John McDougall Looks Awful

[tallglass13]

Ray looks like a good 65 yr age in that photo. My uncle is active and strong but is more grey and looser skin in the neck chin area at 65. That is is 20yrs off Ray's age. Not to mention his mind and story recall is off the charts as well.

 

[morgan#1]

Wow, for 50 Dr. Sinclair looks excellent.

He's still only 50, though.
I don't think he looks fine for someone promoting a diet for optimal health and longevity. If a layman, then he would look average or slightly below.

Here are other personalities for comparison.

Mark Sisson, a promoter of the paleolithic diet at age 65:

Neal Barnard, promoter of a plant-based vegan diet, aged 65:

Dr. Peat, promoter of the transcendent Over-man diet at the age of 82:

Loren Cordain, advocate of the paleolithic diet, aged 68:

President Bill Clinton; consumer of the bean-vegetable-and-fruit diet; enlisted recruit on the starship Enterprise at the age of 72:

President Donald Trump at the age of 72; favorite bedtime snack is steak and ice cream.

Those who eat a plant-based diet have apparent skin inelasticity and a sunken, gaunt appearance.

Dr. Sinclair looks smarmy
Sisson looks drunk
Barnard looks like he’s missing out on some major macronutrients
Peat (and of course I’m biased) looks like he’s got it all together; look at all of their eyes
Courdain looks like a dullard (dumb & dumber; Jeff Daniels)
Bill Clinton’s a little wacky now
And Trump is a ****head

Really just having fun, not with trump he is a ****head

 

[morgan#1]

Oops, I forgot livewire was on this thread. I do agree that calling people out because of the way they “look” is a valid complaint, but I think people who advertise their diets are free for all...jokes.

Also, there’s a possibility that the vibe someone gives out might be really how they are.

 

[Goobz]

How is he off with his views on estrogen? Where else is he off? PUFAs?

I’ve posted about estrogen a bit already and caused a stir, so I won’t clog up this thread. If you search my posts it should come up.

Anyway I can’t tell if you’re being sarcastic here, but Ill answer it seriously. I think RPs work on PUFAs is really valuable.

But of course he’s not going to be right about everything. Why? Because he’s a human being. No one person has all the answers. But as humans we are naturally drawn to them as if they do, as if they were prophets.

The rise in life expectancy, health and safety around the world is largely due to phasing out human errors and using automatic checks, data and computing in all walks of life. Airline accidents are much rarer due to automated checks. The amount of data on aromatase, estradiol etc is growing exponentially.

 

[yerrag]

I’ve posted about estrogen a bit already and caused a stir, so I won’t clog up this thread. If you search my posts it should come up.

Anyway I can’t tell if you’re being sarcastic here, but Ill answer it seriously. I think RPs work on PUFAs is really valuable.

But of course he’s not going to be right about everything. Why? Because he’s a human being. No one person has all the answers. But as humans we are naturally drawn to them as if they do, as if they were prophets.

The rise in life expectancy, health and safety around the world is largely due to phasing out human errors and using automatic checks, data and computing in all walks of life. Airline accidents are much rarer due to automated checks. The amount of data on aromatase, estradiol etc is growing exponentially.

Peat's not expected to be right on all counts, as you say. But you could point to some links to your posts, or give a summary of it, as it's just too lazy of you to just say something so controversial to this forum without having to give so much an explanation for it.

And then you leave another little piece of puzzle for people to decipher. What do you mean by "The amount of data on aromatase, estradiol etc is growing expoentially?" Having another hard time unpacking this statement.

 

[Goobz]

Peat's not expected to be right on all counts, as you say. But you could point to some links to your posts, or give a summary of it, as it's just too lazy of you to just say something so controversial to this forum without having to give so much an explanation for it.

Ok I’ll start a new thread. In the meantime very short summary (I’m on my phone).

- the estradiol form of estrogen (E2) appears largely beneficial
- aromatase is a critical enzyme
- many of testosterones benefits are mediated via its conversion to estradiol..... in the tissue itself. Particularly the brain. Large density of aromatase in the hippocampus, crucial for memory.
- lowering or blocking these for no good reason doesn’t benefit health, it hampers it
- more recent data on transdermal E2 in older women shows large reductions in CVD, neurological illnesses, all cause mortality
- recent study in older men showed the only hormone correlated with lower biological age was E2. Higher the E2, the younger and healthier the markers showed the men were

Neuroprotection by the steroids pregnenolone and dehydroepiandrosterone is mediated by the enzyme aromatase. - PubMed - NCBI

 

[yerrag]

Ok I’ll start a new thread. In the meantime very short summary (I’m on my phone).

- the estradiol form of estrogen (E2) appears largely beneficial
- aromatase is a critical enzyme
- many of testosterones benefits are mediated via its conversion to estradiol..... in the tissue itself. Particularly the brain. Large density of aromatase in the hippocampus, crucial for memory.
- lowering or blocking these for no good reason doesn’t benefit health, it hampers it
- more recent data on transdermal E2 in older women shows large reductions in CVD, neurological illnesses, all cause mortality
- recent study in older men showed the only hormone correlated with lower biological age was E2. Higher the E2, the younger and healthier the markers showed the men were

Neuroprotection by the steroids pregnenolone and dehydroepiandrosterone is mediated by the enzyme aromatase. - PubMed - NCBI

Thanks. Since you have something worth sharing, I welcome the new thread very much!

 

[Goobz]

Thanks. Since you have something worth sharing, I welcome the new thread very much!

Thanks for the welcoming response.

I should add I find many of RPs ideas very valuable (hence why I’m here). In my case it appears my health was severely damaged by being prescribed an aromatase inhibitor. This lead me to do a lot of research and RPs site and this forum have been very useful for me. The RP view on estrogen is one that doesn’t seem to gel with everything else I’ve read. But maybe I still don’t understand it well enough myself.

So I don’t have an a bone to pick or anything. I’m not selling hormones or an alternative view. That’s why I haven’t been that keen to post the thread and have a massive debate. I’m just another guy trying to improve his health.

 

[Rafael Lao Wai]

Oops, I forgot livewire was on this thread. I do agree that calling people out because of the way they “look” is a valid complaint, but I think people who advertise their diets are free for all...jokes.

Also, there’s a possibility that the vibe someone gives out might be really how they are.

Well, people with advanced cancer or AIDS look really bad. Apperance is surely one way to judge if one is healthy or not. Of course, it's not the only way to do that.

 

[DaveFoster]

Oops, I forgot livewire was on this thread. I do agree that calling people out because of the way they “look” is a valid complaint, but I think people who advertise their diets are free for all...jokes.

Also, there’s a possibility that the vibe someone gives out might be really how they are.

Well, people with advanced cancer or AIDS look really bad. Apperance is surely one way to judge if one is healthy or not. Of course, it's not the only way to do that.

Yes. If appearance indicates anything, then it would be health. "Youthful appearance" comes to mind. The kind of separation between appearance and health does not reflect Dr. Peat's writings at all.

"Skin and bones are such different types of tissue that it will be useful to start with them, because if we can see similar processes of degeneration or regeneration in them, then the chances are good that the same processes will occur in other tissues too. Bone is a relatively stable tissue, while skin is a tissue whose cells divide rapidly."

Blocking Tissue Destruction

A younger John McDougall looked handsome and healthy, and only until recently did his appearance deteriorate rapidly. Dr. Peat, in the other hand, has aged very well.

 

[JudiBlueHen]

Meanwhile back to the OP...I've always thought McDougall, and also his wife, look scrawny. That is not at all attractive in my view, nor particularly healthy.

 

[tca300]

Here's my great grandparents, Grandpa 95, Grandma 93
Both eat/ate out of his garden most of their lives ( berries, carrots, potatoes, greens) he drank orange juice every day with breakfast, coffee, venison, milk, cheese. Neither smoke, he has occasional Brandy.

 

[High_Prob]

Yes. If appearance indicates anything, then it would be health. "Youthful appearance" comes to mind. The kind of separation between appearance and health does not reflect Dr. Peat's writings at all.

"Skin and bones are such different types of tissue that it will be useful to start with them, because if we can see similar processes of degeneration or regeneration in them, then the chances are good that the same processes will occur in other tissues too. Bone is a relatively stable tissue, while skin is a tissue whose cells divide rapidly."

Blocking Tissue Destruction

A younger John McDougall looked handsome and healthy, and only until recently did his appearance deteriorate rapidly. Dr. Peat, in the other hand, has aged very well.

Didn’t McDougall lose his house in the California fires not too long ago? I would think that that would be an enormous amount of stress especially for someone that is more advanced in age...

 

[yerrag]

Didn’t McDougall lose his house in the California fires? I would think that that would be an enormous amount of stress especially for someone that is more advanced in age...

That would be very stressful on him. Hope he has recovered from it.

 

[morgan#1]

Yes. If appearance indicates anything, then it would be health. "Youthful appearance" comes to mind. The kind of separation between appearance and health does not reflect Dr. Peat's writings at all.

"Skin and bones are such different types of tissue that it will be useful to start with them, because if we can see similar processes of degeneration or regeneration in them, then the chances are good that the same processes will occur in other tissues too. Bone is a relatively stable tissue, while skin is a tissue whose cells divide rapidly."

Blocking Tissue Destruction

A younger John McDougall looked handsome and healthy, and only until recently did his appearance deteriorate rapidly. Dr. Peat, in the other hand, has aged very well.

My “joking” was about how strange they look:
Dr. Sinclair looks smarmy
Sisson looks drunk
Barnard looks like he’s missing out on some major macronutrients
Peat (and of course I’m biased) looks like he’s got it all together; look at all of their eyes
Courdain looks like a dullard (dumb & dumber; Jeff Daniels)
Bill Clinton’s a little wacky now
And Trump is a ****head

This is not a joke:
“Skin and bones are such different types of tissue that it will be useful to start with them, because if we can see similar processes of degeneration or regeneration in them, then the chances are good that the same processes will occur in other tissues too. Bone is a relatively stable tissue, while skin is a tissue whose cells divide rapidly."
Brilliant from Ray Peat

My response was too my previous comment, which you can see above. I felt that anyone who comes out with their freakish diets should be lampooned.

And if you look at each person’s eyes, Peat leaves them in the dust. He’s ******* intelligent, and so with it.

 

[DaveFoster]

Here's my great grandparents, Grandpa 95, Grandma 93
Both eat/ate out of his garden most of their lives ( berries, carrots, potatoes, greens) he drank orange juice every day with breakfast, coffee, venison, milk, cheese. Neither smoke, he has occasional Brandy.

View attachment 13498 View attachment 13499

Thanks for sharing! Both look good, especially your grandpa. I can't find any major wrinkles on him!

 

[Fractality]

Ok I’ll start a new thread. In the meantime very short summary (I’m on my phone).

- the estradiol form of estrogen (E2) appears largely beneficial
- aromatase is a critical enzyme
- many of testosterones benefits are mediated via its conversion to estradiol..... in the tissue itself. Particularly the brain. Large density of aromatase in the hippocampus, crucial for memory.
- lowering or blocking these for no good reason doesn’t benefit health, it hampers it
- more recent data on transdermal E2 in older women shows large reductions in CVD, neurological illnesses, all cause mortality
- recent study in older men showed the only hormone correlated with lower biological age was E2. Higher the E2, the younger and healthier the markers showed the men were

Neuroprotection by the steroids pregnenolone and dehydroepiandrosterone is mediated by the enzyme aromatase. - PubMed - NCBI

I think the key issue is knowing just when certain hormones are "out of line" and need to be enforced to a certain level. Perhaps that level is different for every individual organism? That would balance this view. Context truly is key, and it is up to each one of us as individuals to determine our context.

 

[yerrag]

Here's my great grandparents, Grandpa 95, Grandma 93
Both eat/ate out of his garden most of their lives ( berries, carrots, potatoes, greens) he drank orange juice every day with breakfast, coffee, venison, milk, cheese. Neither smoke, he has occasional Brandy.

View attachment 13498 View attachment 13499

So they are great great grandparents? Wow! 5 generations and in their 90s. Long life and blessings. Plenty of deer around to have venison.

We have a lot of country here too - in the ads for our condos lol! If only they advertised venison as well, I'd snatch one unit.

 

[tca300]

So they are great great grandparents? Wow! 5 generations and in their 90s. Long life and blessings. Plenty of deer around to have venison.

We have a lot of country here too - in the ads for our condos lol! If only they advertised venison as well, I'd snatch one unit.

Ya, the girls are their great great grandchildren. He was a serious deer hunter most of his life.

 

[tca300]

Thanks for sharing! Both look good, especially your grandpa. I can't find any major wrinkles on him!