Noradrenaline (and Likely Adrenalin) Increases Estrogen

[haidut]

The mechanism is through activation of aromatase. Note the double hit - i.e. noradrenalin both increased the synthesis of estrogen through aromatase AND also decreased DHT synthesis through 5-AR.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6290295

"...NE (10 microM) added to pineal organ cultures increased by 72% the conversion of [14C]testosterone into estradiol and depressed by 39 and 53% that into the 5 alpha-reduced metabolites 5 alpha-dihydrotestosterone (5-DHT) and 5 alpha-androstanediol (5 alpha-diol)."

The study used beta-blockers to negate the effect but I am thinking that clonidine may also work b/c it has been reported to increase libido (a symptom of higher T / DHT) and decrease water retention (a symptom of high estrogen).

 

[Peata]

The mechanism is through activation of aromatase. Note the double hit - i.e. noradrenalin both increased the synthesis of estrogen through aromatase AND also decreased DHT synthesis through 5-AR.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6290295

"...NE (10 microM) added to pineal organ cultures increased by 72% the conversion of [14C]testosterone into estradiol and depressed by 39 and 53% that into the 5 alpha-reduced metabolites 5 alpha-dihydrotestosterone (5-DHT) and 5 alpha-androstanediol (5 alpha-diol)."

The study used beta-blockers to negate the effect but I am thinking that clonidine may also work b/c it has been reported to increase libido (a symptom of higher T / DHT) and decrease water retention (a symptom of high estrogen).

Can you think of other things will may work besides clonidine?

 

[haidut]

The mechanism is through activation of aromatase. Note the double hit - i.e. noradrenalin both increased the synthesis of estrogen through aromatase AND also decreased DHT synthesis through 5-AR.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6290295

"...NE (10 microM) added to pineal organ cultures increased by 72% the conversion of [14C]testosterone into estradiol and depressed by 39 and 53% that into the 5 alpha-reduced metabolites 5 alpha-dihydrotestosterone (5-DHT) and 5 alpha-androstanediol (5 alpha-diol)."

The study used beta-blockers to negate the effect but I am thinking that clonidine may also work b/c it has been reported to increase libido (a symptom of higher T / DHT) and decrease water retention (a symptom of high estrogen).

Can you think of other things will may work besides clonidine?

Well, I am guessing salt, taurine, and niacinamide among others. Taurine especially, has a number of studies showing decrease in plasma adrenalin and noradrenalin. I am sure there are more substances but those come to mind first. I think Peat also said casein lowers adrenalin as opposed to whey, but obviously you have to make sure you eat it with enough sugar.

 

[nullredvector]

Two years later would you add anything on the subject @haidut ?

I guess we know now things like glycine, caffeine, and niacinamide are 5alpha promoters

Slat and lithium to lower adrenaline

 

[docall18]

P5p b6 lowers adrenaline.

On a different point, I wonder if the bad reactions people get from pregnenolone and dhea is due to cortisol getting lowered and adrenaline increasing to cover the drop in metabolism.
The adrenaline then would increase estrogen. This would explain the high estrogen that most people get from supplementing pregnenolone.

In this situation preg & b6 would be a good combo provided your thyroid was reasonable..

 

[Kasper]

But cortisol also increase estrogen.

 

[Regina]

Well, I am guessing salt, taurine, and niacinamide among others. Taurine especially, has a number of studies showing decrease in plasma adrenalin and noradrenalin. I am sure there are more substances but those come to mind first. I think Peat also said casein lowers adrenalin as opposed to whey, but obviously you have to make sure you eat it with enough sugar.

Hi haidut, Since writing the above in 2014, do you have any new suggestions for lowering noradrenalin? Thx!

 

[haidut]

Hi haidut, Since writing the above in 2014, do you have any new suggestions for lowering noradrenalin? Thx!

Inosine can directly inactivate both adrenaline and noradrenaline.

 

[Regina]

Inosine can directly inactivate both adrenaline and noradrenaline.

Thank you!!

 

[Parsifal]

I have a problem of adrenalin with anything that increases dopamine. Wonder how to block the conversion of dopamine to adrenaline and if that's why people with dementia have a lot of dopamine in their urine. Wonder if serotonin would be an agonist or antagonist of adrenaline.

 

[Regina]

I have a problem of adrenalin with anything that increases dopamine. Wonder how to block the conversion of dopamine to adrenaline and if that's why people with dementia have a lot of dopamine in their urine. Wonder if serotonin would be an agonist or antagonist of adrenaline.

Yep. I am the same Parsifal.

 

[Parsifal]

I have a problem of adrenalin with anything that increases dopamine. Wonder how to block the conversion of dopamine to adrenaline and if that's why people with dementia have a lot of dopamine in their urine. Wonder if serotonin would be an agonist or antagonist of adrenaline.

Cannot edit my message, I meant psychosis not dementia. Very hard to know how to find the good balance and equilibrium as I always want more dopamine since I am tired and full of brain fog otherwise, but always gives me anxiety or even panic attacks due to adrenaline. Strange as it seems to reduce prolactine/serotonin and increase testosterone but at the same time can act as testosterone by "aromatizing" to adrenaline which increases probably NO, estrogen and vasopressin.

 

[Regina]

Cannot edit my message, I meant psychosis not dementia. Very hard to know how to find the good balance and equilibrium as I always want more dopamine since I am tired and full of brain fog otherwise, but always gives me anxiety or even panic attacks due to adrenaline. Strange as it seems to reduce prolactine/serotonin and increase testosterone but at the same time can act as testosterone by "aromatizing" to adrenaline which increases probably NO, estrogen and vasopressin.

I had posted my blood catecholamine results on the forum and haidut suggested having the following copper and iron tests: serum iron, ferritin, transferrin, iron saturation, serum copper and ceruloplasmin. He noted that both copper and iron are pretty important for the catecholamine system and especially NE levels.
So while my results suggest an over-active dopamine beta-hydroxylase and inhibiting mono-oxygenase enzyme might help, I may be able to gain a better understanding why with looking at the copper/iron status.
I didn't get around to getting these tests. Other calamaties fell in front of that plan (shattering my front tooth and I have to have an implant surgery this month and also a burst water pipe causing damage and a need to address all that, among other shite). I plan on getting the tests after my oral surgery ordeal.

 

[Parsifal]

I had posted my blood catecholamine results on the forum and haidut suggested having the following copper and iron tests: serum iron, ferritin, transferrin, iron saturation, serum copper and ceruloplasmin. He noted that both copper and iron are pretty important for the catecholamine system and especially NE levels.
So while my results suggest an over-active dopamine beta-hydroxylase and inhibiting mono-oxygenase enzyme might help, I may be able to gain a better understanding why with looking at the copper/iron status.
I didn't get around to getting these tests. Other calamaties fell in front of that plan (shattering my front tooth and I have to have an implant surgery this month and also a burst water pipe causing damage and a need to address all that, among other shite). I plan on getting the tests after my oral surgery ordeal.

Good luck, ganbatte!

 

[Regina]

Inosine can directly inactivate both adrenaline and noradrenaline.

Now I am starting to wonder if I have an ulcer(s).
There's just something wrong. With this "tilting" on the mat.
Ceiling fans were running all overhead tonight . Awful! The cold wind felt terrible during training. It's not my place to offer unsolicited advice.
Frustrating. I am not hyperventilating as much but want to vomit when I get home.
Maybe famotidine plus inosine plus sodium bicarbonate could help pre-workout.

 

[bdawg]

@haidut whats your opinion on this? would you say clonidine is a net positive considering the below?

"A stimulant such as methylphenidate is an indirect agonist that facilitates the action of both dopamine (DA) and norepinephrine (NE) through multiple mechanisms. By contrast, alpha 2 agonists exert their effects primarily through NE activity."

"In this context, alpha 2 adrenergic agonists (ie, guanfacine and clonidine) are considered to be alternatives to stimulants based on their ability to modulate noradrenergic tone in the PFC. This modulation is a consequence of both enhanced noradrenergic input from the locus coeruleus and direct postsynaptic stimulation of alpha 2A receptors. "

http://www.medscape.org/viewarticle/577743

 

[haidut]

@haidut whats your opinion on this? would you say clonidine is a net positive considering the below?

"A stimulant such as methylphenidate is an indirect agonist that facilitates the action of both dopamine (DA) and norepinephrine (NE) through multiple mechanisms. By contrast, alpha 2 agonists exert their effects primarily through NE activity."

"In this context, alpha 2 adrenergic agonists (ie, guanfacine and clonidine) are considered to be alternatives to stimulants based on their ability to modulate noradrenergic tone in the PFC. This modulation is a consequence of both enhanced noradrenergic input from the locus coeruleus and direct postsynaptic stimulation of alpha 2A receptors. "

http://www.medscape.org/viewarticle/577743

Not aware of any human who experienced stimulation from clonidine. Quite to the contrary actually, most people feel wiped out if they take too much and this is why it is also used for alcohol/drug withdrawal - i.e. it calms people down who are agitated to start with.

 

[raypeatclips]

@haidut Are you aware if lowering estrogen would work to lower adrenaline or is the relationship only adrenaline raising estrogen?

 

[mayweatherking]

The mechanism is through activation of aromatase. Note the double hit - i.e. noradrenalin both increased the synthesis of estrogen through aromatase AND also decreased DHT synthesis through 5-AR.

Norepinephrine stimulates testosterone aromatization and inhibits 5 alpha reduction via beta-adrenoceptors in rat pineal gland. - PubMed - NCBI

"...NE (10 microM) added to pineal organ cultures increased by 72% the conversion of [14C]testosterone into estradiol and depressed by 39 and 53% that into the 5 alpha-reduced metabolites 5 alpha-dihydrotestosterone (5-DHT) and 5 alpha-androstanediol (5 alpha-diol)."

The study used beta-blockers to negate the effect but I am thinking that clonidine may also work b/c it has been reported to increase libido (a symptom of higher T / DHT) and decrease water retention (a symptom of high estrogen).

Pretty interesting dude. I think it speaks volumes about why masturbation can be bad. Especially when "edging" happens. Referring to holding offf on orgasm and constantly continuing to to engage in act but delaying the orgasm from happening. I wonder how kuch of this attributes to hair loss, I really believe it plays a larger part.

It's also interesting considering how well taurine works for hair loss if it is lowering thjs adrenaline as well...

 

[ddjd]

is calcium d glucarate any good at reducing estradiol?