Chlorine And It's Role In Excessive Sweating With Cold Extremities, Iodine, Calcium, And Magnesium D

[natedawggh]

So I posted the other day about cold beverages, but I've changed my mind (I was often taking drinks of milk or soda after showering, and so thought it was the beverages). I have noticed this pattern that every time I take a shower (and I take long, hot showers to warm up), my extremities get very cold and the skin even feels painful, they turn pale and this is usually accompanied by increased and/or easily triggered sweating, even if it isn't really hot at all (75-80 F). This also happens at night, and in spite of the fact that I take thyroid and have warm core temperatures.

I think perhaps it's my showers that are doing this. It just doesn't make sense that I take a large amount of Magnesium, which corrects the cold/pain sensation, only to lose it within 24 hours. Baring any outside interference this would mean my body is losing magnesium at an alarming rate. It just doesn't make sense.

I investigated a little and read something I have heard before about chlorine affecting the important electrolyte balances in the body. I live in Los Angeles and we have a "new" chlorination system using chloramine, which is basically a fancy word for the most toxic combination of chlorine and ammonia you could possibly imagine. It degrades much less quickly than chlorine and is resistant to heat and light. It also interacts powerfully with elements in the water already, producing extremely toxic compounds. But mostly I would be concerned that showering seems to be robbing electrolytes from my skin, which would explain why I have this uncomfortable development on a routine basis. As routine as showering.

I also was not aware that chlorine and chloramines bind powerfully to iodine. I did not know it was common knowledge that excessive sweating is a sign of iodine deficiency. And sure enough after going to Ralph's and getting some seaweed (drenched in sweat, btw because it's 93 F ******* degrees today). Within 30 minutes of eating it I have stopped sweating, even though it's still ******* 93 degrees. The chlorine/chloramine is also supposed to affect magnesium and calcium, which would make sense why I have to supplement magnesium so often——it's after every exposure to chlorine. I know Ray is not a big fan of seaweed iodine, but I wanted to get some in me fast and I know that's the easiest source.

I haven't showered in 24 hours. Gross, I know, but my toes and feet feel fantastic (after yesterday going to a pool party and sitting in a hot jaccuzi, which left them feeling cold and pained). I have seen a vitamin C filter online which is supposed to inactivate chloramine pretty good, but does anyone have any insight or experience with this?

 

[natedawggh]

PART 2:

I was also a competitive swimmer in high school, and trained twice a day 6 days a week. I developed severe depression during this time and I know I over-trained, especially in regard to the amount and kinds of foods I was getting/not getting.

I resumed swimming competitively a few years ago, but soon began to develop a very strange and marked increase in my insomnia and irritability after being in the pool. After learning about Ray I attributed it to overtraining, but this particular sensation that I got from swimming did not occur when I went to boot camp and ran my **** off for a whole hour, which btw was also probably more overtraining than my swim practices.

In the middle of recovering on a Peat diet I tried to get back into some gentle swimming, because at an easy pace it is low-impact, and the breathing part of swimming should be very Peat friendly, because by the nature of proper form you avoid hyperventilating. but even just swimming 500 meters (competitive workouts were 2500-4000 meters) made me experience that extreme and maddening form of irritation and insomnia that came after swimming.

 

[Mittir]

I was having breathing problem whenever i had shower. First i thought it was toothpaste.
Later figure out that it was chlorine in the water. I bought one of those chlorine filtering showerhead
and it was amazing. I stopped having breathing problem and skin and hair felt really good,especially hair.

 

[natedawggh]

I was having breathing problem whenever i had shower. First i thought it was toothpaste.
Later figure out that it was chlorine in the water. I bought one of those chlorine filtering showerhead
and it was amazing. I stopped having breathing problem and skin and hair felt really good,especially hair.

Yeah my hair has always been getting "gunked" up during showers too, feeling stiff and brittle. I ordered the vitamin C filter (as apparently the normal chlorine filters don't work on chloramine?). I'm going to be tasty like an orange.

 

[mas]

Have you seen this website from this anti chloramine advocacy group from San Francisco? Very informative.

I second the water filter!

I have MCS chemical sensitivity and I hate bleach and any chlorine in pools, etc…I would fight against this if it happened to be forced into my water supply too!

_______________________________

http://www.chloramine.org

Chloramine in Our Water Supply
On February 2, 2004, without any public discussion or consent and without adequate notification, chloramine, (a combination of chlorine and ammonia) was added to the Hetch Hetchy water supply by the San Francisco Public Utilities Commission (SFPUC).  (The SFPUC distributes water to the San Francisco peninsula, from San Francisco in the North to Sunnyvale in the South.)  Chloramine replaced chlorine, a long-used, well-tolerated and extensively studied water disinfectant.

The SFPUC claims that chloramine is more effective than chlorine in getting rid of pathogens and lowering possible carcinogens in the water, i.e. trihalomethanes.  Although the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) now requires utilities like the SFPUC to lower the levels of trihalomethanes, the EPA never mandated the use of chloramine.  There are other alternatives.  Chloramine is an attractive choice because it is easy to make and one of the least expensive disinfectants in a list of 15 EPA options.

However, chloramine is a much less effective disinfectant than chlorine.  And unlike chlorine, chloramine itself has not been studied for its human health effects.  In industry, it is well known that chloramine is a skin and respiratory irritant.  Yet, according to the EPA, NO dermal or inhalant studies on the effects of chloramine as used as a water disinfectant have ever been conducted.  Furthermore, the handful of cancer studies done on chloramine to date are so limited that they are considered INADEQUATE for assessment.


Citizens Concerned About Chloramine (CCAC)
Advocacy Group for removal of chloramine from water supply

 

[Mittir]

According to this government site, small amount of vitamin C neutralize chlorine and chloramine in
water. They are saying carbon filter removes both.

If desired, both chlorine and chloramine can be removed for drinking water purposes by an
activated carbon filter point of use device that can be installed on a kitchen faucet. If desired, both
chlorine and chloramine can be removed for bathing purposes by dissolving Vitamin C in the bath
water (1000 mg Vitamin C tablet will neutralize chloramine in an average bathtub). SFPUC does
not recommend that customers remove disinfectants from drinking water. Customers desiring to
do so should consult with their physician. http://www.sfwater.org/modules/showdocu ... entid=4125

 

[sm1693]

I heavily researched the chloramine issue a few months ago and added a shower filter:

Pentek-ChlorPlus-Carbon-Filter-Cartridge

But, my current opinion is that all filters pretty much suck at removing chloramine and that tap water should just be avoided completely except for light showering mandated by social necessity. Also, the hotter the water is the worse the filter does, and it's only starting at maybe 70-80%.

 

[natedawggh]

UPDATE: I LOVE MY VITAMIN C FILTER. The water is so gentle. I no longer have dry, itchy skin and crusty hair from the shower, and I take long showers! I got mine on amazon for about $55 and it came with 3 refills and installed easily. Highly recommend it.

 

[Blinkyrocket]

I wonder if it's possible to fill a whole swimming pool with carbonation, or carbon dioxide, just like a carbon dioxide bath. I know this is about showers but pools obviously have the same problem.

 

[tara]

I wonder if it's possible to fill a whole swimming pool with carbonation, or carbon dioxide, just like a carbon dioxide bath. I know this is about showers but pools obviously have the same problem.

Do you mean carbonated water, or just carbon-dioxide? CO2 is a gas, an nowhere near dense enough at atmospheric pressure to support swimming, and I think you'd asphyxiate quickly if you tried.
A carbonated swimming pool might be fun, but the logistics would be difficult - the CO2 would evaporate off quickly, and you'd have to watch out for asphyxiation from breathing too much of it.
Dry CO2 baths are contained so you don't breath it.
:)

 

[Blinkyrocket]

I wonder if it's possible to fill a whole swimming pool with carbonation, or carbon dioxide, just like a carbon dioxide bath. I know this is about showers but pools obviously have the same problem.

Do you mean carbonated water, or just carbon-dioxide? CO2 is a gas, an nowhere near dense enough at atmospheric pressure to support swimming, and I think you'd asphyxiate quickly if you tried.
A carbonated swimming pool might be fun, but the logistics would be difficult - the CO2 would evaporate off quickly, and you'd have to watch out for asphyxiation from breathing too much of it.
Dry CO2 baths are contained so you don't breath it.
:)

Well, I don't know enough of the physics so what I mean is just like if you combine an acid with sodium bicarbonate and it makes tiny carbons dioxide bubbles that I don't think you breathe but instead get in your skin. It would be cool to do that with a swimming pool.

 

[burtlancast]

I did not know it was common knowledge that excessive sweating is a sign of iodine deficiency.

Excessive sweating is caused by hyperthyroidism.
I've read some paradoxal cases of mild to moderate iodine deficiency in older adults causing hyperthyroidism
("Paradoxically, another major consequence of mild-to-moderate iodine deficiency in older adults is hyperthyroidism (excessive thyroid function), especially in older women" http://www.lifeextension.com/magazine/2 ... cy/page-01)
but i don't know what to think of that...

Is that what your sentence is referring to ?

And, a certain amount of iodine contained in the sweat is lost each time one exercises.

 

[lindsay]

One thing you might consider is to get a shower head filter - it filters out most of the chlorine in the water, similar to a water filter for drinking water. On a side note, I was recently at our country cottage in Estonia and for 3 weeks we didn't have running water, so I was only able to bath once every two or three days. We used solar showers last year, but there was not enough sun and warmth this year, so I went to the local sports hall and paid to take a shower there when I needed to. My skin never felt so great as during that three weeks - very soft and the dry skin bumps on my arms even began to go away. When we left and went back to St. Petersburg, I was bathing daily because cities are gross and disgusting. And my skin got worse again.

I think it's better to not bathe so often, both because of the chemicals in the water and also because it dries the skin out a lot. If you must bathe, just use water and avoid lots of soap usage. One thing I'm going to try more now that I am home is taking baths with tea and herbs. We went to banya (which is like a sauna) in Estonia and the woman who prepared the sauna for us used tea and herbs in the water. I bathed with it after and felt super clean and energized. My sinuses cleared and it was wonderful! I'm going to try this at home with bath water and adding mint and other herbs. Maybe even some black tea.

 

[natedawggh]

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/92611/

I did not know it was common knowledge that excessive sweating is a sign of iodine deficiency.

Excessive sweating is caused by hyperthyroidism.
I've read some paradoxal cases of mild to moderate iodine deficiency in older adults causing hyperthyroidism
("Paradoxically, another major consequence of mild-to-moderate iodine deficiency in older adults is hyperthyroidism (excessive thyroid function), especially in older women" http://www.lifeextension.com/magazine/2 ... cy/page-01)
but i don't know what to think of that...

Is that what your sentence is referring to ?

And, a certain amount of iodine contained in the sweat is lost each time one exercises.

Excessive sweating CAN be caused by hyperthyroidism, of course, but it is not the only cause, as also hypothyroidism raises estrogen which causes flushing and sweating at reduced body temperatures. That is the type of sweating I was experiencing. I could not possibly be hyperthyroid because my thyroid results were very low and I have lots of weight gain.

 

[CoolTweetPete]

This is an interesting topic for me.

I suspect low thyroid after years of excessive alcohol, and PUFA consumption (plus a low carb diet with all sorts of fun stuff like long periods of fasting, and krill oil supplements thanks Dave Asprey. ) I was also a long distance runner in high school.

Since about as far back as I can remember I have had trouble with excessive sweating. I sweat very easily and profusely, and it is inconvenient and embarrassing to say the least. This is a bit of a conundrum because I see it mentioned that hyperthyroid is a likely culprit but my morning temps are about a degree too low and my resting heart rate is definitely too low (low 50's upon waking).

This seems a paradoxical result. I suppose being excessively estrogenic as Nate suggested above is a possibility. Does anyone know of a good way to test this?

 

[pboy]

no doubt chlorine is not that good...but what the real problem in regards to the post sweating and stuff is that you are taking long hot showers. Your body is absorbing a bunch of the water effectively making you hypotonic inside, triggers estrogen and cortisol and dilates all your pores, especially corwn or head and pits and stuff and you get that cold leaky sweat irritating feeling. It happens any time you are over fluid and the water is out of control in the body. I used to have that happen, the thing is I knew what it was because id become very experienced with measuring and tracking and knowing signs of bodily tonicity balance. I switched to taking faster, cool showers, and it doesn't happen...cuz your pores don't open like when the water is hot and you don't absorb as much water...the only place that might absorb a tiny amount is bottom of feet, so its still better to make sure your drain is clear so the water doesn't build up and soak into your feet, and better yet just to take faster showers...but by far the most important thing is to use neutral to cool water, just a bit on the cooler side is best.

You can come at it from another angle too which is just eat something dense before a shower, and/or right after the shower if you notice like you are sweating in that fashion, take like a quarter tsp sugar straight up

 

[Giraffe]

I've read some paradoxal cases of mild to moderate iodine deficiency in older adults causing hyperthyroidism
("Paradoxically, another major consequence of mild-to-moderate iodine deficiency in older adults is hyperthyroidism (excessive thyroid function), especially in older women" http://www.lifeextension.com/magazine/2 ... cy/page-01)
but i don't know what to think of that...

Abstract of the article that was referenced http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11128722 and another abstract by the same author http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20172467. It would be interesting to read the full texts.

 

[milk_lover]

Ok how about transdermal magnesium oil which is magnesium chloride? I spray a lot over my body, average of 25 sprays per day. Sometimes I spray the oil on my scalp lol because I read somewhere that magnesium is great for hair growth and hair darkening. Now I come to think of it, it has always made my hair coarse and wavy the next morning! So You said chlorine is possibly depleting magnesium.. So will that mean the magnesium from the magnesium oil will not be absorbed as efficiently as possible? Another observation I notice after applying the spray is that I get thirsty. I specifically crave milk! This could mean either the chloride is depleting calcium or magnesium is interacting with calcium in a way that reduces calcium in the blood.. I am not entirely sure. Or it could be that I just need more liquid to counter the salt (mag chloride is salty lol) and milk tastes sweet and nice. My question boils down to this: is magnesium oil worth it especially if the chloride has this bad effect on skin and hair quality?

 

[youngandold]

Iodine deficiency can cause T3 toxicosis.
High T3 with relatively low T4.

It happened to me.
It causes a nasty mixture of hyper and hypo symptoms.

 

[CoolTweetPete]

post 95799 no doubt chlorine is not that good...but what the real problem in regards to the post sweating and stuff is that you are taking long hot showers. Your body is absorbing a bunch of the water effectively making you hypotonic inside, triggers estrogen and cortisol and dilates all your pores, especially corwn or head and pits and stuff and you get that cold leaky sweat irritating feeling. It happens any time you are over fluid and the water is out of control in the body. I used to have that happen, the thing is I knew what it was because id become very experienced with measuring and tracking and knowing signs of bodily tonicity balance. I switched to taking faster, cool showers, and it doesn't happen...cuz your pores don't open like when the water is hot and you don't absorb as much water...the only place that might absorb a tiny amount is bottom of feet, so its still better to make sure your drain is clear so the water doesn't build up and soak into your feet, and better yet just to take faster showers...but by far the most important thing is to use neutral to cool water, just a bit on the cooler side is best.

You can come at it from another angle too which is just eat something dense before a shower, and/or right after the shower if you notice like you are sweating in that fashion, take like a quarter tsp sugar straight up

Thanks for this, @pboy. Would you expect this influx of water to occur when using a hot tub? I use one at my gym fairly regularly, but I use the sauna immediately after and have noticed I sweat much more profusely than normal.

Could this be an effective solution for taking on the extra water?