Topical Propecia/Finasteride For Hair Loss

[5a-DHP]

All topical Finasteride preparations tested (even those made with advanced formulations) have been shown to go systemic in studies. You might as well be taking the oral version. As someone who has been dealing with Post-Finasteride syndrome for the past 4 years, I do not recommend that you touch this drug in any way, shape or form.

Regarding allopregnanolone, since Finasteride is not supposed to inhibit 5-AR1, it should not do that, at least not directly. The problem has mainly been observed in people who have persisting side effects after quitting, where there is likely a negative-feedback event that occurs after the sharp return of DHT which essentially drastically downregulates the 5-AR1 in the CNS. This is then the cause of persistent brain-fog and a host of other neurological issues. I have them, and believe me, you do not want them.

Have you tried 5a-dihydroprogesterone to skip the 5ar-dependent step of allopregnanolone synthesis? Might help with the brain fog.

 

[tallglass13]

After decades of messing with fin I found it best to use it with an aromatase inhibitor and a low dose pro-androgen (DHEA 1-5mg sublingual). Start with the lowest effective fin dose (.05mg/day!!) and titre up until you feel or see sides in semen quality, then back off to about 50%. You don't want anywhere near complete DHT inhibition, just to "cool off" the pathway. You body will adjust to it after week or two.

Topical scalp doses can be much higher (10x) without affecting free testosterone and IMHO is the way to go. Combine with a robust exercise routine and you won't experience any problems. Tons of gym rats and other alpha dudes have used it for decades with no problems. It's one of the few scripts Trump was reported on and his hair is quite rocking for his age, plus his energy level is like a freight train.

Like all substances dose makes the poison. Fin is quite safe when used properly and probably has numerous systemic benefits other than hair health (prostate, anti-tumor, etc). Hair quality is a visible indicator of systemic health, and preserving it is a general indicator of a healthy hormonal balance.

You seem to know a lot about Fin. Are you using oral or topical e or both?

 

[Infarouge]

The amount of fin systemically absorbed is minimal when applied to the scalp at the correct dose. This is the case with all drugs, they have very low transdermal bio-availability. Most anything you put on topically has some systemic absorption but it's a far cry from "may as well take the oral version". Fin works, it works well. It has sides in some people, like anything that works. Many couch potatoes attribute their aging lethargy to having taken fin once, it's human nature. Those peeps should start lifting or other vigorous exercise and stop blaming the fin fairy for their manboobies.

All topical Finasteride preparations tested (even those made with advanced formulations) have been shown to go systemic in studies. You might as well be taking the oral version. As someone who has been dealing with Post-Finasteride syndrome for the past 4 years, I do not recommend that you touch this drug in any way, shape or form.

 

[Infarouge]

You seem to know a lot about Fin. Are you using oral or topical e or both?

I stick to topical these days, but I have no negative sides from taking fin orally at a calibrated dose as I outlined. My hormone panels have been excellent. IMO dialing in DHT to normal levels has numerous systemic benefits.

 

[MyUsernameHere]

You and I are clearly fishing at opposite sides of the pond. My life experience has me disagreeing with nearly everything you've said. I've taken Finasteride for 1 year and I am here 4 years later still trying to fix the damage.

You're welcome to take it and laud it as far as you like - I will never in my right mind even recommend it to anyone.

 

[Vegancrossfit]

PFS could be neuronal (via apoptosis due to the prolonged lack of dht) but it’s annoying that studies can’t show a difference in PFS between placebo and Fin/Dut groups. Sounds like nocebo.

In any event @MyUsernameHere why don’t you just give HCG a shot. LH (it’s an analogue) will pump all your enzymes through the roof. 500iu two to three days a week and eat some extra eggs maybe. Keep E2 in check. Keep an eye on cortisol. Barring test suspension every day I think that HCG is as physiological as it gets when it comes to androgens.

 

[Kenny]

The amount of fin systemically absorbed is minimal when applied to the scalp at the correct dose. This is the case with all drugs, they have very low transdermal bio-availability. Most anything you put on topically has some systemic absorption but it's a far cry from "may as well take the oral version". Fin works, it works well. It has sides in some people, like anything that works. Many couch potatoes attribute their aging lethargy to having taken fin once, it's human nature. Those peeps should start lifting or other vigorous exercise and stop blaming the fin fairy for their manboobies.

The systemic reduction appears to be the same in the studies comparing topical to oral.

Making claims like PFS is due to couch potatoism is unfounded and hurtful to people who are struggling. We do not have any good way to measure the neurosteroidal damage involved in PFS.

 

[Infarouge]

Like I outlined in post #19 above, Fin dose is paramount and titrating to well below any sides will keep you in a healthy window of modest DHT suppression without shutting down the pathway. The research shows effective DHT supression by oral fin starts around .02mg ( less than a dose of LSD). The 5mg propecia pills people are popping is ~200x the effective dose. Try drinking 200 gallons of H20 and see how deadly water is.

Often when pharma can't entirely suppress an effective medication, they will normalize megadoses that causes long term health problems that they can profit from on the back end. This was the case with hydrocortisone which was considered a miracle hormone in alternative circles in the 40s. Tretinoin (retin-a) also comes to mind, which like hydrocort isn't technically a drug but a naturally occuring bio-identical hormone (a fraction of the retinol complex). Accutane (oral tretinoin) is very effective and safe for acne at 5mg doses a couple times a week, but many teens where overdosed with 60mg-120mg daily causing birth defects and neurological problems, which caused it to be almost blacklisted from the pharmacies around the time is was going off patent. Acne is a 8 billion dollar annual market. This was around the time a lot of research was showing tretinoin is a very effective cancer treatment. The hairloss treatement market cap: incalculable.

For anyone particularly sensitive to fin or accutane, they can take a few mg of pregnenalone which will compensate for the allopregnanolone suppression that was responsible for many of the negative sides from long term overdose.

 

[Vegancrossfit]

100% agreeing with the fact that most drugs are megadosed for profit. Same goes with AIs for instance. Everyone knows Aromasin isn't needed at 25 mg/day. 25 mg/WEEK most likely more than enough. Ditto for DHEA (100 mg/day via Amazon anyone?) and so on

 

[Kenny]

Like I outlined in post #19 above, Fin dose is paramount and titrating to well below any sides will keep you in a healthy window of modest DHT suppression without shutting down the pathway. The research shows effective DHT supression by oral fin starts around .02mg ( less than a dose of LSD). The 5mg propecia pills people are popping is ~200x the effective dose. Try drinking 200 gallons of H20 and see how deadly water is.

Often when pharma can't entirely suppress an effective medication, they will normalize megadoses that causes long term health problems that they can profit from on the back end. This was the case with hydrocortisone which was considered a miracle hormone in alternative circles in the 40s. Tretinoin (retin-a) also comes to mind, which like hydrocort isn't technically a drug but a naturally occuring bio-identical hormone (a fraction of the retinol complex). Accutane (oral tretinoin) is very effective and safe for acne at 5mg doses a couple times a week, but many teens where overdosed with 60mg-120mg daily causing birth defects and neurological problems, which caused it to be almost blacklisted from the pharmacies around the time is was going off patent. Acne is a 8 billion dollar annual market. This was around the time a lot of research was showing tretinoin is a very effective cancer treatment. The hairloss treatement market cap: incalculable.

For anyone particularly sensitive to fin or accutane, they can take a few mg of pregnenalone which will compensate for the allopregnanolone suppression that was responsible for many of the negative sides from long term overdose.

Propecia is 1 mg iirc- a lot of folks now take 1 mg three times a week per the recommendation given by the "Hair Loss Show" (youtube australian hair Docs). Proscar is the prostate drug which is 5mg- it is often cut into quarters to be 1.25mg doses.

You seem very sure that topical fin can be used to avoid side effects. Frankly I am pretty desperate and would certainly be willing to consider using it if it does in fact not go systemic. I am worried that a systemic reduction in DhT before I am done developing could seriously harm me later on. Not to mention the neurosteroids it can effect.

 

[Vegancrossfit]

it is difficult for me to understand why someone would want to pop 5ar inhibitors for the rest of their life when we have something like nandrolone that can be pinned twice a week (NPP) subcutaneously = 0 pain whatsoever.

Nandrolone (19-Nortestosterone): An Alternative Androgen Option for Transgender Hormone Therapy with Reduced Androgenic Skin and Hair Side Effects Compared to Testosterone : MtFHRT

NPP over Deca would be because of faster elimination

 

[Kenny]

it is difficult for me to understand why someone would want to pop 5ar inhibitors for the rest of their life when we have something like nandrolone that can be pinned twice a week (NPP) subcutaneously = 0 pain whatsoever.

Nandrolone (19-Nortestosterone): An Alternative Androgen Option for Transgender Hormone Therapy with Reduced Androgenic Skin and Hair Side Effects Compared to Testosterone : MtFHRT

NPP over Deca would be because of faster elimination

I don't know anything about nandrolone aside from it being an anabolic steroid. People are willing to pop 5ar inhibitors because they are easily prescribed my medical professionals, the side effects are said to be rare, and they are recommended all over the internet.

I have also heard that it has a serious cardiac sides though don't quote me on that.