B Vitamins Doubled My Total Testosterone Levels

[Peaterpeater]

As many of you already know, I attribute a lot of importance to hormones, and I've played quite a bit with them.

I have been off testosterone since the 6th of June this year.
When natural, my natural testosterone levels has always hovered around 500ng/dl.

It was 480ng/dl before I ever used testosterone, and 520ng/dl in september, 3 months after I discontinued testosterone.

At that time I was off ALL supplements. Not one pill would go through my system.

I have started taking Thorne's basic B complex around a month and a half ago, with great benefits. Full sized flaccid hang, balls fuller, great libido, enhanced cognition, enhanced mood.

I was curious if it had had any impact on my testosterone levels, so I went for a blood test end of last week.

My total testosterone came back at 974ng/dl.

I made sure to take my last B vitamin pill 24h prior to the test as Biotin can skew results.

E2 came back at 16pg/ml (11-44) too low to my liking.
Prolactin 16ng/ml (2-18) which seems crazy high given that the B complex has a huge B6 dose!!
@haidut not sure what to make of this prolactin value and how to decrease it.

25 hydroxy vitamin D came back low at 21,4ng/ml (30-80)

My next experiment is to start Vitamin D and Vitamin K supplementation, see if they improve my muscle building ability, which is amazingly low for a T level close to 1000.

I'm happy for your good results but I just noticed that the B complex that you are using contains both Microcystalline Cellulose and Silicon Dioxide. You may not want to use this long term. It can mess up your gut.

 

[TheBeard]

I'm happy for your good results but I just noticed that the B complex that you are using contains both Microcystalline Cellulose and Silicon Dioxide. You may not want to use this long term. It can mess up your gut.

The net effect is positive.
I've already solved 95% of my gut issues by going carnivore, I'm not worried about the small impact of those tiny amounts.

 

[baccheion]

While on my raw milk diet this is what was going through my digestive system in a day:
One gallon a raw grass fed milk
6 raw eggs

After following this diet for 6 weeks I tested my hormones:
Pregnenolone was under the lower limit
Testosterone was at 480 ng/dl

Just the yolks or were whites also present? Raw whites can cause problems and aren't really digested.

 

[TheBeard]

Just the yolks or were whites also present? Raw whites can cause problems and aren't really digested.

Oh so now it's the white that was preventing me from going to 1000ng/dl and made me stuck sub 500?

Got it.

 

[Roni123@]

My ideia is fixing thyroid with raypeat foods e ligestyle and getting all micronutrientes all the day

Testosterone a New level

 

[baccheion]

Oh so now it's the white that was preventing me from going to 1000ng/dl and made me stuck sub 500?

Got it.

Heh. I am pointing out an issue created by raw whites. 480 ng/dL is not telling without free testosterone, SHBG, estradiol, cortisol, DHT, etc..

The body favors homeostasis. Only lower testosterone due to infection, inflammation, nutrient deficiencies, impaired sleep, stress, etc would normalize. Everything else is playing with raw numbers while maintaining the same ratios. For example, 500 T : 10 E2 vs. 1000 T : 20 E2. Same. Worse for the latter if free T drops from 2% (expected) to 1%.

 

[Peater Pan]

As many of you already know, I attribute a lot of importance to hormones, and I've played quite a bit with them.

I have been off testosterone since the 6th of June this year.
When natural, my natural testosterone levels has always hovered around 500ng/dl.

It was 480ng/dl before I ever used testosterone, and 520ng/dl in september, 3 months after I discontinued testosterone.

At that time I was off ALL supplements. Not one pill would go through my system.

I have started taking Thorne's basic B complex around a month and a half ago, with great benefits. Full sized flaccid hang, balls fuller, great libido, enhanced cognition, enhanced mood.

I was curious if it had had any impact on my testosterone levels, so I went for a blood test end of last week.

My total testosterone came back at 974ng/dl.

I made sure to take my last B vitamin pill 24h prior to the test as Biotin can skew results.

E2 came back at 16pg/ml (11-44) too low to my liking.
Prolactin 16ng/ml (2-18) which seems crazy high given that the B complex has a huge B6 dose!!
@haidut not sure what to make of this prolactin value and how to decrease it.

25 hydroxy vitamin D came back low at 21,4ng/ml (30-80)

My next experiment is to start Vitamin D and Vitamin K supplementation, see if they improve my muscle building ability, which is amazingly low for a T level close to 1000.

That's insane w/a D of 21.

 

[Peater Pan]

I wouldn't mess with anything if I would be perfectly healthy and have that kind of testosterone level, messing with D could do you all kinds of harm.

Details? I've been on ave. 5-10K Vit. D for years due to Hashi's.

 

[Lokzo]

I get constant shrinkage from B2, so it probably has some anti-5AR effects, for me far from any benefits in terms of penile function .

Same here bro. Dislike isolated B2. B1 on the other hand...

 

[Lokzo]

Man great thread. B-Vitamins probably contributed to my high T when I got my last blood test too.

 

[CDT]

I think these are great results! Coincidentally, I will make a post soon on oral pregnenolone also raising total T in males. Combining pregnenolone with the B vitamins should accelerate the conversion downstream and possibly raise T even more.
When T is that high, prolactin will rise as some of that T is getting converted into estrogen even if the serum levels of estradiol seem low-ish. Bodybuilders who use TRT always get elevated prolactin. You are not doing TRT but with T that high (technically above the upper limit of normal range) it is expected that prolactin will also rise some. Btw, serum estradiol is mostly a sign of how much estradiol the gonads are making, so having it that low is actually a great sign of gonadal health. Most of the total body estrogen comes from peripheral aromatization and is measurable by either estrone sulfate (E1S) or prolactin.

Hey, Mr. Dinkov,
Just curious, but you mentioned on one of Danny's podcasts that we should try to lower prolactin because it "melts bones". After some research, I have come to realize the extremely detrimental effect of prolactin, especially in men, and I was wondering if you could give me some insight into my condition:

I have been addicted to masturbation for almost 1 year now. I have "relapsed" on average, 4-6 times weekly, if not more. I haven't got a blood test, but I've noticed recession of my hair at the temples (which is what some women get after giving birth, presumably due to the influence of prolactin and other hormones), and my jaw clicks a LOT, which I worry is due to the calcium degradation in my face.

I am really working hard to get on nofap, or, at the very least, reduce my masturbation frequency, because this habit has destroyed my life: it's reduced my productivity, caused me immense guilt and shame, and also stopped me from looking to fill my time with good habits.

My question for you, Sir, is can someone like me, whos has damaged his body over the course of the year, so much so that I actually caused myself to go bald at the temples, can I heal? And if so, how long will it take me?

Thank you so much fro your contributions to the Ray Peat community, Sir.

 

[CDT]

H

As many of you already know, I attribute a lot of importance to hormones, and I've played quite a bit with them.

I have been off testosterone since the 6th of June this year.
When natural, my natural testosterone levels has always hovered around 500ng/dl.

It was 480ng/dl before I ever used testosterone, and 520ng/dl in september, 3 months after I discontinued testosterone.

At that time I was off ALL supplements. Not one pill would go through my system.

I have started taking Thorne's basic B complex around a month and a half ago, with great benefits. Full sized flaccid hang, balls fuller, great libido, enhanced cognition, enhanced mood.

I was curious if it had had any impact on my testosterone levels, so I went for a blood test end of last week.

My total testosterone came back at 974ng/dl.

I made sure to take my last B vitamin pill 24h prior to the test as Biotin can skew results.

E2 came back at 16pg/ml (11-44) too low to my liking.
Prolactin 16ng/ml (2-18) which seems crazy high given that the B complex has a huge B6 dose!!
@haidut not sure what to make of this prolactin value and how to decrease it.

25 hydroxy vitamin D came back low at 21,4ng/ml (30-80)

My next experiment is to start Vitamin D and Vitamin K supplementation, see if they improve my muscle building ability, which is amazingly low for a T level close to 1000.

How much time passed between your last ejaculation and the blood test? After 6-7 days of abstinence from masturbation, your testosterone can rise up to 300%, so keep that in mind!

 

[TheBeard]

H

How much time passed between your last ejaculation and the blood test? After 6-7 days of abstinence from masturbation, your testosterone can rise up to 300%, so keep that in mind!

As you may have read, I draw bloods every two months, so I've tried every single configuration there is.
It doesn't make much difference whether I ejaculated the day before or two weeks prior, and certainly not by a factor of x4.

 

[TheBeard]

Hey, Mr. Dinkov,
Just curious, but you mentioned on one of Danny's podcasts that we should try to lower prolactin because it "melts bones". After some research, I have come to realize the extremely detrimental effect of prolactin, especially in men, and I was wondering if you could give me some insight into my condition:

I have been addicted to masturbation for almost 1 year now. I have "relapsed" on average, 4-6 times weekly, if not more. I haven't got a blood test, but I've noticed recession of my hair at the temples (which is what some women get after giving birth, presumably due to the influence of prolactin and other hormones), and my jaw clicks a LOT, which I worry is due to the calcium degradation in my face.

I am really working hard to get on nofap, or, at the very least, reduce my masturbation frequency, because this habit has destroyed my life: it's reduced my productivity, caused me immense guilt and shame, and also stopped me from looking to fill my time with good habits.

My question for you, Sir, is can someone like me, whos has damaged his body over the course of the year, so much so that I actually caused myself to go bald at the temples, can I heal? And if so, how long will it take me?

Thank you so much fro your contributions to the Ray Peat community, Sir.

Every hormone is raising for a reason, and you have to understand why.
Prolactin is not the devil, nor is estrogen. If one or the other is raising, it's in response to a deficient metabolic pathway somewhere in your body.

Artificially crashing prolactin or estrogen with medication just because you estimated they are too high won't resolve anything.

 

[CDT]

Every hormone is raising for a reason, and you have to understand why.
Prolactin is not the devil, nor is estrogen. If one or the other is raising, it's in response to a deficient metabolic pathway somewhere in your body.

Artificially crashing prolactin or estrogen with medication just because you estimated they are too high won't resolve anything.

THat makes a lot of sense, and thanks for not condemning me (like a lot of other people do). Just curious, what is your opinion on restricting or abstaining from masturbation for the purposes of improving one's energy levels and (in my case) regrowing hair?

 

[firebreather]

@TheBeard

That's awesome. Mind if I ask how old you are? How many basic b complex capsules are you taking a day?

 

[IVILA]

my question is, how can you get to 974 ng/dl if no carbs and glycogen in your system? Currently, my free t is the lowest as ever due to doing keto for 2 months. It makes no sense to me.

 

[TheBeard]

THat makes a lot of sense, and thanks for not condemning me (like a lot of other people do). Just curious, what is your opinion on restricting or abstaining from masturbation for the purposes of improving one's energy levels and (in my case) regrowing hair?

Abstain from watching porn.
Calm your mind.
Jerk off when you feel the pressure is not containable, for me it's every 4 days or so.
Masturbate without porn, just with your imagination.
Don't waste your energy on ejaculation.
Masturbate only when you realise you can't focus on anything else than sex.

 

[TheBeard]

my question is, how can you get to 974 ng/dl if no carbs and glycogen in your system? Currently, my free t is the lowest as ever due to doing keto for 2 months. It makes no sense to me.

I drink raw milk and orange juice.

 

[TheBeard]

@TheBeard

That's awesome. Mind if I ask how old you are? How many basic b complex capsules are you taking a day?

32.
Two capsules a day split 12 hours apart.