How China Beats The West At Capitalism

[meatbag]

 

[michael94]

Yes. China runs an industrial Capitalist System... ( Protectionist, State Driven Credit to Industry). Other examples:

Japan up until the 1980s ( they received a huge boost after WW2 having access to Western Technology despite being militarily defeated, go figure ).
America prior to 1912 election and Federal Reserve the following year ( Especially with Lincoln Greenbacks )
Kaiser's Germany
Any Fascist Country ever
NSDAP Germany
England in 1914 ( Bradbury Pounds )
Most war time economies.

America is under the spell of Usury. We have been duped into thinking that Private Banks have to finance projects, and that you need a debt based currency.

Chinese industries getting credit from the Bank of China is mostly non-usurious, because for the same reasons those industries received credit they can also be forgiven of their debts. So the power relation is different, if you owe $1000 to your Father it's different than owing $1000 to JP Morgan. And any interest payments are fluxing back towards the State, rather than for private gain.

 

[Davsey85]

Good that they beat the Us at Capitalism

We don't need capitalism

 

[tankasnowgod]

Good that they beat the Us at Capitalism

We don't need capitalism

How would you know? Unless you are over 108 years old, you've never experienced Capitalism in the United States in your life.

 

[michael94]

Good that they beat the Us at Capitalism

We don't need capitalism

Things are worse than we have been told. We operate as slaves under a Financial Oligarchy who are wrapped around the productive sector of the economy like an anaconda.

This video has some of silliness in it ( for the movie effect ), but it explains pretty well how Banks do not just store your deposits and lend them out, but rather create new deposits. This is like creating currency because these deposits are used for everyday payments. Essentially the power that Private Banks have is similar to a branch of government, and stronger in many ways.



This page explains things much more clearly, however it's not in movie form.

Split-Circuit Reserve Banking — sovereign money

 

[Davsey85]

How would you know? Unless you are over 108 years old, you've never experienced Capitalism in the United States in your life.

True I dont know what was like back then but it wasn't good for the slaves.

 

[jzeno]

@tankasnowgod RP being fairly extreme and having some unreasonable positions (removing starch, is one example) I've noticed there tends to be a bunch of equally unreasonable individuals who are drawn to RP. Hence you get people who probably live better than 90% of the world but complain about it. 9 times out of ten, they're also liberal.

Imagine that

 

[tankasnowgod]

@tankasnowgod RP being fairly extreme and having some unreasonable positions (removing starch, is one example) I've noticed there tends to be a bunch of equally unreasonable individuals who are drawn to RP. Hence you get people who probably live better than 90% of the world but complain about it. 9 times out of ten, they're also liberal.

I don't see it that way. Sure, many in the United States the past 40 years have had better lives than those in other countries, but I think we knew something deep was rotten. I certainly did. I have first hand seen the negative effects on inflation and vanishing jobs, and when I was making leaps in my professional career, was really disappointed that the faster I grew, the more I seemed to be stuck in the same place (like "The Red Queen" from Alice and Wonderland). One year, I practically doubled my income, but thanks to things like Rent Control, couldn't seem to move to a somewhat nicer place without paying nearly double what I was paying. It was seriously depressing.

Government and big corporations seemed to grow more powerful, individuals and small businesses seemed to get squeezed or ignored. And now, we've all had a nasty wake up call, as all levels of government (in the US, and seemingly worldwide) have decided to destroy millions of lives and businesses (even big corporations) with a reaction to an obviously fake "pandemic."

This is one of the reasons I was a fan of Trump. I'm sure you might have seen this six minute video from his campaign (that has been referenced many times since), and in the very first sentence of the video, he outright calls the current system "failed and corrupt."

 

[Davsey85]

I think theres lot of great things that the Us has done by both those who are wealthy,socialist movement of Dr King,women's rights.As humans we tend to judge things on what matters to us.My beef with Trump and most Us politicians is that they don't care that many will get ill because of the 5g rollout.Perhaps they truly dont believe its harmful.Profit over people.I like bernie Sanders but as most politicians he probably isn't going to want to stop 5g

 

[jzeno]

That wasn't the point of my comment. I was addressing you but referring to the comments that other people were making in this thread and you see elsewhere where liberals congregate.

 

[S.Seneff]

"The Chinese believe in constant change, but with things always moving back to some prior state. They pay attention to wide range of events; they search for relationships between things; and they think you can’t understand the part without understanding the whole. Westerners live in a simpler, more deterministic world; they focus on salient objects or people instead of the larger picture; and they think they can control events because they know the rules that govern the behavior of objects.”
Richard E. Nisbett Quotes (Author of The Geography of Thought)

 

[Aad]

Yes. China runs an industrial Capitalist System... ( Protectionist, State Driven Credit to Industry). Other examples:

Japan up until the 1980s ( they received a huge boost after WW2 having access to Western Technology despite being militarily defeated, go figure ).
America prior to 1912 election and Federal Reserve the following year ( Especially with Lincoln Greenbacks )
Kaiser's Germany
Any Fascist Country ever
NSDAP Germany
England in 1914 ( Bradbury Pounds )
Most war time economies.

America is under the spell of Usury. We have been duped into thinking that Private Banks have to finance projects, and that you need a debt based currency.

Chinese industries getting credit from the Bank of China is mostly non-usurious, because for the same reasons those industries received credit they can also be forgiven of their debts. So the power relation is different, if you owe $1000 to your Father it's different than owing $1000 to JP Morgan. And any interest payments are fluxing back towards the State, rather than for private gain.

Japan made better Submarines and Aircraft carriers than the United States even more than 80 years ago. Don't act as if the Japanese needed to start from scratch.

 

[michael94]

Japan made better Submarines and Aircraft carriers than the United States even more than 80 years ago. Don't act as if the Japanese needed to start from scratch.

I didnt know that

 

[ToLive_IsToFly]

I love how he compares an idealized version of socialism that ignores the requisite repression vs a cartoon villain capitalism that ignores all the benefits and freedoms. There were so many lies coming out of his mouth it was laughable. Did he forget the genocide of the Soviet landed peasantry once power was consolidated and all land was collectivized?

China is not beating anyone at Capitalism. They benefited from cheap labor, Western know how, zero R&D costs, and one sided trade rules.

The Soviet Union also had a period of incredible modernization and productivity gains due to the influx of Western capital and technology. Everyone during that time also marveled at how the Soviet Union was going to beat the capitalist west.

The problem is that eventually you have to stand on your own and develop your own technologies and innovations. A people subjected to a repressive police state can never out compete a relatively free people able to express their ideas and follow their ambitions.

If China doesnt ditch the CCP and embrace a more open society they will soon follow the way of the Soviets before them.

Im of course ignoring our own movements towards a Police State, but the same warnings apply to us as well.

 

[ToLive_IsToFly]

Here is a far better informed view of life in Communist China during the bubble. The good times are amazingly impressive until they are not.

Why I Changed my Opinion on China




Why I Changed my Opinion on China
Hey Laowinners! I've lived in China for over 10 years, and over that time, my opinion of the Chinese government ...

 

[michael94]

I love how he compares an idealized version of socialism that ignores the requisite repression vs a cartoon villain capitalism that ignores all the benefits and freedoms. There were so many lies coming out of his mouth it was laughable. Did he forget the genocide of the Soviet landed peasantry once power was consolidated and all land was collectivized?

China is not beating anyone at Capitalism. They benefited from cheap labor, Western know how, zero R&D costs, and one sided trade rules.

The Soviet Union also had a period of incredible modernization and productivity gains due to the influx of Western capital and technology. Everyone during that time also marveled at how the Soviet Union was going to beat the capitalist west.

The author is not saying that China's communist origins ( nor Russia's ) are desirable or equivalent to how modern day China operates. I think he is just discussing economic success in China's Industrial Capitalist system.

China has benefited from cheap labor, as well as Western Finance seeking to make gains on wage arbitrage. That is a separate issue and more of an attack on the Banking/Finance sector of the Anglosphere than it is a criticism of China.

The problem is that eventually you have to stand on your own and develop your own technologies and innovations. A people subjected to a repressive police state can never out compete a relatively free people able to express their ideas and follow their ambitions.

If China doesnt ditch the CCP and embrace a more open society they will soon follow the way of the Soviets before them.

Im of course ignoring our own movements towards a Police State, but the same warnings apply to us as well.

I mean is America really open? The Banking sector has been in charge of America's Money Supply since 1913. And England to varying degrees since the founding of the Bank of England in 1694. There is nothing open or sovereign about it. In fact modern politics does everything possible to hide this fact and make it a non-issue, when a nation controlling it's own money supply is no less significant than a monopoly on force, seeing as how money is traded for Blood, Sweat and Tears. Things are so bad at present, that 97% of our money today originates from Banks making loans and buying assets. Only 3% is Central Bank Cash or Treasury coins. Tell me how free can a people really be under such a system. And due to the role that Private Banks play in money creation, a disproportionate increase in credit flows towards Financial Speculation and Rent taking ( real estate investment ), as compared to actual productive work. This is an enormous problem.

 

[michael94]

anyways the Free Capitalism of the West has done nothing to stop the endless stream of interest payments on Capital that allow Parasites to pull the strings of the economy while doing nothing. Banks do nothing besides create debt, and yet they are so powerful! Why? Becuase we are under the spell of Mammon and believed the lie that Money creates more Money when in truth Money should just be a method of exchange for Productive Work/Resources. All the values of a Society are inverted when you believe the lies of International Capital about what Money is. Generations are raised thinking that the most important and secure positions of society do not involve any Creative, Physical or Intellectual work but in Investment, working on Wall Street, owning property. How sick!

 

[ToLive_IsToFly]

The author is not saying that China's communist origins ( nor Russia's ) are desirable or equivalent to how modern day China operates. I think he is just discussing economic success in China's Industrial Capitalist system.

The “professor," a Marxist economist spends the first half of the video speaking about the joys of socialism and the evils of the markets. The rest of it is just a typical Marxist rewriting of history. Useful idiot imo

 

[ToLive_IsToFly]

anyways the Free Capitalism of the West has done nothing to stop the endless stream of interest payments on Capital that allow Parasites to pull the strings of the economy while doing nothing. Banks do nothing besides create debt, and yet they are so powerful! Why? Becuase we are under the spell of Mammon and believed the lie that Money creates more Money when in truth Money should just be a method of exchange for Productive Work/Resources. All the values of a Society are inverted when you believe the lies of International Capital about what Money is. Generations are raised thinking that the most important and secure positions of society do not involve any Creative, Physical or Intellectual work but in Investment, working on Wall Street, owning property. How sick!

Fractional reserve banking is just one of the many levers of control over society. Bankers dont control the world; they are just high paid courtiers and do what they are told. They are no different than top officials in the military, intelligence agencies, politicians, media, religious groups etc.

Even if they nationalized the banks tomorrow, we still wouldn’t be any freer. The fleecing of the people would just be done in some other way. They need to keep the peasants so busy with the struggles of life that they can’t actually figure out what is going on. Remember it’s all about control, not money.

With all that said, people living in capitalist democracies are still far freer than any other people alive now or in the past. Just ask any immigrant to the US about why they moved here.

 

[michael94]

Fractional reserve banking is just one of the many levers of control over society. Bankers dont control the world; they are just high paid courtiers and do what they are told. They are no different than top officials in the military, intelligence agencies, politicians, media, religious groups etc.

Even if they nationalized the banks tomorrow, we still wouldn’t be any freer. The fleecing of the people would just be done in some other way. They need to keep the peasants so busy with the struggles of life that they can’t actually figure out what is going on. Remember it’s all about control, not money.

I am confused by your position of control vs money. as if they are separate issues, rather than extremely interdependent. The money problem is incredibly important... it is what gives venom to the system of control. Maybe you are blackpilled

Those in power have attempted to make the money problem extremely obscure, and impenetrable. However due to years of diligence it has been revealed ( admitted ) by the Banking System that it is Private Banks which control the expansion and flow of money supply ( see link below ). This is not minor problem it is a foundational problem. And while nationalizing the money supply could lead to a problem of Government misuse, the difference is people would actually be aware of what is going on. The track record of Sovereign Government money is much better than Government-sanctioned Private Money ( current system ).. As far back as 1844 the UK ( Bank Charter Act ) had to stop Private Banks from issuing Bank notes because they were causing crises and manipulation of the asset prices.

Monetary System Analysis — sovereign money

The problem is Private Control of the Money Supply ( Government Sanctioned ) and Usury... The issuance of loans to make money from money, rather than loaning for the needs of the productive economy ( with the ability to forgive loans under proper circumstances ). If Money was representative of Creative, Intellectual and Physical work, there would be a complete transmutation of Ideals in Society.