Taking 3 Grains Of Tyromax And No Effect

[ecstatichamster]

I've been supplementing this way starting with 1 grain, for about 6 weeks. Also taking some T3, maybe 15mg with food during the day. I'm eating a ton of sugar, coconut oil, 80g to 100g of protein. I've gained maybe 12 pounds although with the coconut oil (recent addition) it seems to be starting to reverse. I haven't really cut calories, just finding that I should eat less/almost no cheese.

HR may be a little higher. But temps are still in the 96 range.

I don't feel any real effects of this much thyroid. When I had a blood test, TSH was not terribly elevated and T3 and T4 were in "normal" range but I have felt very low metabolism, cold, etc. for a long time. I sleep fine.

Any ideas?

 

[tara]

Speculations, nothing confident.
Getting regular sunlight?
All the micros?
Possibly wanting a little more protein?
Any idea whether you have elevated estrogen? I think it lowers temp set point.
Interesting your comment elsewhere about sleeping cooler keeping your CP higher. I wonder whether it might also keep estrogen a little higher too, and predispose to lower body temps?
Your wife giving you the cold shoulder cause you abandoned her for a chair? :)

 

[meatbag]

nitric oxide can sometime cause this

 

[answersfound]

You are taking way too much. The supplement hasn't even been out long enough for someone to have properly worked their way up to 3 grains. What's your height and weight?

You could have overshot the dosage and now you are getting reverse t3 which is blocking t3 uptake. I don't know if this the case, I'm just speculating. Based on your temperature tho, it is possible. It may be too much for your liver to handle. You should remain on 2 grains for atleast 2 months before jumping up. Also, I would only increase by half a grain increments. 3 grains is the max Broda Barnes recommended, and I would guess it took 4-5 months to arrive at that dose when he treated people.

 

[tara]

You are taking way too much. The supplement hasn't even been out long enough for someone to have properly worked their way up to 3 grains. What's your height and weight?

You could have overshot the dosage and now you are getting reverse t3 which is blocking t3 uptake. I don't know if this the case, I'm just speculating. Based on your temperature tho, it is possible. It may be too much for your liver to handle. You should remain on 2 grains for atleast 2 months before jumping up. Also, I would only increase by half a grain increments. 3 grains is the max Broda Barnes recommended, and I would guess it took 4-5 months to arrive at that dose when he treated people.

Good point. lol

 

[ecstatichamster]

Speculations, nothing confident.
Getting regular sunlight?
All the micros?
Possibly wanting a little more protein?
Any idea whether you have elevated estrogen? I think it lowers temp set point.
Interesting your comment elsewhere about sleeping cooler keeping your CP higher. I wonder whether it might also keep estrogen a little higher too, and predispose to lower body temps?
Your wife giving you the cold shoulder cause you abandoned her for a chair? :)

LOL. I think I have elevated estrogen, for sure. I had an estrone blood test that showed elevated estrone. What should I do for that?

nitric oxide can sometime cause this

Strangely enough I have nitric oxide test strips and mine is very low.

You are taking way too much. The supplement hasn't even been out long enough for someone to have properly worked their way up to 3 grains. What's your height and weight?

You could have overshot the dosage and now you are getting reverse t3 which is blocking t3 uptake. I don't know if this the case, I'm just speculating. Based on your temperature tho, it is possible. It may be too much for your liver to handle. You should remain on 2 grains for atleast 2 months before jumping up. Also, I would only increase by half a grain increments. 3 grains is the max Broda Barnes recommended, and I would guess it took 4-5 months to arrive at that dose when he treated people.

This is possible. But I was supplementing with Thyroyd and American Biologics before I got the Tyromax.

I started in December with 1/2 grain. Do you think this is still too fast? This is about 6 or 7 weeks.

I think Barnes' product was WAY better than today's product.

Also, it's Winter, and Ray has said that he needs 4 times as much thyroid, I seem to recall, during winter than summer.

 

[tara]

LOL. I think I have elevated estrogen, for sure. I had an estrone blood test that showed elevated estrone. What should I do for that?

I'm not sure.
I wonder whether sleeping a little warmer would make a difference, but that clashes with your Buteyko practice/high CP, which sounds so helpful.
If you were female, I'd be thinking try progesterone. Since you are male, and I know less about that, I'll suggest reading the threads on progesterone for men, from guys with more experience. I think dosing can be very different for different people, but men tend to need less than women.

 

[ecstatichamster]

I'm not sure.
I wonder whether sleeping a little warmer would make a difference, but that clashes with your Buteyko practice/high CP, which sounds so helpful.
If you were female, I'd be thinking try progesterone. Since you are male, and I know less about that, I'll suggest reading the threads on progesterone for men, from guys with more experience. I think dosing can be very different for different people, but men tend to need less than women.

I might try pregnenolone again. It numbs my penis but maybe it is something that needs to be plowed through so to speak.

 

[ecstatichamster]

Also wouldn't my body adjust to these dosages. It is puzzling that I have had no perception of change whatsoever. All along. None.

 

[answersfound]

How is your caffeine tolerance?

 

[ecstatichamster]

How is your caffeine tolerance?

Quite high. I consume probably at least 1g per day without any jitters etc.

 

[charlie]

You are taking way too much.

This was my first thought.

 

[Dotdash]

It seems if someone has already been on some type of replacement Thyroid, then "taking too much" is relative to where they began. I'm at 2.5 grains of Tmax after 3 weeks. However, I was taking cynoplus & cynomel prior to the TMax. In my case, I'm trying to match the effects of those two. I did begin with just a few drops for testing purposes. No adverse results occurred so I increased it. I will probably increase it again soon. There is a thyroid dosing reference in the 7th Edition Merck Manual that suggests one grain 3x daily, increasing to 3 grains 3x daily according to symptoms. We can only speculate about the quality of a grain of thyroid at that time - but they did not seem afraid of starting big & increasing to an amount that now sounds outrageous.

 

[ecstatichamster]

It seems if someone has already been on some type of replacement Thyroid, then "taking too much" is relative to where they began. I'm at 2.5 grains of Tmax after 3 weeks. However, I was taking cynoplus & cynomel prior to the TMax. In my case, I'm trying to match the effects of those two. I did begin with just a few drops for testing purposes. No adverse results occurred so I increased it. I will probably increase it again soon. There is a thyroid dosing reference in the 7th Edition Merck Manual that suggests one grain 3x daily, increasing to 3 grains 3x daily according to symptoms. We can only speculate about the quality of a grain of thyroid at that time - but they did not seem afraid of starting big & increasing to an amount that now sounds outrageous.

Thanks for this. On the STTM site they talk about how low doses to start with make you feel shitty because they suppress the adrenal system but they don't replace the thyroid hormone. That was my experience, a lot of aches and pains and feeling really low when I started. I'm through that now.

And Ray has written:

An effective way to use supplements is to take a combination T4-T3 dose, e.g., 40 mcg of T4 and 10 mcg of T3 once a day, and to use a few mcg of T3 at other times in the day. Keeping a 14-day chart of pulse rate and temperature allows you to see whether the dose is producing the desired response. If the figures aren’t increasing at all after a few days, the dose can be increased, until a gradual daily increment can be seen, moving toward the goal at the rate of about 1/14 per day.”

and:

A therapeutic trial was the final test of the validity of the diagnosis: If the patient’s symptoms disappeared as his temperature and pulse rate and food intake were normalized, the diagnostic hypothesis was confirmed. It was common to begin therapy with one or two grains of thyroid, and to adjust the dose according to the patient’s response. Whatever objective indicator was used, whether it was basal metabolic rate, or serum cholesterol, or core temperature, or reflex relaxation rate, a simple chart would graphically indicate the rate of recovery toward normal health.”

So, start with ONE OR TWO GRAINS...I started lower than that. Progressively add over 14 days, I went FAR longer than 14 days.

So one of three possibilities:

1. My body is VERY resistant to thyroid supplementation. Eventually once it's high enough, my body will respond.
2. My body is VERY resistant to thyroid supplementation. It will NOT respond no matter what the dosage.
3. My body is responding to TOO MUCH supplementation by creating reverse T3.

So today I'll work on #3, I took 1/2 grain after breakfast. I'll try to see how 1.5 grains does today and see if it has an effect.

I'll keep you posted.

 

[Dotdash]

Yes, please do update progress. I have an Aunt who took 3 grains of Armour daily for 45 years and did wonderful on it. At one time I had worked up to a full cynoplus with morning temps finally reaching the 97 mark; however I began having what felt like chemical burn in scalp and eyes and backed off the amount to 1/4 cyno with 25mcg T3. Temps fell but the burning ceased. TMax does not have that effect even at the equivalent of 3/4 cynoplus. I am hopeful.

 

[ecstatichamster]

The only thing I've felt diferent is a slight, very slight, adrenal feeling. But the HR isn't really much faster. Maybe cuz I have done so much Buteyko breathing. I don't know. Maybe because I was mass consuming pistachio nuts and almonds like a fiend for several years before starting on this in December 2015.

One thing I'm trying is to consume 4 or 5 tablespoons of coconut oil a day for awhile. I had gone into this with low fat but I think it was worse, and I think the coconut oil can contain the endotoxins and on the whole I am feeling better. I had gained 12 pounds and I think now I am slowly dropping that.

But the metabolic raise I am looking for hasn't happened.

 

[peter88]

Did cynoplus fix this for you?

 

[Gawdawg]

I've been supplementing this way starting with 1 grain, for about 6 weeks. Also taking some T3, maybe 15mg with food during the day. I'm eating a ton of sugar, coconut oil, 80g to 100g of protein. I've gained maybe 12 pounds although with the coconut oil (recent addition) it seems to be starting to reverse. I haven't really cut calories, just finding that I should eat less/almost no cheese.

HR may be a little higher. But temps are still in the 96 range.

I don't feel any real effects of this much thyroid. When I had a blood test, TSH was not terribly elevated and T3 and T4 were in "normal" range but I have felt very low metabolism, cold, etc. for a long time. I sleep fine.

Any ideas?

I'm almost done with two bottles of Tyromax and have noticed zero results. I'm almost at 3 grains a day.

 

[Sumbody]

I'm almost done with two bottles of Tyromax and have noticed zero results. I'm almost at 3 grains a day.

Do you use it topically?

 

[Gawdawg]

Do you use it topically?

I've been using it both topically and orally.