys would be wiped out at this dose.

We must make estrogen somehow in ways that most antiestrogens can't correct, or we are so lacking in DHT that we are constantly estrogen dominant. I don't have an explanation for this.

I tried Progesterone, it just made me moody and my **** even number. Can't get behind it.
 
Joined
May 15, 2021
Messages
18
Most of the worst stuff started after I quit, during Fin use I just had continually worsening gyno.

I took 25 mg of exemestane for the second day now. I wake up feeling like death (very tired), BUT - my joints are fine, libido is still there... and still high E2 symptoms in midsection, so that's quite incredible. Most guys would be wiped out at this dose.

We must make estrogen somehow in ways that most antiestrogens can't correct, or we are so lacking in DHT that we are constantly estrogen dominant. I don't have an explanation for this.

I tried Progesterone, it just made me moody and my **** even number. Can't get behind it.

Yeah... it's a very frustrating situation. I'm glad people here are at least willing to experiment and take some risks to improve their situations.

Estrogen is interesting because there's some evidence that it might be lower in the central nervous system of PFS sufferers despite the raised serum levels. Maybe that's why HCG seems to be one of the more broadly helpful treatments despite significantly raising E? Is your prolactin high as well? Mine's out of range along with the E, though I have no obvious estrogenic symptoms.
 
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