Nixtamilized Corn

Mauritio

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Would those be still present in the food that's made out of that dough ?

"Lactobacilli identified in the fermenting nixtamalized corn dough were Lactobacillus plantarum, Lactobacillus fermentum and Lactobacillus cellobiosus as well as Pediococcus spp."
 

Jessie

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My only source of starch has been potatoes for quite some time, but I think I'm going to make the switch to masa harina. I've been making some really simple crunchy tortillas lately from it and they're good. The only ingredients are water, salt, and masa. I press them and cook them in a hot pan for about 3-4 minutes each side. If I have some available, I'll substitute the water for oxtail broth. Higher in calcium then potatoes and I think they've been digesting better too. Literally no gas at all.
 

GeoX

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I bought a bag of Bob's Red Mill Organic Masa Harina to try. Cooked some masa and water over the stove for 5-10 minutes, and then mixed in goat milk, honey, salt and an egg into a thick porridge. Tasty and went down well.
 

equipoise

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My only source of starch has been potatoes for quite some time, but I think I'm going to make the switch to masa harina. I've been making some really simple crunchy tortillas lately from it and they're good. The only ingredients are water, salt, and masa. I press them and cook them in a hot pan for about 3-4 minutes each side. If I have some available, I'll substitute the water for oxtail broth. Higher in calcium then potatoes and I think they've been digesting better too. Literally no gas at all.
That's amazing I've been also wanting to try some masa, hell bent on finding it. Seems hard in Europe
 

Mauritio

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Yesterday after eating nixtamalized cornctortillas for the first time , I got the biggest stomach cramps of my life !
 

Apple

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I nixtamalized corn and found not worthy the effort. Basically all the fiber is detroyed and you get gelatinized starch which is supposed to be good but so is par boiled rice and with no lime after-taste. With no fiber it is moving through intestines slowly and would cause constipation considerling it may contain some alkaline solution in it.
But no matter nixtamalized or not, organic, gmo, non-gmo, I always end up with some sort of dermatitis on my face after consuming corn for several days... Though canned corn is ok, no isssues at all. As for nixtamalized cornctortillas there are studies showing that after couple hours after preparation they are full of mycotoxins and basically dangerous.
Don't waste your time on it, canned corn ( or corn on the cob) once in a while is fine but as a stapple foood - "when better foods are available they should be used instead" :)
 
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Mauritio

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I nixtamalized corn and found not worthy the effort. Basically all the fiber is detroyed and you get gelatinized starch which is supposed to be good but so is par boiled rice and with no lime after-taste. With no fiber it is moving through intestines slowly and would cause constipation considerling it may contain some alkaline solution in it.
But no matter nixtamalized or not, organic, gmo, non-gmo, I always end up with some sort of dermatitis on my face after consuming corn for several days... Though canned corn is ok, no isssues at all. As for nixtamalized cornctortillas there are studies showing that after couple hours after preparation they are full of mycotoxins and basically dangerous.
Don't waste your time on it, canned corn ( or corn on the cob) once in a while is fine but as a stapple foood - "when better foods are available they should be used instead" :)
Damn now I dont know what to do. I thought nixtamalized corn would actually contain less mycotoxins.
I emailed peat because of the stomach cramps and his opinion on what caused it ...
 

Jessie

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That's amazing I've been also wanting to try some masa, hell bent on finding it. Seems hard in Europe
You can probably find it in a Mexican grocery store if you have one in your area. It's how I get mine.
 
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Beastmode

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Since starting this thread, I've been pretty consistent with my intake of Masa and it definitely works well for me. I have zero cravings for rice, bread or potatoes.

Also, I've found I feel just the same on the "organic" brands of masa and the cheap ones that I can get at the local grocery store. I get a large bag for around 3-4 dollars and it lasts a few weeks or so. Peat mentioned something similar in his experience with different brands as well.
 

Jessie

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Since starting this thread, I've been pretty consistent with my intake of Masa and it definitely works well for me. I have zero cravings for rice, bread or potatoes.

Also, I've found I feel just the same on the "organic" brands of masa and the cheap ones that I can get at the local grocery store. I get a large bag for around 3-4 dollars and it lasts a few weeks or so. Peat mentioned something similar in his experience with different brands as well.
Same here, I buy the cheap conventional stuff. I know GMOs are a concern for some people, but it ranks more toward the bottom of my list of concerns. Organic to for that matter. The only thing I exclusively buy organic is fruits, because they seem to ripen better.
 
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Beastmode

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Same here, I buy the cheap conventional stuff. I know GMOs are a concern for some people, but it ranks more toward the bottom of my list of concerns. Organic to for that matter. The only thing I exclusively buy organic is fruits, because they seem to ripen better.
I think how you feel is the most important with some consideration of the source of food.

We typically get as much organic as possible, especially fruits and meats, but that can become it's own stressor if taken too seriously.
 

Apple

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I think nixtamalized corn is comparable with par boiled rice. In both cases starch is gelatinized, that's what makes it good from ray peat's experiments, they did observe no starch persorption after corntortillas.
But I stick to common white rice as safe starch source and potato.
Corn is prone to all kinds of fungi.
 

GeoX

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I guess there is no sure and effective way to remove mycotoxins, fungi from masa harini (powder), if there are any.

I par-boil my white organic rice for 5 minutes, then drain and then add water and continue cooking for quite a while. (Actually I do the same with peeled baby organic red potatoes. They're the least starchy ones.)
 

Jessie

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I think how you feel is the most important with some consideration of the source of food.

We typically get as much organic as possible, especially fruits and meats, but that can become it's own stressor if taken too seriously.
Yeah. I mean, it's not like I forgo food quality or anything. It's just that since I've gotten into Peat's ideas I've changed how I approach food quality. I look for different things. Dairy for example, most organic dairy products are still very low quality in my opinion. They're full of gums and/or carrageenins. I rather have a conventional product that has no gums in it then a organic product with gums.

I rather buy conventional sauces or vegetables in glass jars than organic sauces and vegetable in cans full of endocrine disruptors. Grassfed meats are important to me, but if there is a sell on the grainfed stuff that I can take advantage of, then I'll buy that instead and save a few bucks. I rather have the tasteless refined expeller pressed coconut oil than the virgin organic stuff that has a nutty flavor to it.
 

Mauritio

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I had a little exchange with Ray on the topic of nixtamalized corn!


Q: I have tried corn tortillas from nixtamalized corn yesterday. For the first time. I ate like 5 or 6 of them and suffered with horrible stomach cramps after . Today I had a couple of bowel movements and feel surprisingly fine.
Now I'm not sure if I should continue eating them or not .
Maybe it was detox reaction ,maybe it doesnt agree with my body...
Do you have any insights on that or what I could do ?

A:It was probably just that your stomach didn’t expect it; they are more nutritious than things like bread and pasta."


Q: I've read from several people that theres supposedly all kind of mycotoxins a couple hours after the preparation of the nixtamalized corn tortillas .
Do you think that is concerning?

A: Only if you have moldy corn, and the alkali cooking removes much of that, which is drained off. Wheat flour is often contaminated with mycotoxins, so it would probably be good to nixtamalize wheat.

Toxins (Basel). 2019 Apr; 11(4): 227.
Mycotoxins during the Processes of Nixtamalization and Tortilla Production
Sara Schaarschmidt* and Carsten Fauhl-Hassek
Tortillas are a traditional staple food in Mesoamerican cuisine, which have also become popular on a global level, e.g., for wraps or as snacks (tortilla chips). Traditional tortilla production includes alkaline cooking (nixtamalization) of maize kernels. This article summarizes the current knowledge on mycotoxin changes during the nixtamalization of maize and tortilla production. Upon nixtamalization, mycotoxins can be affected in different ways. On the one hand, the toxins can be physically removed during steeping and washing. On the other hand, mycotoxins might be degraded, modified, or released/bound in the matrix by high pH and/or high temperature. This also applies to the subsequent baking of tortillas. Many studies have shown reduced mycotoxin levels in alkali-cooked maize and in tortillas. Most of the available data relate to aflatoxins and fumonisins. The reduction (and detoxification) of aflatoxins during nixtamalization might, however, be partially reversed in acidic conditions. The loss of fumonisin concentrations is to some extent accompanied by hydrolyzation and by lower toxicity. However, some studies have indicated the potential formation of toxicologically relevant modified forms and matrix-associated fumonisins. More data are required to assess the influence of alkaline cooking regarding such modified forms, as well as mycotoxins other than aflatoxins/fumonisins.
 

JanW55

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There's something to that @Mauritio -- nixtamalized corn masa certainly grabs one's innards significantly in a meaningful way! Meaning more satisfying, better sustaining nutrition, very good reception by the nervous system, it feels like! I recommend Xochitls as a corn chip (sea salt version versus unsalted is preferred in this household) and for corn tortillas, Milagro is best, that we've found. Take a pack of MIlagros, divide into 10 or 12 apiece in stacks, freeze the overage and eat the rest in the same week, since they do go moldy after a bit even under refrigeration. Breakfast can be ONE heated in microwave on high 28 seconds, then go salty/spicy with some TJ yuzu sauce (just a bit) or sweet, with a dab of maple syrup. Accept no substitutions!! Read all tortilla labels, the additives used are just horrendous in most kinds seen in 'regular' grocery stores. Milagro supplies the stores on the 'edge of town' around here where even there, one sees a lot of BigAmerAg represented anymore, just deplorable! On the mold topic: I advise: Always smell everything one is about to put in one's mouth (or even apply topically) to at least ATTEMPT to detect any off-odors / moldy qualities, because mold definitely lurks in opportunistic areas (where it can grow well I mean).
 

schultz

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Tortillas are easy to make from masa harina. Hominy grits is good too as a porridge. I grew some corn last year that I haven't got around to nixtamalizing (that a word? lol) Maybe I'll try that soon. I purchased 6 different kinds of corn seeds for planting this year! Hoping to get a huge haul. Lots of unique varieties. I've also been wanting to try nixtamalizing some wheat berries and see if I can manage to make bread from that.

Anyhoo, sort of a random thoughts post here. But I am wondering if anybody is growing corn this year? Also, has anybody here tried nixtamalizing wheat berries? Ray mentioned a lady from Italy was emailing him back and forth and she was experimenting with making bread like this and the proportions of lime and stuff. It would be helpful if someone has already figured out a good way to make bread like this. If not, then I guess I will figure it out myself.
 

Mauritio

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There's something to that @Mauritio -- nixtamalized corn masa certainly grabs one's innards significantly in a meaningful way! Meaning more satisfying, better sustaining nutrition, very good reception by the nervous system, it feels like! I recommend Xochitls as a corn chip (sea salt version versus unsalted is preferred in this household) and for corn tortillas, Milagro is best, that we've found. Take a pack of MIlagros, divide into 10 or 12 apiece in stacks, freeze the overage and eat the rest in the same week, since they do go moldy after a bit even under refrigeration. Breakfast can be ONE heated in microwave on high 28 seconds, then go salty/spicy with some TJ yuzu sauce (just a bit) or sweet, with a dab of maple syrup. Accept no substitutions!! Read all tortilla labels, the additives used are just horrendous in most kinds seen in 'regular' grocery stores. Milagro supplies the stores on the 'edge of town' around here where even there, one sees a lot of BigAmerAg represented anymore, just deplorable! On the mold topic: I advise: Always smell everything one is about to put in one's mouth (or even apply topically) to at least ATTEMPT to detect any off-odors / moldy qualities, because mold definitely lurks in opportunistic areas (where it can grow well I mean).
Thanks for the recommendation. I will try to see if I can get those brands in Europe.

I'm not 100% sure If it was the corn i also started a new brand of OJ that day,which is supposedly less acidic ,so I didnt think it could irritate the stomach but I'll try both again.
 

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