Trouble going off vitamin C

[InChristAlone]

I think everyone that knows me on this forum probably knows I'm a huge fan of ascorbic acid. When I found out about it's benefits I was going through panic attacks and seriously didn't think I"d ever live a normal life again. That was 4 yrs ago. I've been using 2-4 grams a day ever since. I've tried stopping a few times and always had a return of anxiety.

I decided I was really going to give it a shot a couple weeks ago in preparation for a blood test to see if anything changes from last year while I'm off it as I do have LDL cholesterol creeping up higher every yr. The ascorbic acid seemed to keep my thyroid higher and I haven't used any hormones in yrs. But I've been having the adrenaline spikes and just generally feeling like my hormones hit the fan since going off it.

Tonight after a hot dog I had a huge burst of adrenaline for 15 minutes. That has been a trigger for me in the past. I think due to histamine especially if combined with tomato. And especially if I'm estrogen dominant. I thought my histamine levels were actually kinda low, so I thought I could tolerate not being on the vitamin C but it doesn't seem like it! It feels like I used to feel like 4 yrs ago.

My issue with Peating has always been that I struggle to eat enough and if I limit myself to no starch or no processed foods I always lose weight, but when I just eat what I like I maintain a very good weight. I had to be on cypro due to this issue in the past. My pulse and temp today was 73 and 98.6. My pulse usually was 85, but I'm going through some intense parenting struggles so I know that isn't helping my thyroid. Unfortunately when I'm going through stress I can't tolerate any metabolic stimulants. I did take 100 mg thiamine today and it seemed like I was going through food very rapidly but because I'm not used to eating a lot I just ate normally. Huge mistake! And then another mistake to eat a high histamine dinner! I really give kudos to those who successfully manage their diet and eat the right amount of food for their metabolism. As a parent it's probably the hardest thing to prioritize, but absolutely necessary.

 

[yerrag]

The ascorbic acid seemed to keep my thyroid higher

maybe because it helps keep blood sugar stable because it is very similar to glucose. I felt this way when taking vit c on empty

the liver has to depend on uninterrupted energy to continually produce t3 from t4

Tonight after a hot dog I had a huge burst of adrenaline for 15 minutes.

no carbs with it? that will happen to me as well

And especially if I'm estrogen dominant. I thought my histamine levels were actually kinda low, so I thought I could tolerate not being on the vitamin C but it doesn't seem like it! It feels like I used to feel like 4 yrs ago

maybe were different, but maybe not. i find my allergy totally gone with good blood sugar control and with good acid base balance. when im acidic , cracks come out from the wood work.

like right now with me struggling with acidity my throat is always itchy and wanting to cough with every breath.

but i could be different also as i pay little attention to histamine. like in rays recent newsletter he says its all metabolic though he's said it before. histamine is not the main driver but a slave to a higher level metabolic dysfunction

 

[yerrag]

Ill also add that for 3 months of this persistent cough I was getting frustrated that increasing my vit C intake was getting nowhere.

I had no idea of my acid state and when i knew that and fixed it my persistent cough immediately stopped.

the lesson I got was you cant vitamin C yourself to health when acid base balance is really terrible.

But who knows how to test for acid base balance? Yet it's everywhere -take vitamin C for COVID. And?

Where does good acid base balance come from though?

Good metabolic health.

 

[Gustav3Y]

Ascorbic acid had some negative effects on the gut when I have tried it, maybe I should have tried more sources.
Recently I went on Sodium Ascrobate and it seems to be much better in that regard, it feel like it would not be the same thing.

I am curious have you tried?

 

[InChristAlone]

Ascorbic acid had some negative effects on the gut when I have tried it, maybe I should have tried more sources.
Recently I went on Sodium Ascrobate and it seems to be much better in that regard, it feel like it would not be the same thing.

I am curious have you tried?

Yes actually I do mix in some sodium bicarbonate because I'm sensitive to the sour taste especially my teeth.

 

[Jennifer]

My issue with Peating has always been that I struggle to eat enough and if I limit myself to no starch or no processed foods I always lose weight, but when I just eat what I like I maintain a very good weight. I had to be on cypro due to this issue in the past. My pulse and temp today was 73 and 98.6. My pulse usually was 85, but I'm going through some intense parenting struggles so I know that isn't helping my thyroid. Unfortunately when I'm going through stress I can't tolerate any metabolic stimulants. I did take 100 mg thiamine today and it seemed like I was going through food very rapidly but because I'm not used to eating a lot I just ate normally. Huge mistake! And then another mistake to eat a high histamine dinner! I really give kudos to those who successfully manage their diet and eat the right amount of food for their metabolism. As a parent it's probably the hardest thing to prioritize, but absolutely necessary.

Your diet doesn’t have to be starch-free or free of processed foods to be Peaty. You and I have had similar struggles with anxiety and keeping weight on, and I could not have kept the anxiety away and my weight up if I hadn’t included refined foods in my diet like cheese, ice cream, chocolate, juice instead of whole fruit etc. I’d argue that they can be very healthy, especially for those of us with sensitive intestines and/or those under a lot of stress due to illness, parenting etc. Letting go of the idea that whole foods = healthy and refined foods = unhealthy, and figuring out which foods don’t irritate my intestines and which proteins and how many carbs I need with them to prevent hypoglycemia, were some of the main things that helped with squashing my anxiety and keeping my weight up (by keeping catabolic hormones low) prior to starting on NDT.

In terms of whether or not starch is Peaty, I think much of the disagreement that happens around here on the subject is based on our own ability to digest it. I’ve done digestive test after digestive test and every time they’ve shown I don’t digest starch well so for someone like me, keeping starch as low as possible can be helpful, but others may digest it well so for them, starch can be a healthy part of their diet, IMHO. There’s also the potential issue of persorption, but I’m not sold on the theory for a number of reasons. Anyhow, I’m not sure if you were looking for any specific advice but if you ever want some food ideas, I’d be happy to list some. :)

 

[InChristAlone]

Your diet doesn’t have to be starch-free or free of processed foods to be Peaty. You and I have had similar struggles with anxiety and keeping weight on, and I could not have kept the anxiety away and my weight up if I hadn’t included refined foods in my diet like cheese, ice cream, chocolate, juice instead of whole fruit etc. I’d argue that they can be very healthy, especially for those of us with sensitive intestines and/or those under a lot of stress due to illness, parenting etc. Letting go of the idea that whole foods = healthy and refined foods = unhealthy, and figuring out which foods don’t irritate my intestines and which proteins and how many carbs I need with them to prevent hypoglycemia, were some of the main things that helped with squashing my anxiety and keeping my weight up (by keeping catabolic hormones low) prior to starting on NDT.

In terms of whether or not starch is Peaty, I think much of the disagreement that happens around here on the subject is based on our own ability to digest it. I’ve done digestive test after digestive test and every time they’ve shown I don’t digest starch well so for someone like me, keeping starch as low as possible can be helpful, but others may digest it well so for them, starch can be a healthy part of their diet, IMHO. There’s also the potential issue of persorption, but I’m not sold on the theory for a number of reasons. Anyhow, I’m not sure if you were looking for any specific advice but if you ever want some food ideas, I’d be happy to list some. :)

Thanks Jennifer :) I always admired your ability to come up with a good diet and then stick to it. When I'm stressed or not sleeping well I could eat garbage and not care other than when my health tanks because of it. So here was my day of eating yesterday:



I struggle with protein at lunch. We have been fairly good about making dinners for the boys so that hasn't been an issue, but lunch has always been. I just don't like cooking three meals a day. I think I need to go back to eating gouda cheese just wasn't sure if it was benefiting me, @Amazoniac kept talking about how cheese basically gets rid of most of the good things about milk so I think now I have a negative view on it. I don't tolerate milk at all other than in the ice cream. I always get anxiety from it, I tried raw milk maybe 5 months ago because now I have access to it in a store down the road from me and I just didn't like how I felt at all after a week or so.

I feel like lucky I don't really have any symptoms from any starch other than cooked and cooled potatoes and beans. Resistant starches seem to cause serotonin symptoms. Bread or pasta just makes me feel relaxed probably form the opiate like effects or higher blood sugar. I want to start making my own bread again, just need to get a lot of my daily stresses taken care of.

 

[Gustav3Y]

Resistant starches seem to cause serotonin symptoms.

Which are those resistant starches?

 

[InChristAlone]

Which are those resistant starches?

Cooked and cooled potatoes, canned beans mainly. But could just be the fibrous nature of those foods as cooked and cooled pasta is fine.

 

[Peatness]

By supplementing vitamin C you have shifted your requirement of the vitamin and you cannot stop abruptly. Perhaps try lowering the daily dosage slowly

 

[InChristAlone]

maybe because it helps keep blood sugar stable because it is very similar to glucose. I felt this way when taking vit c on empty

the liver has to depend on uninterrupted energy to continually produce t3 from t4


no carbs with it? that will happen to me as well


maybe were different, but maybe not. i find my allergy totally gone with good blood sugar control and with good acid base balance. when im acidic , cracks come out from the wood work.

like right now with me struggling with acidity my throat is always itchy and wanting to cough with every breath.

but i could be different also as i pay little attention to histamine. like in rays recent newsletter he says its all metabolic though he's said it before. histamine is not the main driver but a slave to a higher level metabolic dysfunction

Yes I had considered that it was acting a bit like glucose, plus it also boosts noradrenaline and it's possible I had excess adrenaline but not enough noradrenaline.
I had the hot dog bun with it and organic gatorade yes there is such a thing as organic gatorade! lol When I'm stressed I lose my appetite and even drinking liquid becomes a chore.

Ill also add that for 3 months of this persistent cough I was getting frustrated that increasing my vit C intake was getting nowhere.

I had no idea of my acid state and when i knew that and fixed it my persistent cough immediately stopped.

the lesson I got was you cant vitamin C yourself to health when acid base balance is really terrible.

But who knows how to test for acid base balance? Yet it's everywhere -take vitamin C for COVID. And?

Where does good acid base balance come from though?

Good metabolic health.

Yes it does seem you can't supplement vitamin C to health as being off it it appears now I have a dependency at least to some extent. Which honestly I'm okay with it as long as my mineral status is okay. And maybe I should get into checking pH again.

 

[Gustav3Y]

Cooked and cooled potatoes, canned beans mainly. But could just be the fibrous nature of those foods as cooked and cooled pasta is fine.

Interesting, I want to get this right, so then cooked and eaten fresh the potatoes are less resistant?

 

[InChristAlone]

By supplementing vitamin C you have shifted your requirement of the vitamin and you cannot stop abruptly. Perhaps try lowering the daily dosage slowly

I had reduced it down by 500 mg every couple days, seemed to go well until I was at 500 mg.

 

[InChristAlone]

Interesting, I want to get this right, so then cooked and eaten fresh the potatoes are less resistant?

Yes fresh cooked starch is always more available to be digested. Some becomes resistant to digestion once it cools down.

 

[Ben.]

Maybe i am thinking to simplistic here but i'd do it similar to smoking, coffeine or alcohol and reduce it slowly over time. Abrupt stopping can be to rough. Even if that means reducing it in 10 mg steps.

The question is, if the return of anxiety comes from the suppressing effect of vit c (like thiamin it "makes you work without fixing a underlying issue") or if it is just a "rehab/detox" thing.

 

[InChristAlone]

Maybe i am thinking to simplistic here but i'd do it similar to smoking, coffeine or alcohol and reduce it slowly over time. Abrupt stopping can be to rough. Even if that means reducing it in 10 mg steps.

The question is, if the return of anxiety comes from the suppressing effect of vit c (like thiamin it "makes you work without fixing a underlying issue") or if it is just a "rehab/detox" thing.

Yeah that's my concern, seems I have a dependency similar to what Dr Abram Hoffer saw with Schizo patients and vitamin B3.

 

[mostlylurking]

(like thiamin it "makes you work without fixing a underlying issue")

what does that mean???

 

[InChristAlone]

what does that mean???

I'm assuming he meant if someone felt much better taking thiamine the issues would come right back when off it even though the deficiency is corrected. I call it vitamin dependency.

 

[mostlylurking]

I'm assuming he meant if someone felt much better taking thiamine the issues would come right back when off it even though the deficiency is corrected. I call it vitamin dependency.

Well of course the symptoms come back. Thiamine is a water soluble vitamin; it disappears for the most part in a couple of hours. It gets used up if you consume sugar or consume starch/carbohydrate. It is something you have to have all the time, every day, in order to stay alive.

 

[InChristAlone]

Well of course the symptoms come back. Thiamine is a water soluble vitamin; it disappears for the most part in a couple of hours. It gets used up if you consume sugar or consume starch/carbohydrate. It is something you have to have all the time, every day, in order to stay alive.

Yeah I agree thaimine is essential, I guess what we are referring to is the mega doses like I was doing for ascorbic acid.