Finally Cured From Post Finasteride Syndrome

[multiplier]

No he didn't give any additional info on whatsapp.

Lol, maybe your google is broken, it's easy to find azelaic acid is an anti-androgen. Anti-androgen therapy. Hormonal treatment for acne and hirsutism | DermNet NZ

"5-alpha reductase inhibitors include zinc, finasteride, azelaic acid, saw palmetto"

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onlinelibrary.wiley.com

"Azelaic acid was also a potent inhibitor of 5α-reductase"

Anyway, new update from our friend on youtube:



Seems his recovery is really going well, says his libido is back thanks to HCG. Erectile dysfunction is basically cured, all sexual issues are fixed. He's also building muscle more easily. Has more confidence and drive in life.

And he's off HCG for a couple of months now. So his improvements are holding on. Basically cured imo.

 

[multiplier]

Ahh thanks... I had just googled azelaic acid +5ar, not "5-alpha reductase inhibitors"

 

[multiplier]

"Anyway, new update from our friend on youtube:"

Our friend meaning the OP? Sorry, now we're talking about two different YouTube guys. I'm getting lost in this 118-page thread

 

[Korven]

Another one who is almost completely recovered;



Check comments.

So it seems TRT, HCG and proviron/androsterone cycles is what improved him.

He's also in the big whatsapp group and holy fck, I've seen his new profile picture and it's almost a different person in the face. His face looks more full and healthy than in this old video of him.

Wait... people get PFS symptoms from using topical azelaic acid?

I mean I guess anything is possible, but it just sounds a bit far-fetched to me. If you apply say 1 g to your skin (Finacea 20% cream) that's 200 mg azelaic acid. The systemic absorption is estimated at 4%, so that would be 0,04 x 200 = total 8 mg azelaic acid in systemic circulation. Azelaic acid is also found naturally in foods like wheat and barley.

Are there any other reports of people getting PFS like symptoms from azelaic acid? I've been using it on and off for 2 years for skin issues and this has got me a little worried that it's maybe messing up my 5-AR system. Fatigue has definitely been an issue for me.

 

[FinVictim]

1 year update

I'll give a 1 year hCG update to temper the expectations a little bit and to help everyone who's in a less fortunate position regarding health care etc. I consider myself one of the purest PFS patients you can find (see below). I've been on prescription hCG 200-400 IU every 2-3 days for over a year now, switched around a little bit with dosing and had one 3 week break in summer.

Unfortunately my experiences are still the same as I described them in my "6 month update" post on page 105 of this thread. No real positive effects to libido/flat emotions etc. The only positives are slightly more energy and less dry hair/looser stools. These positive effects are the reason I'm still using hCG.

Bupropion 300mg once a day didn't do anything for me besides the side effects: anorexia and worse sleep.

In the meantime I had two consultations with a professor in neuropsychiatry I had high hopes of.. At first she offered to try pramipexole but then she withdrew her offer again.

Currently I'm getting my body ready for a year of strenuous resistance training after getting inspiration from Sibelio's thread on PH about resistance training. I'm hoping to fire up the intracellular positive feedback loop where DHT causes upregulation of 5AR.

I will keep you guys updated. Stay strong.

Recap of my story:
30 years old. Apart from insecurity about my hair I was the happiest guy in the world, very ambitious, high libido, athletic physique (still the case). Privileged happy youth without any trauma whatsoever. University level education and job.
Took 1mg finasteride for 20 days in March 2020. Noticed erectile dysfunction and total loss of libido, immediately quit but these sides never passed. Anhedonia and flat emotions seem to have creeped in during the year 2020. Fortunately not feeling depressed, no serious brain fog or cognitive impairment. Testosteron level 12 nmol/L (median in society for my age 22nmol/L).
Tried hCG 200IU eod for 6 months (Jan '21 - June '21), increased my testosteron to 35nmol/L, skyrocketed estradiol to way above normal, noticed an increase in energy in the purest sense of the word (no effect on all the symptoms, except energy levels) and stools turned a little softer again, hair less dry. After quitting had severe drop in energy levels, felt miserable. Tried bupropion 300mg every day without any noticeable benefits for 3 months (July - Sept '21).
Restarted hCG 200IU every 3 days in July '20 to raise energy levels again (through higher testosteron).

 

[Mister]

1 year update

I'll give a 1 year hCG update to temper the expectations a little bit and to help everyone who's in a less fortunate position regarding health care etc. I consider myself one of the purest PFS patients you can find (see below). I've been on prescription hCG 200-400 IU every 2-3 days for over a year now, switched around a little bit with dosing and had one 3 week break in summer.

Unfortunately my experiences are still the same as I described them in my "6 month update" post on page 105 of this thread. No real positive effects to libido/flat emotions etc. The only positives are slightly more energy and less dry hair/looser stools. These positive effects are the reason I'm still using hCG.

Bupropion 300mg once a day didn't do anything for me besides the side effects: anorexia and worse sleep.

In the meantime I had two consultations with a professor in neuropsychiatry I had high hopes of.. At first she offered to try pramipexole but then she withdrew her offer again.

Currently I'm getting my body ready for a year of strenuous resistance training after getting inspiration from Sibelio's thread on PH about resistance training. I'm hoping to fire up the intracellular positive feedback loop where DHT causes upregulation of 5AR.

I will keep you guys updated. Stay strong.

Recap of my story:
30 years old. Apart from insecurity about my hair I was the happiest guy in the world, very ambitious, high libido, athletic physique (still the case). Privileged happy youth without any trauma whatsoever. University level education and job.
Took 1mg finasteride for 20 days in March 2020. Noticed erectile dysfunction and total loss of libido, immediately quit but these sides never passed. Anhedonia and flat emotions seem to have creeped in during the year 2020. Fortunately not feeling depressed, no serious brain fog or cognitive impairment. Testosteron level 12 nmol/L (median in society for my age 22nmol/L).
Tried hCG 200IU eod for 6 months (Jan '21 - June '21), increased my testosteron to 35nmol/L, skyrocketed estradiol to way above normal, noticed an increase in energy in the purest sense of the word (no effect on all the symptoms, except energy levels) and stools turned a little softer again, hair less dry. After quitting had severe drop in energy levels, felt miserable. Tried bupropion 300mg every day without any noticeable benefits for 3 months (July - Sept '21).
Restarted hCG 200IU every 3 days in July '20 to raise energy levels again (through higher testosteron).

If I was you I would quit HCG and do a proviron cycle now. No need to be longer on HCG than 6 months imo.

 

[Mister]

Wait... people get PFS symptoms from using topical azelaic acid?

I mean I guess anything is possible, but it just sounds a bit far-fetched to me. If you apply say 1 g to your skin (Finacea 20% cream) that's 200 mg azelaic acid. The systemic absorption is estimated at 4%, so that would be 0,04 x 200 = total 8 mg azelaic acid in systemic circulation. Azelaic acid is also found naturally in foods like wheat and barley.

Are there any other reports of people getting PFS like symptoms from azelaic acid? I've been using it on and off for 2 years for skin issues and this has got me a little worried that it's maybe messing up my 5-AR system. Fatigue has definitely been an issue for me.

Hmm fatigue can come from many things. Do you have any libido problems or other issues downstairs? Or brainfog?

If not I wouldn't be worrying too much but some people are very sensitive to 5ar inhibitors. I even read stories about zinc triggering these problems...

Can't even find any post azealic acid cases on propeciahelp... Safe to say it's rare to get sides from this.

Did find this interesting anecdote of a guy who recovered form PFS and used azelaic acid:

Watch out for *anything* that might be effecting your hormone levels

Topical treatments definately have systemic effects, the proof was the last time i had my blood drawn,the same morning i washed my head with revivogen shampoo only(have not used the lotion). My Dht on the results i got back was 53 pg/Ml (94-476 ref range) testosterone on the other hand was...

forum.propeciahelp.com

I’m currently using xandrox, which contains azelaic acid and I can honestly say I have no side effects. Not only that but I use paul mitchell’s tea tree shampoo that rockin said ****88 him up. I’ve only begun using it after I recovered, but so far nothing has happened to me cause of it. I guess it might be a genetic sort of thing that some people are just more sensitive to some stuff than others…

Also depends how much azelaic acid you're using of course... Could be that the guy from youtube used a very high dose.

 

[Korven]

Hmm fatigue can come from many things. Do you have any libido problems or other issues downstairs? Or brainfog?

If not I wouldn't be worrying too much but some people are very sensitive to 5ar inhibitors. I even read stories about zinc triggering these problems...

Can't even find any post azealic acid cases on propeciahelp... Safe to say it's rare to get sides from this.

Did find this interesting anecdote of a guy who recovered form PFS and used azelaic acid:

Watch out for *anything* that might be effecting your hormone levels

Topical treatments definately have systemic effects, the proof was the last time i had my blood drawn,the same morning i washed my head with revivogen shampoo only(have not used the lotion). My Dht on the results i got back was 53 pg/Ml (94-476 ref range) testosterone on the other hand was...

forum.propeciahelp.com

I’m currently using xandrox, which contains azelaic acid and I can honestly say I have no side effects. Not only that but I use paul mitchell’s tea tree shampoo that rockin said ****88 him up. I’ve only begun using it after I recovered, but so far nothing has happened to me cause of it. I guess it might be a genetic sort of thing that some people are just more sensitive to some stuff than others…

Also depends how much azelaic acid you're using of course... Could be that the guy from youtube used a very high dose.

Libido is always good (thankfully) and no brain fog, my brain was very foggy before but I attribute that more to weak digestion and gut problems.

I have made good progress when it comes to the crippling fatigue, exercise intolerance and overall malaise - mind you I had all these symptoms before even touching azelaic acid so presumably not related - but my mood is not how it was before; I tend to feel like a low dopamine lab rat.

However I have had issues with DRY EYES coinciding with me starting to use azelaic acid on my skin.

Apparently there's a strong connection between androgen deprivation/deficiency/finasteride and dry eyes: Effect of Androgen Deficiency on the Human Meibomian Gland and Ocular Surface1

Hypothesis: the azelaic acid is locally shutting down my 5-AR enzymes in lacrimal gland and meibomian gland and ruining tear quality?

I will avoid it for a couple of weeks and see if there is any improvement with mood and dry eyes.

Thanks for bringing this to my attention!

 

[Korven]

Treatment of Dry Eye with a Transdermal 3% Testosterone Cream | IOVS | ARVO Journals

iovs.arvojournals.org

I might try a little testosterone cream topically on eyelids

 

[FinVictim]

If I was you I would quit HCG and do a proviron cycle now. No need to be longer on HCG than 6 months imo.

Thanks. I hadn't mentioned but I actually quit hCG for the last 2 weeks but restarted after noticing serious fatigue creeping in again. Restarted hCG 3 days ago and energy levels are up again, feeling less lethargic. Complete loss of libido/emotions and anhedonia remain though.

Regarding the hCG: It's definitely something I would recommend trying. Apparently it definitely works or improves symptoms for some.

Regarding "FitandNerdy's" experience: It seems like he is doing heavy weightlifting. His improvement of symptoms might also be due to the resistance training. For everyone who is able to exercise I can definitely recommend heavy resistance training until failure. Especially compound exercises. It seems to be a part of many (partial) recovery stories and it's worth a try for a few months.

 

[FinVictim]

I must have been sleeping yesterday. Sorry guys. In addition to what I wrote earlier I actually did a 6 week proviron 200mg a day cycle from early Nov 2021 until mid Dec 2021 (while still being on hCG). It didn't do anything for me. I'm still hoping I'll notice the (delayed) improvements like "Rebelwithacause" and like "Pal" reported on PH.

 

[Mister]

I must have been sleeping yesterday. Sorry guys. In addition to what I wrote earlier I actually did a 6 week proviron 200mg a day cycle from early Nov 2021 until mid Dec 2021 (while still being on hCG). It didn't do anything for me. I'm still hoping I'll notice the (delayed) improvements like "Rebelwithacause" and like "Pal" reported on PH.

Most of the guys who had improvements didn't combine HCG and proviron in the same cycle. They did HCG and quit, after that they did a proviron cycle.

If I was you I'd definitely try it again. (And btw, be sure to check you have real proviron if you buy from grey market, there's a lot of fake stuff circulating)

 

[FinVictim]

Most of the guys who had improvements didn't combine HCG and proviron in the same cycle. They did HCG and quit, after that they did a proviron cycle.

If I was you I'd definitely try it again. (And btw, be sure to check you have real proviron if you buy from grey market, there's a lot of fake stuff circulating)

My proviron was from a well known brand, but how would you check?

 

[Mister]

My proviron was from a well known brand, but how would you check?

Hard to say, you need to be sure about your source. Ordering from some random site without doing your due diligence is a bad strategy. Check forums, etc to find a good source.

 

[Mister]

Btw a new recovery (90%) from someone on the whasapp group. Did a cycle of 250 iu ed for 6 months and got better but after quitting for a couple of months the sides came back and he's on HCG now doing 500 iu eod. Don't know if he's still on HCG though. Also takes bupropion (anti depression med but don't recommend this)

 

[FinVictim]

Hard to say, you need to be sure about your source. Ordering from some random site without doing your due diligence is a bad strategy. Check forums, etc to find a good source.

Yeah that's exactly what I've done. 99% sure it's legit.

 

[Mister]

Btw a new recovery (90%) from someone on the whasapp group. Did a cycle of 250 iu ed for 6 months and got better but after quitting for a couple of months the sides came back and he's on HCG now doing 500 iu eod. Don't know if he's still on HCG though. Also takes bupropion (anti depression med but don't recommend this)

Update: He's still on HCG

@FinVictim I see. Anyway I've read multiple recovery stories about people needing mutliple cycles to feel better so another proviron cycle could help.

 

[CloudsInTheHead]

Do we know if anyone who's had good results with HCG had high LH before? It's hard to believe it can help me, but maybe...

 

[Mister]

Do we know if anyone who's had good results with HCG had high LH before? It's hard to believe it can help me, but maybe...

HCG also improves neurosteroids, precursor hormones, etc. I believe it's definitely worth a try even with high test, lh levels.

The Mysteries Of HCG & It's Many Uses - The Men’s Health Clinic

“You don’t need hCG unless you’re trying to conceive” bellows the endocrinologist. “There is no evidence to suggest a man should ever use a female...

themenshealthclinic.co.uk

 

[Snarf]

Yeah masteron is a great option imo, even higher bioavailability than proviron.

But you need to do it for atleast 6 weeks imo, same with proviron. If mono proviron/masteron doesn't work do another cyle but also add test.

Another regimen is HCG cycle followed by proviron/masteron cycle.

Hi Mister, I’ve seen you recommend people take HCG and various steroids multiple times in this thread, Im presuming that you have tried them all yourself and that they cured your pfs?