The Progest-E & Raw Honey High

[J.R.K]

“Calcium, magnesium, vitamin A, vitamin B6- , vitamin K, and vitamin D are important for the development and maintenance of bones. For example, a vitamin A deficiency limits the synthesis of progesterone and proteins.” -Ray Peat

Did Dr Peat ever express an opinion on which form of vitamin K he found to be preferable or superior @Rinse & rePeat ?

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Did Dr Peat ever express an opinion on which form of vitamin K he found to be preferable or superior @Rinse & rePeat ?

The only thing I recall him saying is to have occasion well cooked greens for vitamin K, which would be K1. K2 is abundant in dairy and meats.

 

[Advocate2021]

The only thing I recall him saying is to have occasion well cooked greens for vitamin K, which would be K1. K2 is abundant in dairy and meats.

Liver contains vitamin K. I supplement with health natura k2- mk4 only- per the forum mk7 not desirable. When i had effects due to shedding from the vaccinated, Dr. Peat told me extra vitamin K (as in supplement) would be protective so i have been using it ever since. Health natura drops test for purity and seem to be the purest of those available. because of the potency only 1 or 2 drops are necessary so very small amount to use sublingually. and Dr. peat said in such a small amount of these supplements (which do contain MCT as the only other ingredient), they would not be a problem.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Liver contains vitamin K. I supplement with health natura k2- mk4 only- per the forum mk7 not desirable. When i had effects due to shedding from the vaccinated, Dr. Peat told me extra vitamin K (as in supplement) would be protective so i have been using it ever since. Health natura drops test for purity and seem to be the purest of those available. because of the potency only 1 or 2 drops are necessary so very small amount to use sublingually. and Dr. peat said in such a small amount of these supplements (which do contain MCT as the only other ingredient), they would not be a problem.

He said something similar to me about MCT on the skin in vitamin D. I posted the exchange, below, on page 6, last May, in my “Slippery Slope Supplements” thread..

E-mail from Rinse & rePeat:

"Speaking of vitamin D, I have been buying a lanolin and MCT coconut oil one and use it topically as you have suggested. I found this different one, which is 7 times more expensive and made from "pure vitamin D3 crystals", which I have no idea where that comes from. In any case, the site lists it as a Ray Peat quality D3. How do you think the two compare?"


RAY PEAT:
"I would question any product from a website which claims that I have expressed an opinion about the quality of vitamin D. I have warned against the oral use of MCT in products for oral use."


Rinse & rePeat:
"You have! You have said ingesting MCT orally can create allergies that otherwise weren't there before. Do you think my usual lanolin D3 suppliment is as good as the pure D3 crystals?"


RAY PEAT
"The lanolin product is sold as purified crystals."


Rinse & rePeat:
"Further pondering your last message, are you saying to ditch them both or is one better than the other for topical use?"


RAY PEAT
"I don’t know of any problem from using a little MCT on the skin."


Rinse & rePeat
"So the lanolin one is just as good as the way more expensive one?"


RAY PEAT:
"And the seller might be more honest."

Slippery Slope SUPPLEMENTS

Last week I woke in the middle of the night completely congested, inflamed, sneezing, coughing, and as a result, very anxious. I remembered reading somewhere on this forum that honey helped with insomnia, so I got up and took a spoonful of raw honey. Within minutes all of my symptoms calmed down...

raypeatforum.com

 

[Jennifer]

@Advocate2021, do you know if Ray ever mentioned the safety of olive oil as an excipient?

 

[Advocate2021]

@Advocate2021, do you know if Ray ever mentioned the safety of olive oil as an excipient?

i recall him approving of that.

 

[Jennifer]

Perfect! Thank you, @Advocate2021.

 

[David PS]

i recall him approving of that.

01:07:40 - Does Ray prefer pure olive oil over coconut oil for the carrot salad and mushrooms? 1/2 a teaspoon provides a trace of PUFA

 

[J.R.K]

Liver contains vitamin K. I supplement with health natura k2- mk4 only- per the forum mk7 not desirable. When i had effects due to shedding from the vaccinated, Dr. Peat told me extra vitamin K (as in supplement) would be protective so i have been using it ever since. Health natura drops test for purity and seem to be the purest of those available. because of the potency only 1 or 2 drops are necessary so very small amount to use sublingually. and Dr. peat said in such a small amount of these supplements (which do contain MCT as the only other ingredient), they would not be a problem.

Very nice thank you @Advocate2021. Would you think that application via the navel would provide a higher level of absorption or better distribution?

 

[Advocate2021]

Very nice thank you @Advocate2021. Would you think that application via the navel would provide a higher level of absorption or better distribution?

i use it sublingually which Georgi says is akin to transdermal or navel. i dont do navel application as it has been damaging to the skin there for me. that skin is extremely delicate and different than other areas and, for me at least after trying many times, it does not work at all and i end up with terrible irritation that takes many days to heal.

 

[J.R.K]

i use it sublingually which Georgi says is akin to transdermal or navel. i dont do navel application as it has been damaging to the skin there for me. that skin is extremely delicate and different than other areas and, for me at least after trying many times, it does not work at all and i end up with terrible irritation that takes many days to heal.

Good to know @Advocate2021, thanks for sharing. Sorry to hear about the irritation in the navel area, that is a sensitive spot to get any type of rash.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

“Women spontaneously drink more coffee premenstrually, and since caffeine is known to increase the concentration of progesterone in the blood and in the brain, this is obviously a spontaneous and rational form of self-medication, though medical editors like to see things causally reversed, and blame the coffee drinking for the symptoms it is actually alleviating. Some women have noticed that the effect of a progesterone supplement is stronger when they take it with coffee. This is similar to the synergy between thyroid and progesterone, which is probably involved, since caffeine tends to locally activate thyroid secretion by a variety of mechanisms, increasing cyclic AMP and decreasing serotonin in thyroid cells, for example, and also by lowering the systemic stress mediators.“ —Ray Peat

 

[J.R.K]

“Women spontaneously drink more coffee premenstrually, and since caffeine is known to increase the concentration of progesterone in the blood and in the brain, this is obviously a spontaneous and rational form of self-medication, though medical editors like to see things causally reversed, and blame the coffee drinking for the symptoms it is actually alleviating. Some women have noticed that the effect of a progesterone supplement is stronger when they take it with coffee. This is similar to the synergy between thyroid and progesterone, which is probably involved, since caffeine tends to locally activate thyroid secretion by a variety of mechanisms, increasing cyclic AMP and decreasing serotonin in thyroid cells, for example, and also by lowering the systemic stress mediators.“ —Ray Peat

This is an interesting observation, it lends credibility to the idea of the wisdom of the body. This would go a long way to explaining the cravings for chocolate that some women experience leading up to the cycles. I have not heard of increased coffee consumption premenstrually, but if caffeine has a connection to increased progesterone the body would know what it needs.
Thank you for posting this @Rinse & rePeat as a guy it goes a long way towards understanding the processes our significant female others go through, and how we might be of a subliminal help to their plight.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

This is an interesting observation, it lends credibility to the idea of the wisdom of the body. This would go a long way to explaining the cravings for chocolate that some women experience leading up to the cycles. I have not heard of increased coffee consumption premenstrually, but if caffeine has a connection to increased progesterone the body would know what it needs.
Thank you for posting this @Rinse & rePeat as a guy it goes a long way towards understanding the processes our significant female others go through, and how we might be of a subliminal help to their plight.

There is plenty enough here to be had for a man too JR, especially for your kind going through “MANopause” ….

“This is similar to the synergy between thyroid and progesterone, which is probably involved, since caffeine tends to locally activate thyroid secretion by a variety of mechanisms, increasing cyclic AMP and decreasing serotonin in thyroid cells, for example, and also by lowering the systemic stress mediators.“ —Ray Peat

 

[J.R.K]

There is plenty enough here to be had for a man too JR, especially for your kind going through “MANopause” ….

“This is similar to the synergy between thyroid and progesterone, which is probably involved, since caffeine tends to locally activate thyroid secretion by a variety of mechanisms, increasing cyclic AMP and decreasing serotonin in thyroid cells, for example, and also by lowering the systemic stress mediators.“ —Ray Peat

Very interesting that caffeine helps to activate thyroid as well as raising progesterone, as well as lowering serotonin in the thyroid.
There is a belief out there that caffeine is pert of mind control, hence the vast amount of coffee shops. I have not bought into this given that the vast amount of work Dr Peat put into this indicates the highly prevalent benefits of caffeine.
That being said the people that promote this anti caffeine idea also believe having higher levels of serotonin is a crucial hormone for happiness, so that is a red flag.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

That being said the people that promote this anti caffeine idea also believe having higher levels of serotonin is a crucial hormone for happiness, so that is a red flag.

I know right?! These generalizations about things like serotonin being good for you because they make you feel good is so misleading. Like many other things like it, be it MSG, alcohol, unhealthy “splurges” or even questionable activities, there is a saying about those instant gratifications, and that is that they have longterm consequences.

 

[J.R.K]

I know right?! These generalizations about things like serotonin being good for you because they make you feel good is so misleading. Like many other things like it, be it MSG, alcohol, unhealthy “splurges” or even questionable activities, there is a saying about those instant gratifications, and that is that they have longterm consequences.

An interesting study about caffeine as a potential treatment for cancer

Caffeine As A Potential Cancer Treatment

Yet another study that revisits the "novel" idea that improving cellular oxygenation can lead to a viable cancer treatment. In summary, high adenosine levels result in low oxygen levels inside the cell and that apparently prevents the immune system from recognizing and "killing" the cancer...

raypeatforum.com

 

[OliviaD]

"The production of euphoria has been mentioned as a side effect, but I think euphoria is simply an indication of a good physiological state. (The history of official medical attitudes toward euphoria is a subject that deserves more attention.) Very large doses that are given in vitamin E solution, allowing complete absorption, can reach the level that is sometimes achieved late in pregnancy, producing both euphoria and a degree of anesthesis. To avoid unexpected anesthesia, the correct dose should be determined by taking about 10 mg. at a time allowing it to spread into the membranes of the mouth, and repeating the dose after 10 minutes until the symptoms are controlled." Ray Peat

Boy what an experience I had this morning! I had shorted myself on sleep, and found myself wide awake at 5:00. I laid there too awake to even try to go back to sleep. So an hour later I decided to take a spoonful of raw honey, which has always served me well for my sleep, and threw in a little Progest-E for good measure.

I had been reluctant to use Progest-E, not wanting to throw a possible wrench in my good health, but decided to take the plunge and bought the Progest-E a couple of weeks earlier. I noticed, on several occasions, a dazed calm feeling it has given, and suspected it is why I have been getting sleepy earlier at night than usual lately too. So I thought it would be a good thing to try to get me that couple extra hours this morning.

I took my honey, slathered the Progest-E on my lips and layed back down. Within minutes I went into a deep relaxed state. So deep that my mouth dropped open and I was slow to close it. I was very conscious, much like when Nyquil first kicks in. It was a wonderful feeling, but my mouth not staying closed, and now a snoring gasp coming out of it too was a bit worrisome! I don't sleep noisily and this sound was startling me awake. This happened a couple of times until I moved my position onto my back to keep mouth from dropping open anymore. Whew! I can see how this stuff could solve some problems!

I enjoyed my little trip to nowhere, but after awhile I felt a strange motorlike sensation in my back, a sort of machine perfectly timmed fast twitch deep inside that I could hear deep within myself, but not with my ears, a sort of quick thump, thump thump. I wasn't sure it was even a muscle. I cannot describe it much better, but if I were guessing, I would surmise my body was releasing something or gearing up for something. It was so odd. I certainly think I either took too much Progest-E or pairing it with the raw honey turned into a powerful combination. Feeling very anesthetized, I can see how this combo could be a lifesaver for insomniacs as well a stress reliever, taking it during the day for those who are overly stressed. I will definetly take Ray Peat's instruction next time, and be more sparing and work my way up, or take out the honey. It was an incredibly powerful drug like feeling, and I am still groggy from it at noon, in a very cool, laid back sort of way. As "they" say, "That was some good stuff!"

 

[OliviaD]

Wow - I'm kind of envious :)

I purchased the Progest E , and have tried it in several ways and amounts and have never noticed anything. I recall Ray talking about it helping people with sleep and on one interview using as much as you need to feel an effect. Also that lubricating the skin first with olive or coconut oil to aid in absorption. I started with topical, up to 600 mg at a time. On the instruction sheet it says 1/4 tsp is 300 mg, popcorn sized is 6 mg, although that doesn't seem to make sense to me; b/c I don't think there are that many drops in 1/4 tsp. I've rubbed in on my gums, I've swallowed it; and done combos of the preceding at the same time Tonight I even tried your honey method with one drop and don't notice anything.

Since I have it, I've been using it in this semi- irregular fashion over 2 months. Maybe it is doing something, I just don't feel anything. Of course it is hard to assess since I have nothing to measure

I am post-menopausal, and I think I am hypothyroid, although of course my lab values fall w/in 'normal', so by medical standards I'm good. I've been playing with that a bit with the Mexican products and I do like being responsible for my own care, but I really wish I had some kind of practitioner to work with b/c it's hard to be objective on my own, and I still have so many questions. I don't know how to find such a person.

Oh - since it doesn't seem to do anything, I did also think as long as I'm applying it topically, I might as well put it on my face, maybe it will have some direct effect on the epithelial cells. I've done this about 5 times I think. Hard to tell from such a short trial. I tried coconut oil and olive oil I like the Olive oil a lot better and amazingly, my skin was just nice and soft in the am (put on at bedtime), not an oil slick as I feared.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

“Progesterone and its precursor, pregnenolone, have a generalized protective function: antioxidant, anti-seizure, antitoxin, anti-spasm, anti-clot, anti-cancer, pro-memory, pro-myelination, pro-attention, etc. Any interference with the formation of cholesterol will interfere with all of these exceedingly important protective functions.” -Ray Peat

Coconut Oil

Ray Peat

raypeat.com