Towards Ending Migraines

[tara]

post 101454 YuraCZ has linked an interesting interview with Morley Robbins here post 101430. Peat will not agree with everything Robbins says, but they do agree on quite a few things.

I wonder if this interview could give you some new ideas on how to tackle your migraines.

Finally making time to start watching these. NOw litened to the first 2 in Yura's post - first interview with Morley Robbins. So I haven't got the the migraine references yet. Very interesting speaker. Very cool hearing him describing many places where copper is key to good function, and in particular the ceruloplsmin itself.

So far what I'm taking from Morley Robbins is different from what Yura seems to have got. Yura talks a lot about excess copper; Robbins seems to talk about many problems associated with deficiency.

I'm taking from it:
- Copper is essential, but it is only useful (bioavailable) when attached to the transport protein ceruloplasmin. Without the Cp, it causes trouble. I think this is consistent with Peat's views.
- Lack of bio-available copper (may involve excess of unbound copper) can contribute to many kinds of trouble, including weaknesses in skin and connective tissue, steroid synthesis, thermal regulation, CNS damage, iron disregulation, lack of SOD - free radical damage, lack of active cytochrome C oxidase and resultant ATP production, congestive heart failure, aneurisms, strokes, low dopamine, overactive immune response, hypercholesterolemia, and on through the body.
- Various factors can help or hinder the formation of ceruloplasmin. (Consistent with Peat.)
- Help: adequate magnesium (consistent with Peat)
- Hinder: excess unbound iron, ascorbic acid (want the more complete vitamin C molecule from whole foods, not the disruptive ascorbic acid), excessive ACTH (high stress, low Mg) (consistent with Peat)
- Excess supplemental calcium and vit-D can mess with magnesium metabolism, and therefore copper metabolism. This could be a disagreement with Peat, but I'm not sure. It seems to me that Peat also recognises the value of generous magnesium when out of balance, and the need for adequate vit-A and vit-K, both of which shoud I think help counter high blood calcium that can arise from supplemental calcium and vit-D.
- Recommends liver for a well balanced supply of copper, zinc, and iron. He speculates that copper in liver may already be bound to ceruloplasmin (unlike plant sources). Calf, lamb and turkey higher than beef, chicken.
- About half the people he tested seemed to have low plasma ceruloplasmin, and probably most of those hypersupplementation of xcess vit-D supplementation
- He reckons thyroid metabolism usally aries from mineral deficiencies/imbalances, and restoring minerals can rectify thyroid function (probably consistent with RBTI, not sure about Peat)
- People under stress produce more mast cells. More mast cells means more sensitive to histamine, either in food or as triggered by histamine reactions. Copper, Mg, B6 needed for enzymes to regulate this well. Histamine can be out of range from both copper excess and copper deficiency.

Mineral deficiency and/or imbalance is key to most dysfunctions ('medical' diseases). Consistent with Peat and Reams.

Looking forward to listening to part 2. Thanks Yura and Giraffe.

 

[Kray]

Tara,

How is it going with migraines? Would be interested to know what you've found that really helps, and hope you're doing better of late.

C-lady

 

[tara]

post 118844 How is it going with migraines? Would be interested to know what you've found that really helps, and hope you're doing better of late.

Hi C-lady,
I have so far not managed to reduce migraine frequency. If anything it's more frequent. On the other hand, I think I am recovering faster from recent ones, and more likely to lose 2-4 hours of a migraine day, rather than the whole of it.

The only thing that I've found that actually stops the pain, at least for a while, is triptans. I use sumatriptan 50mg. Usually that is enough, but occasionally not. Sometimes the migraines come back again with 8 -24 hrs, sometimes not. Tried dissolve-in the mouth rizatriptan a few times years ago, but the rebound migraines seemed to come on even faster. Only reason I'd use rizatriptan now would be if I got so nauseous that I couldn't hold the oral sumatriptan down. Sumatriptan renders me dysfunctional for 2-3 hrs - ideally I sleep; always I avoid strenuous activity or being up on my feet too much in that time, and avoid driving.

 

[Kray]

Tara,

Sorry to hear! I apologize if you may have covered this already, but I recently had (another) migraine- they seem to be happening more frequently with me- and what worked well for me is white willow bark. Have you tried this? The standardized salicin in several brands is 400mg/15%. So far, no migraine today. I am thinking the trigger for me is neck tension, so I'm trying to keep my neck warm in the winter, not sit "frozen" for too long (computer/reading), upper body exercise (rubber tubing exercises), good sleep (taurine, progesterone), to name a few. Also, for pain, I have found that a combo of peppermint/eucalyptus oil on temples and back of neck and/or lavender oil applied in the same areas, can be helpful. There are also acupressure points (look online). Other helps- cold pack on temples intermittent with hot pack on neck. If you haven't tried any of these, you might consider adding to your regime.

Diet-wise, I'm keeping in mind the need for blood sugar stability. For me, this may be another trigger. Last night, I had some vanilla ice cream which seemed to help (a la Peat!) And, of course, now I know firsthand that unless you catch a migraine early, it will catch you! Hang in there, and keep posting on your successes/helps. Thank you for sharing!

 

[ecstatichamster]

Hi Tara, wanted to comment. I'm still figuring out my headaches. I started Peating about 6 weeks ago and the headaches disappeared. They used to respond to ibuprofen. Then I stopped that for awhile, now I can control them with aspirin. But they are much less frequent.

I'm wondering if it's endotoxins. I think that I never correlated "allergies" with headaches but always noticed them all at the same time. Now I'm pretty sure it's gut endotoxins that I've had forever. But not sure why the headaches started to get more and more intense as I was into low carb and paleo.

One difficulty is correlating endotoxins with diet. Because sometimes motility is higher and faster, sometimes slower, and it's hard for me to figure out the cause-effect. Is it dinner last night or the night before? But I'm thinking this may be it.

I wish it were that simple for you.

 

[natedawggh]

post 116681 Update.
For many months I've been getting migraines one or two days nearly every week.
I stopped the pizotifen a few weeks ago. Just forgot to take it a couple of times, then noticed I ddn't miss it, and gradually tapered it off over a week or so. I started it up gradually about a year ago, and it clearly hasn't reduced migraine frequency. The dr would be happy for me to take more of it, but I've not felt like it. I got up to nearly the usual preventive dose.
Pizotifen theoretically has some anti-serotonin effects.

A week after stopping I got a couple of days of migraine, then a lovely three weeks without (still had a to fight off a few, but successfully). Enough to start getting a little hopeful. But this last week I've had migraine 5 days out of 8, so no longer so opimistic. Trying to think about what else might have changed.

It has also become easier to wake up in the mornings and stay alert through the day since I stopped, which is welcome. I wonder if that is serotonin rebound.

As I've said before, last year I focused on avoiding hunger stress, and gained about 15kg. This did not reduce migraines, but did seem to reduce some stress symptoms. Then I kept eating and stayed at that weight for many months. Then since last winter I gained a little more. I think I was sometimes compulsively overeating on unhelpful foods (eg chocolate, often white).
As soon as I stopped the pizotifen, my appetite reduced and my compulsive eating stopped. I have had a few patches of accidental undereating again, which may have been a trigger for recent migraines. And of course once migraine process is underway, my appetite and ability to handle sugar tend to drop. So the scale says I've lost this year's weight gain in the last month, but I expect most of that is glycogen and accompanying water. Maybe a little fat and/or lean loss too.

After I stopped the pizotifen, I've been getting hayfever. Not sure if that's just coincidence - the relevant pollens may just have hit the airwaves - or whether the pizotifen was providing some anti-histamine effect. I'm not aware of it being advertised as having this effect, but maybe it does.

Waking temps the last week 36.4. Still slightly low, but not extreme. I made sure to keep the thermometer in till it stabilised properly, which took at least 10 mins. If I'd quit after 5 mins I'd have thought my temps were lower. A couple of years ago when I measured waking temps thoroughly for a week or so at the same time of year, they were all just below 36.0, so I take this as an improvement, probably due mainly to supplemental natural thyroid. Maybe indicates I could increase the thyroid supps a bit more still.

Other tactics I've been trying to apply lately, with varying consistency, include:
-Much reduced milk consumption the last few months, but still having a little most days. Even though I'm still getting lots of migraines, reducing the milk seems to leave my head clearer, so I'll continue with this.
-Resumed carrot salad since my last cold in September. Grating 3-4 days worth at time makes this easier to do. I usually want to eat it, it's just making it that's a hassle.
-I've continued to add just a little raw garlic to this too. I think this helps with keeping my head clear, so I'm guessing it's helping to keep the endotoxin levels down.
- A little liver a few times a week. I thought I was going off it at one stage, but I think it was just a less fresh batch - the next batch tasted great again.
- Mostly avoiding wheat, but indulged a few times this week in home-made slow-leavened white bread - maybe that's contributed.
-Daily a little decaf coffee (eg 1/2 tsp), a little aspirin (eg 100 - 250mg). Talked with someone else who found one little aspirin a day kept her migraines at bay. When migraine is underway, I get averse to both coffee and aspirin, so not forcing it then.
-I'm still taking B-vits twice daily, but this last week's batch I lowered the riboflavin. Maybe I'll increase this again in the next batch, since I've had a bad week.
-Daily Mg and Ca, sometimes twice daily. With little greens most days but very little dairy, I'm not getting much calcium. I'm supplementing calcium as oystershell at 1/4 - 1/2 tsp most days, so not particularly high calcium intake over all.
-Daily ADEK, usually separately, but when I'm too tired I use the estroban. Some of it topical.
- Most days a little of Haidut's solban on the face, sometimes on other bits if burnt.
- Methylene blue - 1 drop oxidal (400mcg) daily in a glass of water, usually some before sleep and some on waking.
-Intermittently, glycine (~2g), taurine (~1g) - esp. when migraine threatens. I'd like to make this daily, but still haven't got this into my routine reliably.
-Intend to supplement zinc once or twice a week, but often forget. Probably haven't had any the last couple of weeks. Maybe that's trouble?
- Thyroid increased: NDT 1/4 tab 2/day + NWT small serve 1/day.
- Continuing progesterone, this year at about 10mg 2/day, occasionally a little more.

That's a lot of supplements! No wonder I sometimes forget things, and am slow to add more. The only thing I take highish doses of are some of the B-vits. Not sure if I should drop any of them.

Next:
- I ordered some feverfew, since someone recommended a standardised product that had lots of good reviews and seems to serve them well. Hasn't arrived yet, but I intend to give this a go when it does. It seems as though some of what it does is similar to aspirin, but there are also claims that it helps strengthen and stabilise blood vessels, which seems like a good thing. The downsides that I am aware of are that it may set up for withdrawal symptoms when stopped/omitted.
- Still think the amino acid supps might have something to offer, if I could get myself organised on these consistently.
- Considering using the milk thistle and/or COQ12 and/or theanine I have in the cupboard, but not got around to it yet.
- Still struggling to get sleep regular. No insomnia, just don't go to bed early enough. A likely contributor to my trouble.

Hi Tara,

Migraines suck!
Sorry to tell you this, but milk WILL contribute to migraine every time you drink it. There is just too much tryptophan in it that if you have an at all compromised metabolism it directly converts to serotonin instead of niacin. There is no avoiding it. I can direct tryptophan from chicken into niacin by using taurine and niacinamide at a meal, but doing the same with milk ALWAYS gives me high serotonin symptoms.

To get the benefits of milk without the tryptophan, I take Naked Brand casein protein and consume eggshell powder for calcium. I've lost about 50 lbs and gotten the best sleep of my life, because casien gives a continuous stream of amino acids when taken before bed. It's optimal ratio of amino sod the best of any food I've been able to find. Cheese for this reason is great (most cheese is made from casein). But that requires a lot of cheese and it's easier to take the protein.

I also use lysine, but it's very potent and I only need 500-1000mg a day. Do not take glycine as a supplement, the synthetic form can cause lots of bilogical problems and best to get it from gelatin. Lysine is not more powerful than a bad diet, and cheating will always interrupt any gains you might have gotten in serotonin reduction. The only option is abstinence. That being said, I do have pizza once a month. It is my ONLY cheat.

No wheat. It just outright stops your metabolism and ALWAYS CAUSES GUT INFLAMATION which leads to increased serotonin. There is no avoiding that. If you're not seeing good results you can't cheat. It's like giving up before you even start. But with enough protein and sugar you will be satiated and not even desire to cheat.

 

[natedawggh]

... The way to tell if a tryptophan food converts to niacin or serotonin is this: if you eat chicken or milk and it converts to niacin, you should feel a very slight, pleasant niacin flush on your skin. I especially feel it in my forearms. If you don't get this it is converting to serotonin, and if you at all feel tension increasing in your head after a high tryptophan source, even if it's not unpleasant, this is the conversion to serotonin.

...also, the key to avoiding wheat is replacing all your usually wheat dishes/go-tos with potato dishes. I make homemade potato chips in coconut oil for my junk food. Homemade fries
Are even more tasty and fun.

...I tried theanine for a time (after having much success with my other protocol) and while it uber-relaxed me during the day, it gave me insomnia again (after my insomnia had cleared for six months)

... Sorry, typing this on my phone...the casein stuff might sound like a suggestion, but I found it to be THE thing that relived most all my symptoms, and I don't regard it as an option/suggestion but as a necessity and requirement.

 

[tara]

Thanks for you thoughts C-lady and ecstatichamster.

post 119013 Sorry to hear! I apologize if you may have covered this already, but I recently had (another) migraine- they seem to be happening more frequently with me- and what worked well for me is white willow bark. Have you tried this? The standardized salicin in several brands is 400mg/15%. So far, no migraine today. I am thinking the trigger for me is neck tension, so I'm trying to keep my neck warm in the winter, not sit "frozen" for too long (computer/reading), upper body exercise (rubber tubing exercises), good sleep (taurine, progesterone), to name a few. Also, for pain, I have found that a combo of peppermint/eucalyptus oil on temples and back of neck and/or lavender oil applied in the same areas, can be helpful. There are also acupressure points (look online). Other helps- cold pack on temples intermittent with hot pack on neck. If you haven't tried any of these, you might consider adding to your regime.

I haven't tried willow bark, but I did have a fairly systematic experiment with daily aspirin for 2-3 mths end of last year. Did you try aspirin before you tried white willow bark? Have you been using the white willow daily as a preventive, or only when you get the headaches?
I do tend to some shoulder tension, and have had them massaged a few times.
Posture makes a difference to my health and well-being - yoga is good - I can't motivate myself to do it regularly at home (and the kids and cats see it as an invitaiton for climbing :)). I get to class when I can, which is not often at the moment.
Tried some exercises from a DIY trigger point book. Maybe could have persisted, but hard to make/find the time.
Tried two different kinds of acupuncture.
Cold on forehead and temples can feel nice, but have never interrupted migraine process. Same with hot or cold on neck. Have tried tiger balm and vicks, smell nice but don't help.

post 119013 Diet-wise, I'm keeping in mind the need for blood sugar stability. For me, this may be another trigger. Last night, I had some vanilla ice cream which seemed to help (a la Peat!) And, of course, now I know firsthand that unless you catch a migraine early, it will catch you! Hang in there, and keep posting on your successes/helps. Thank you for sharing!

I'm sure blood sugar is an issue for me. Hunger used to be my most reliable trigger. But eating once the process has started is too late to help, usually. The last two years I've been pretty good at avoiding hunger stress, but disappointingly, this did not imprve migraine frequency. Possibly hyperglycemia may also cause trouble, when I sometimes overeat.

Hope you can get to a place where you can stop yours before they start. :)

post 119033
I'm wondering if it's endotoxins. I think that I never correlated "allergies" with headaches but always noticed them all at the same time. Now I'm pretty sure it's gut endotoxins that I've had forever.

I'm pretty sure endotoxins do mess with me, and maybe have been a contributor to migraine. I've been eating a little raw garlic in my carrot salad every day or two since my last cold a few months ago. I'm pretty sure this helps keep my head clearer, and I think I feel better for it - I'm asssuming that's by reducing endotoxin - but it has not reduced migraine frequency.
At times I've used a little cascara sagrada daily to keep the gut moving, but not been bothering with it just lately. Maybe worth resuming. Transit varies, but seldom badly constipated. Wheat is one of my suspects. I don't eat much of it, and don't get quick and obvious effects, but still suspiscious.

post 119033 One difficulty is correlating endotoxins with diet. Because sometimes motility is higher and faster, sometimes slower, and it's hard for me to figure out the cause-effect. Is it dinner last night or the night before? But I'm thinking this may be it.

Yes, I know what you mean about trying to figure out whether you are responding to today's food or yesterday's. I really don't have a good handle on which foods my gut likes better or worse. And various contributors may be additive and cumulative.

 

[tara]

Hi Nate, thanks for your ideas.

post 119105 Migraines suck!

post 119105 Sorry to tell you this, but milk WILL contribute to migraine every time you drink it. There is just too much tryptophan in it that if you have an at all compromised metabolism it directly converts to serotonin instead of niacin. There is no avoiding it. I can direct tryptophan from chicken into niacin by using taurine and niacinamide at a meal, but doing the same with milk ALWAYS gives me high serotonin symptoms.

I've backed right off the milk in the last few months. I still have a little in other things (eg white chocolate), but not much.
I did several years avoiding milk and wheat/gluten most of the time, and migraines worsened during this period.

post 119105 To get the benefits of milk without the tryptophan, I take Naked Brand casein protein and consume eggshell powder for calcium. I've lost about 50 lbs and gotten the best sleep of my life, because casien gives a continuous stream of amino acids when taken before bed. It's optimal ratio of amino sod the best of any food I've been able to find. Cheese for this reason is great (most cheese is made from casein). But that requires a lot of cheese and it's easier to take the protein.

Maybe the casein is worth a try. I've been guessing that the casein in milk is contributing to the trouble, but haven't verified this, so may be worth experimenting, since you've found it so helpful. I'm currently having 1/4-1/2 tsp oyster shell for calcium, in addition to a little from veges. (Couldn't make a fine enough powder of eggshells.)
I've been having niacinamide with breakfast and dinner for well over a year, and taurine occasionally. Just recently got more systematic about taurine and glycine daily, but not at every meal.
I think I was getting similar issues with my homemade fresh cheese, so I regretfully stopped that. That's one of my reasons for suspecting casein, since I was draining off a lot of the whey. Aged cheeses seem to be even more likely to get me, much as I love them, so mostly avoid.

post 119105 I also use lysine, but it's very potent and I only need 500-1000mg a day. Do not take glycine as a supplement, the synthetic form can cause lots of bilogical problems and best to get it from gelatin. Lysine is not more powerful than a bad diet, and cheating will always interrupt any gains you might have gotten in serotonin reduction. The only option is abstinence. That being said, I do have pizza once a month. It is my ONLY cheat.

My intention is to have the Ca, Mg, glycine, taurine close to main protein meal at lunch time, at least, and maybe some other time if I get around to it. In practice, it's sometimes in the evening. Why do you consider manufactured glycine to be probematic but taurine and casein not? I'm not aware of noticing any negatives from them so far, but then I wouldn't necessarily pick them. My last batch I added a bit of lysine (~500mg) and BCAAs to as well. I was finding it easy to eat gelatine when I was drinking milk, but not been getting as much since I stopped the milk.

Most days I eat no wheat, but occasionally I really struggle to resist. My own homemade bread, which I only make infrequently and only eat a little of, usually makes me feel good in the short term, but probably not good the next day or so. I suspect you are right about this being important. I've had extended periods avoiding gluten in the past, and I think my gut is happier with that, but did not noticably reduce migraine frequency. Possibly it is a necessary but not sufficient condition for me.

post 119107 ... The way to tell if a tryptophan food converts to niacin or serotonin is this: if you eat chicken or milk and it converts to niacin, you should feel a very slight, pleasant niacin flush on your skin. I especially feel it in my forearms. If you don't get this it is converting to serotonin, and if you at all feel tension increasing in your head after a high tryptophan source, even if it's not unpleasant, this is the conversion to serotonin.

Can't say I've noticed the niacin flush - I'll try to be alert for it. Beef and lamb are significant protein sources for me, and usually feel good, but I think I'm learning not to eat much of them when I have migraine threatening - as you say, increased pressure. I eat some combination of fish, prawns, squid rings, scallop, oysters at least once a week (the last two infrequent because of price), and chicken less often. Eggs daily, a little liver 3-5 times a week.

post 119108 ...also, the key to avoiding wheat is replacing all your usually wheat dishes/go-tos with potato dishes. I make homemade potato chips in coconut oil for my junk food. Homemade fries
Are even more tasty and fun.

I do the potato chips in coconut oil too, and I don't call it junk. :)
Potatoes do seem to agree with me, and I eat some most days. I have many years practice avoiding wheat. But potatoes don't always fill that hole.

post 119109 ...I tried theanine for a time (after having much success with my other protocol) and while it uber-relaxed me during the day, it gave me insomnia again (after my insomnia had cleared for six months)

I've used theanine occasionally, but never regular/systematic. I seldom suffer insomnia. I'll take this as a recommendation not to put it at the top of my list of things to try.

post 119110 ... Sorry, typing this on my phone...the casein stuff might sound like a suggestion, but I found it to be THE thing that relived most all my symptoms, and I don't regard it as an option/suggestion but as a necessity and requirement.

Seriously considering trying it, though I still have misgivings.

Out of curiosity, are you drinking coffee? I've been fluctuating between none and a little decaf, and wondering which way to go with it. I seem to get crashes when I use more. Possibly this would be worth trying again now that i'm supplementing more thyroid.

 

[natedawggh]

Yes I drink a TON of strong coffee, always careful to have adequate blood sugar and protein before or with to avoid stress responses. I do use half and half in my coffee

You could be getting migraines from rebounds of all the other things yore taking. I noticed that while theanine was very powerful at reducing serotonin, it was very difficult to keep it that way and also had other effects like causing insomnia. It might be better to use some mild therapies like only lysine and coffee, ones that don't so utterly deplete serotonin but lower it just enough to relive symptoms and improve health, while making it easy to maintain the use of them.

 

[tara]

Update on my current routine:

Feverfew: started standardised extract once a day at new year on recommendation from someone who seems to have benefitted from it.
Aspirin: Stopped the regular aspirin I'd been taking for the previous 2-3 months when I started the feverfew. Still use some aspirin or ibuprofen intermittently when fighting.
Caffeine: Stopped coffee around Christmas, but had a little last night when fighting migraine, and a little today (very little - less than a tsp decaf - but I can tell it has an effect). I was a couple of squirts of Haidut's solban daily (more if I got burned). The last few weeks I've used my own water brew that is weaker but use more of it over more of my skin not just face.
Amino acids: Started regular amino acids glycine (~2-3g), taurine (~1g) a couple of weeks ago. Mixed a batch of powders with oyster shell and Mg supplements for a week's worth. In this week's batch I've added lysine (~500mg), BCAAs (~1g?). I've used all these AAs occasionally before, but this is the first time I've got it to a more regular daily routine. I'm mixing them with oystershell and Mg carbonate/M glycinate powders for convenience.
Thyroid: I've been gradually increasing nutrimeds thyroid over the last few months. Now taking 1/4 tablet 3 times a day (and still having a little chicken neck stock once a day). Waking axillary temps c. 36.4. Pulse seems less.
CoQ12: Added a little (~50mg) to my regular B-vit brew the last couple of weeks.

CO2: Reminded by ecstatic to attend to breathing. A couple of uphill walks with mouth shut was enough to get mild air hunger for ~20 minutes, which clearly reduced breathing for the rest of the day. I'd like to be doing this most days, or at least 3-4 times a week. I've done at least this much in the past, but life's changed, and I haven't been able to keep it up the last few years. It seems to be counterproductive when I'm fighting migraine, but probably helpful when I'm not.

Vitamins: Continuing to supplement fat solubles daily, with extra K in the hope of improving liver health and calcium management. Continuing with B-vits twice daily: B1, B2 (back up to larger doses), niacinamide, B5, B6, B7, B12.
I've used cyproheptadine (1mg) only once this year since stopping pizotifen. Didn't stop migraine; did make me sleep long.

 

[tara]

post 119127 You could be getting migraines from rebounds of all the other things yore taking. I noticed that while theanine was very powerful at reducing serotonin, it was very difficult to keep it that way and also had other effects like causing insomnia. It might be better to use some mild therapies like only lysine and coffee, ones that don't so utterly deplete serotonin but lower it just enough to relive symptoms and improve health, while making it easy to maintain the use of them.

Yes, I think rebounds could be an issue. I'm working to get it all a bit more regular, rather than just throwing everything at a threatening migraine, and forgetting some of them in between.
Coffee does not seem like a mild tactic to me. But I'm considering risking another attempt with more of it.

 

[ecstatichamster]

do you get the headaches on one side?

I always get mine in the same places. Not sure what this is about. Ray has talked about endorphins causing asymmetric symptoms and I think that this may be my issue, again back to endotoxins in my case.

Coffee: I started up with coffee to defat my liver. I couldn't handle half a cup. I had some crashes, but I persisted and now I drink 8 or 10 cups of espresso a day with no ill effects. It took 3 or 4 weeks.

I also noticed that sugar cravings subsided. I still have them but they are much milder after eating sugar or drinking juice, or barely noticeable.

Taurine used to knock me out and make me feel weird but not anymore. Neither does Theinine although I don't take it regularly.

I'm finding more and more that my headaches are linked to when I eat starch. I am suspecting onions and cooked garlic, just as a possibility.

When I started Peating I was avoiding all starch and I didn't get a headache. Now I'm eating some starch and getting headaches again, but much milder and less often than before.

For me the headaches are a whole body feeling. I have them focused in my left temple, but they may cause pain over my left eye orbit, and also a weird yucky feeling throughout my body. Corresponded with sugar cravings, but now that I'm eating a lot more sugar, that doesn't happen as much and they are much milder.

 

[natedawggh]

post 119138

post 119127 You could be getting migraines from rebounds of all the other things yore taking. I noticed that while theanine was very powerful at reducing serotonin, it was very difficult to keep it that way and also had other effects like causing insomnia. It might be better to use some mild therapies like only lysine and coffee, ones that don't so utterly deplete serotonin but lower it just enough to relive symptoms and improve health, while making it easy to maintain the use of them.

Yes, I think rebounds could be an issue. I'm working to get it all a bit more regular, rather than just throwing everything at a threatening migraine, and forgetting some of them in between.
Coffee does not seem like a mild tactic to me. But I'm considering risking another attempt with more of it.

I would only say coffee is a mild tactic because it takes more than a full day for it's effect to wear off, so it's easy to keep up consumption and thus a homeostatic level of serotonin. Because yes, it powerfully combats serotonin but the rebound is easy to stave off.

 

[tara]

post 119267 I would only say coffee is a mild tactic because it takes more than a full day for it's effect to wear off, so it's easy to keep up consumption and thus a homeostatic level of serotonin. Because yes, it powerfully combats serotonin but the rebound is easy to stave off.

The levels seem to go down at night enough to be an issue for me. I think I've read that the half-life is of the order of 8hrs, though no doubt that varies from person to person. Since it seems to support longer and deeper sleep, I can be in trouble by the time I wake up. It could be that drinking more of it would keep the level high enough to avoid this, but my past experience has been that the more coffee I drink, the harder I fall when I do go down. I may decide to try it again, but it's a risk.

 

[Kray]

Tara: Just picked up on the conversation again. Since I posted earlier here I haven't had any more migraines, and I have been doing the willow bark as a supplement, treating it in place of a "daily aspirin". 1-2 twice a day (400mg/cap). Insurance. I've also ordered feverfew but haven't gotten it. Very interesting- it's anti-inflammatory, and suppresses release of serotonin and prostaglandins! Sounds Peat-y, yes?

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3210009/

Did happen to read that f-few is one of those that needs time to work, so some report taking it long-term with good results, not just when they have a migraine. So I may try a low dose of f-few when I get it, and white willow more as-needed for migraines.

Nate: Thanks for your comments on milk/casein/tryptophan issues. I do drink a fair amount of milk- I may shift more toward cheeses for snacking to balance protein intake from milk. I have the hydrolyzed collagen (gelatin)- would it help to just add that to my milk?

Also, can you clarify the point about lysine? There is a fair amount in protein foods, including the collagen (gelatin). Are you saying that lysine will also inhibit release of serotonin? I have taken it as a supplement in the past (usu. about 1/2-1 g/day) but not recently. Wonder if I would need to if I regularly have the collagen. Also, I read something about too much lysine but don't remember what it was.

Love the coconut oil potato chips idea. Can you share the recipe?

One last question- would popcorn not be a good idea? I love it and have it about 2/week, stovetop w/coconut oil, topped with ghee butter and salt. I think Peat says it's ok but would go for masa harina fried in CO. I don't eat any wheat to speak of. I have a GF cracker with my smoked oysters or liver pate, usually only 1-2 times a week.

Thanks both for your feedback and insights. I'm looking to keep these migraines at bay. They're pretty nasty things.

 

[ecstatichamster]

Popcorn is difficult to digest. And it is loaded with pufas I would think. Masa Harina is a different story because it has gone through some pre-digestion in a sense.

 

[tara]

Love the coconut oil potato chips idea. Can you share the recipe?

I'm sure there are other ways to do it, but this is what I do for me and my kids:
Heat oven and melt a couple of tablespoons coconut oil in oven dish.
Peel and cut potatoes into fingers or slices.
Put in oven dish and stir around to get coconut oil spread over as much as you can. Use more or less coconut oil as you please depending on quantity of potatoes, taste, and desired dietary fat.
Bake in oven for 15-20 minutes.
Stir/turn.
Bake till soft - ~ another 15-20 mins.
Salt and eat.

 

[Kray]

I'm sure there are other ways to do it, but this is what I do for me and my kids:
Heat oven and melt a couple of tablespoons coconut oil in oven dish.
Peel and cut potatoes into fingers or slices.
Put in oven dish and stir around to get coconut oil spread over as much as you can. Use more or less coconut oil as you please depending on quantity of potatoes, taste, and desired dietary fat.
Bake in oven for 15-20 minutes.
Stir/turn.
Bake till soft - ~ another 15-20 mins.
Salt and eat.

Tara,
Can't wait to try- thanks a bunch! What are your favorite types of potato to use?

Thanks!

 

[tara]

Popcorn is difficult to digest.

I agree - very hard husks. I guess that might stimulate serotonin, as well as just being a bit rough on the gut.

Some PUFA, but probably not extreme, for a small helping every now and then.

My guess is not optimal, but if you don't get noticable bad effects, a little now and then might not be the worst thing.
I do an occasional batch for my kids - cooked in coconut oil and with butter added after. I usually eat a few. I think it's the butter flavour I really like. For me, I'm better off with potatoes and butter or coconut oil than popcorn, but popcorn probably beats wheat bread (which I seldom eat).