Testosterone Optimization On RP-inspired Nutrition

[GreekDemiGod]

Personally for me, I think it's not the training that kills me. It's the sleep and poor recovery. I usually go to bed at 12-1AM, sleep quality is decent, sometimes worse, sometimes better. I probably average less than 8hrs / night.
Because whenever I string a few nights of good and long sleep, I feel more desire & drive to workout. Even though, I still feel training as taxing on the metabolism.
Muscle gain requires a lot of recovery / rest and repair time.

@David90 I got into the habit of always having some intra-workout sugar / carbs with some BCAA's.

 

[Runenight201]

@David90 I got into the habit of always having some intra-workout sugar / carbs with some BCAA's.

What are the bcaas doing for you? I’m looking for something to help my soccer games

 

[GreekDemiGod]

What are the bcaas doing for you? I’m looking for something to help my soccer games

They are useful for muscle protein synthesis purposes...whenever you go a few hours without ingesting a protein source.

 

[OccamzRazer]

Even though, I still feel training as taxing on the metabolism.
Muscle gain requires a lot of recovery / rest and repair time.

Have you tried doing short workouts that don't quite reach this point? Where you leave the gym genuinely wanting to do more?

 

[David90]

Personally for me, I think it's not the training that kills me. It's the sleep and poor recovery. I usually go to bed at 12-1AM, sleep quality is decent, sometimes worse, sometimes better. I probably average less than 8hrs / night.
Because whenever I string a few nights of good and long sleep, I feel more desire & drive to workout. Even though, I still feel training as taxing on the metabolism.
Muscle gain requires a lot of recovery / rest and repair time.

@David90 I got into the habit of always having some intra-workout sugar / carbs with some BCAA's.

Sounds Good with the Sugar/Carbs and BCAA'S. Maybe that will help in the Long Run.

But i would advise to work on the Sleep Pattern. 12-1am is (in my Perspective) way too late. Rather try to go to bed at around 9:30-10pm. Also think about using Blue Light Blocking Glasses at Night and Shutting off Electronic Devices (TV, Laptop, Smartphone) around 1 Hour before Bed. Muscle Gain will indeed require a lot of Recovery, that's why all Fitness Guys a saying to keep the Sleep-Part in Check.

 

[GreekDemiGod]

Been getting some random mid-day raging boners. Surely a sign that things are moving in the right direction..
Taking high-dose Aspirin and B3 these days, might be the reason.

 

[Runenight201]

Been getting some random mid-day raging boners. Surely a sign that things are moving in the right direction..
Taking high-dose Aspirin and B3 these days, might be the reason.

How much Aspirin are you taking? I’ve gotten into a habit taking about 650mgs 2-3 times a day and I’m not sure ifs fine or not. I’ve also heard the claim that too many B’s in isolation can throw the metabolic system out of balance. I was thinking of picking up some thiamine and choline and independently experimenting with those.

 

[GreekDemiGod]

I will be getting new blood tests on Monday and come back here with updates.
I have becoming more and more self conscious about having developed mild gyno.
I am currently around 15-17% bodyfat and in the process of a leaning / cutting phase until I see abs, so hopefully it will improve and I will see if it's actual gyno or just fat tissue in the chest area.
Sadly, one of the culprits has been Pansterone or the DHEA in it, which has made me look more estrogen-dominant, or maybe has revealed my true state.
It's like nothing works for muscle hardness and lean-ness : Andro, 6-keto-P4, creatine, Tocovit
I store fat in the chest area and around the waist. In the face, I am always and have been extremely lean. If you look just at my arms , shoulders, traps, legs, I look like 10% bodyfat. I have visible veins in my forearms. The chest and waist sections ruin my physique, that's where I store fat.

I am already slowly losing some weight / fat, but I was at 84 kg / 185 lbs (heaviest I have ever been - both muscle and fat-wise)

 

[David90]

@GreekDemiGod
Have you gotten your Blood Test Results?.

 

[GreekDemiGod]

@David90 No, I haven't gotten blood tests this year.
I probably should and will in fall / autumn. I was with a woman recently and could not get it up and perform sexually. I might not have been extremely attracted to her, but this is still worrisome.
And I have had this happen a few times this year

 

[redsun]

@David90 No, I haven't gotten blood tests this year.
I probably should and will in fall / autumn. I was with a woman recently and could not get it up and perform sexually. I might not have been extremely attracted to her, but this is still worrisome.
And I have had this happen a few times this year

Have you overall gotten worse and have new problems which have appeared since the start of your journey (at least on this forum with your thread logs)? Been awhile and imo seems like your ******* up doing more then you should be but I am curious on your opinion. Have you made progress in the big picture of things or have you been stagnant or even gone backwards in terms of your goals?

If otherwise your hormones are normal enough (dont even have to be that great) and diet is decent and you still cannot maintain your erection and performance, this is likely due to sympathetic overactivation. Eating more choline and having a few oysters regularly. Beside the rich zinc content being strongly cholinergic, its a rich source of trace minerals in general. In your other new carnivore diet thread you mention poor dream recall and a decline in cognitive function over the last few years, both signs that acetylcholine is likely suboptimal. Other signs of low acetylcholine is poor verbal fluency, poor memory and learning ability.

 

[Alex Jaramillo]

@redsun I know it wasn’t directed at me but thanks for reminding me about the importance of acetylcholine and zinc. The basics are super important and sometimes I lose track and it’s nice to have a forum of people to be held accountable.

 

[GreekDemiGod]

Have you overall gotten worse and have new problems which have appeared since the start of your journey (at least on this forum with your thread logs)? Been awhile and imo seems like your ******* up doing more then you should be but I am curious on your opinion. Have you made progress in the big picture of things or have you been stagnant or even gone backwards in terms of your goals?

If otherwise your hormones are normal enough (dont even have to be that great) and diet is decent and you still cannot maintain your erection and performance, this is likely due to sympathetic overactivation. Eating more choline and having a few oysters regularly. Beside the rich zinc content being strongly cholinergic, its a rich source of trace minerals in general. In your other new carnivore diet thread you mention poor dream recall and a decline in cognitive function over the last few years, both signs that acetylcholine is likely suboptimal. Other signs of low acetylcholine is poor verbal fluency, poor memory and learning ability.

It’s now been 2 years since applying Peat principles from this forum. August 2019 is when I started carbing up and loading on juice. Ever since, I have eaten, on average, 300+ grams of carbs/ day.

Yes, I have gotten worse and I seem to be degenerating. Would I have degenerated faster if I wouldn’t have applied these principles? Maybe.
Maybe a lot of it it’s my fault, I mean I haven’t really focused on getting optimal sleep during all this time.
my poor digestion, low thyroid have been holding me back.
My temps now on NDT are worse than 2 years ago.

Energy and libido have never really gotten better for me.
I also think I ****88 up a lot by taking hormones. I could not make thyroid work. Pansterone, Androsterone have largely been failed experiments.
At some point, I would have to quit every supplement and hormone and start from zero.
nofap has been the only practice that consistently raises my energy levels and vitality

 

[redsun]

It’s now been 2 years since applying Peat principles from this forum. August 2019 is when I started carbing up and loading on juice. Ever since, I have eaten, on average, 300+ grams of carbs/ day.

Yes, I have gotten worse and I seem to be degenerating. Would I have degenerated faster if I wouldn’t have applied these principles? Maybe.
Maybe a lot of it it’s my fault, I mean I haven’t really focused on getting optimal sleep during all this time.
my poor digestion, low thyroid have been holding me back.
My temps now on NDT are worse than 2 years ago.

Energy and libido have never really gotten better for me.
I also think I ****88 up a lot by taking hormones. I could not make thyroid work. Pansterone, Androsterone have largely been failed experiments.
At some point, I would have to quit every supplement and hormone and start from zero.
nofap has been the only practice that consistently raises my energy levels and vitality

Yeh you made the same conclusion I did before about messing with hormones. Really you can apply this to almost every supplement , you screw yourself more in the end. Nutrient dense food and being vigilantly self aware of our nutrient needs, need for adequate sleep and a mentally stimulating (but not draining) lifestyle.

I always find nothing works well if I dont sleep enough. If you temps are worse from 2 years ago even with thyroid then that not a good sign.

 

[Uselis]

I've been loosely following your threads as well. You have a style of writting that is pleasurable to read.

Don't take this wrong but I've noticed lifting and aesthetics been/is quite important part of your life. Could it be elephant in a room so to speak? Did you try scale down activity to bare minimum or eliminate completely and compare results health wise?

Depending on nature of your work and lifting regiment you could be in sympathetic nervous system mode too often.

I used to have 10 hour shifts in front of screens that involved multitasking, quick decision making, too much analytical part of the brain involved, etc. It would drain me so much that couple sets of chin ups next day would make me feel unwell.

Perhaps your problems totally unrelated but if you tried lots of different diet/supp combos maybe it would be beneficial to redecorate current lifestyle.

Regardless, rooting for your success!

 

[GreekDemiGod]

@redsun I might be confusing this, but I honestly think I am in no way in sympathetic overactivation.
And if anything, shouldn’t parasympathetic dominance actually be a problem for erections?
I cut out most stressors from my life, except my job. Taking supplements like Glycine, Aspirin, 6-keto P4 should get me even deeper in parasympathetic mode.

 

[GreekDemiGod]

I've been loosely following your threads as well. You have a style of writting that is pleasurable to read.

Don't take this wrong but I've noticed lifting and aesthetics been/is quite important part of your life. Could it be elephant in a room so to speak? Did you try scale down activity to bare minimum or eliminate completely and compare results health wise?

Depending on nature of your work and lifting regiment you could be in sympathetic nervous system mode too often.

I used to have 10 hour shifts in front of screens that involved multitasking, quick decision making, too much analytical part of the brain involved, etc. It would drain me so much that couple sets of chin ups next day would make me feel unwell.

Perhaps your problems totally unrelated but if you tried lots of different diet/supp combos maybe it would be beneficial to redecorate current lifestyle.

Regardless, rooting for your success!

I build muscle very slow and lose it very fast. I can’t afford to even take 2 weeks off training.
But I am definitely overtraining and undersleeping in respect to my current metabolic state.
The problem is that having a dating and social life (which is also very important to me) make it harder to prioritise sleep, which in turn affects my performance in the gym.

 

[Runenight201]

I build muscle very slow and lose it very fast. I can’t afford to even take 2 weeks off training.
But I am definitely overtraining and undersleeping in respect to my current metabolic state.
The problem is that having a dating and social life (which is also very important to me) make it harder to prioritise sleep, which in turn affects my performance in the gym.

Perhaps a priority switch could help out. Is a dating and social life more important than being able to sleep deeply and soundly each and every night? How could having a deep and restorative sleep improve your current dating and social life? And your gym performance?

A step back to restore and rebuild, to then forge forward.

 

[redsun]

@redsun I might be confusing this, but I honestly think I am in no way in sympathetic overactivation.
And if anything, shouldn’t parasympathetic dominance actually be a problem for erections?
I cut out most stressors from my life, except my job. Taking supplements like Glycine, Aspirin, 6-keto P4 should get me even deeper in parasympathetic mode.

Glycine doesnt really reduce sympathetic activity. It depends on the person but its not like that for everyone. Glycine is actually needed to activate the NMDA receptor so in this way can promote the stress response. There is no direct mechanism for aspirin or keto P4 to reduce sympathetic activity. Norepinephrine and stress in general basically kills blood flow and thus erection is not possible nor can it be maintained even if you get one. The main antagonist to norepinephrine is acetylcholine.

If you sleep poorly all the time your norepinephrine and cortisol will be elevated. Also if you are significantly physically stressed like from exercise + your work or whatever else you do and you are not feeding properly, norepinephrine will be elevated beyond normal. Overtime this cycle amplifies your libido and erection problems because androgens will not be able to normalize and stress hormones prevent proper sexual function.

 

[GreekDemiGod]

@redsun I had the impression that sympathetic = high adrenaline and cortisol and parasympathetic = lowered stress hormones