Strengthening A Severely Weak Immune System

[tara]

I haven't read much about imaginary organs, but if it's capable of regenerating just as fast, it's still consistent with its major rôle in adaptive immunity. The problem would be when the stressor doesn't pass and stays high.

Yeah, don't want chronic stress so it can't recover.
Isn't the thymus kind of school for immune cells? As they mature, it develops their ability to recognise likely invaders etc. I'd imagine that interrupting it during that process might not be great either, even if it can rebuild - ?

I dont think the Okinawans ate "lots" of pork at all. From memory their diet is based on their particular sweet potato and various seafoods and sea vegetables, more than anything.

From memory, war messed up Okinawan access to food, especially pork. IIRC, there was a study during such a time that probably didn't provide a reliable overview of lifetime eating habits.

As is life, it's always going to be a horribly imperfect balancing act and some of us are going to get more lucky than others. That's why I think many of us would do well, first and foremost, to be kinder on ourselves.

+1 :)

 

[LLight]

Rejuvenation of the Aging Thymus: Growth Hormone- and Ghrelin-Mediated Signaling Pathways

"Several neuroendocrine hormones have long been associated with effects on immune cell function including growth-promoting effects on multiple immune cell lineages. GH is an important hormone with effects on the immune system. One of the first observations was that GH levels decreased with age, as thymic involution progresses and this impaired thymic function could be restored by the administration of GH. A number of subsequent reports have demonstrated both thymopoietic and hematopoietic effects for GH, IGF1, GH secretagogues (GHS) and, more recently ghrelin and leptin, during aging."

 

[golder]

Charlie beat me to the thymus comment, dang it lol.

Ray peat says that the thymus is the first organ in the body to be catabolized in hypothyroid, even before muscle mass is catabolized.

And, the thymus is one of the most important (but overlooked) organ in the body, as it is the main regulator of the immune system. If the thymus is damaged (and it will be as its the first to be damaged) in disease, then NOTHING else will work right, including the liver. So if the liver doesn't work right, the thymus could actually be to blame for it so sometimes looking at the liver directly might actually not solve its problems if the thymus is damaged. Ray also says that the damaged thymus could be the reason for many or even all of the so called auto-immune diseases.

According to ray even just a few days or even a few hrs of intense stress can severely damage or even destroy the thymus. So it doesn't take much.

The good news is that the thymus also regenerates quickly, given favorable nutrition and stress levels.

Best ways to speed up thymus repair? Can you actually eat animal thymus? I’ve never seen it advertised in UK supermarkets?

 

[milkboi]

Best ways to speed up thymus repair? Can you actually eat animal thymus? I’ve never seen it advertised in UK supermarkets?

Yeah, you can for sure lol. Beef thymus is a delicacy in gourmet circles I think, but it’s generally not often used in the modern cuisine.

 

[BigChad]

Best ways to speed up thymus repair? Can you actually eat animal thymus? I’ve never seen it advertised in UK supermarkets?

ancestral supplements has it on their website, its a freeze dried product though

 

[charlie]

ancestral supplements has it on their website, its a freeze dried product though

Much more affordable here: Thymus

 

[rob]

On the subject of the thymus, thymic involution/shrinking starts fairly early on in life but, yes, stress will significantly worsen matters – maturing thymocytes are very sensitive to cortisol.

There's this study NAD+ loss, a new player in AhR biology: prevention of thymus atrophy and hepatosteatosis by NAD+ repletion that hints at how important vitamin B3 and related upregulation of NAD+ and sirtuins might be in protecting the thymus from the deleterious effects of an acute stressor, in this case dioxin. I wouldn't be surprised if this translates to stress in humans. So that's maybe something to help you along your way.

Finally, I do know of this study Error - Cookies Turned Off that used growth hormone to regnerate the thymus alongside DHEA and metformin – to counter growth hormone in potentially promoting diabetes. The study also demonstrated reversal of subject's biological age.

 

[BigChad]

Much more affordable here: Thymus

that one looks good. the ancestral one is from beef I believe and is 180 capsules 500mg each.

but do you think freeze dried organs are worth using. I heard freeze drying leaves room for bacteria to grow and the products lose their effectiveness

 

[BigChad]

On the subject of the thymus, thymic involution/shrinking starts fairly early on in life but, yes, stress will significantly worsen matters – maturing thymocytes are very sensitive to cortisol.

There's this study NAD+ loss, a new player in AhR biology: prevention of thymus atrophy and hepatosteatosis by NAD+ repletion that hints at how important vitamin B3 and related upregulation of NAD+ and sirtuins might be in protecting the thymus from the deleterious effects of an acute stressor, in this case dioxin. I wouldn't be surprised if this translates to stress in humans. So that's maybe something to help you along your way.

Finally, I do know of this study Error - Cookies Turned Off that used growth hormone to regnerate the thymus alongside DHEA and metformin – to counter growth hormone in potentially promoting diabetes. The study also demonstrated reversal of subject's biological age.

so the truniagen nicotinamide riboside products could help regenerate the thymus?

 

[rob]

@BigChad Well, the first study I cited was in chick embryos so there are no promises, also it's worth noting that the B3 treatment only negated the adverse thymic effects of an acute stressor – regeneration wasn't mentioned unlike the second study.

However, there's a lot of logic to something like nicotinamide riboside (NR) working in a similar fashion in humans. This study Rapid aging of the thymus linked to decline in free radical defenses notes DNA damage as a driving force in thymus atrophy. The PARP-1 enzyme is crucial in maintaining DNA stability and repair and needs NAD+ to function. Likewise, the sirtuin family of enzymes look to be very significant players and they require NAD+ to function. Stress significantly depletes NAD+, so maintaining good levels might be key to forestalling further decline.

Personally, I am a fan of NR as my Crohn's and general health has responded amazingly well to it for a while now when so many other supplements did nothing for me. It's a very potent NAD+ booster – uses a unique enzymic pathway – but I am aware it's expensive.

Niacin and niacinamide (NAM) are alternatives, albeit much less potent NAD+ boosters. The study supplemented with NAM but I have been hesistant with this in the past. NAM has shown in studies to suppress some of the sirtuins, certainly SIRT1. Persoanlly, I didn't want to be doing that long term, but it might have its time and place - sirtuins are a very complex area of study and a lot is still not known.

 

[Broken man]

Best ways to speed up thymus repair? Can you actually eat animal thymus? I’ve never seen it advertised in UK supermarkets?

TB 500

 

[methylenewhite]

Well, @LLight and @rob I think the point is that you should have multiple levels of evidence. Which is why I like what Longo has proposed - 5 different levels. Its not just epidemiology. Its not just studies. It's the combo of everything. People rely on one level all the time. They take a single study, probably done in rodents, and extrapolate out from there using all their own preconcieved biases.

And yes I'm sure the Bluezones thing is highly flawed. But I still think its pretty well established that there are no centenarian populations who live off a carnivore or high meat diet.

Please stop your plant-based propaganda. You go to Russia, Caucasian Mountains, and see your self how many 90+ and 100+ people there. They eat lamb every day. Diet is lamb meat, cheese, milk some herbs, wine, seasonal fruits. Some wheat based bread.

 

[charlie]

that one looks good. the ancestral one is from beef I believe and is 180 capsules 500mg each.

The ancestral one is of ovine source aka lamb. It reportedly contains only 250mgs of thymus, the other 250mgs is bovine liver. @LifeGivingStore contains 350mgs of ovine thymus only, no liver added.

but do you think freeze dried organs are worth using.

I do.

I heard freeze drying leaves room for bacteria to grow and the products lose their effectiveness

Those products are tested for bacteria and COA can be provided from any reputable company. The many thousands of reviews online reporting the incredible healing capacity of organ and gland supplementation speaks for itself.

 

[Dave Clark]

Yeah, you can for sure lol. Beef thymus is a delicacy in gourmet circles I think, but it’s generally not often used in the modern cuisine.

Aren't they called 'sweet breads' ?

 

[charlie]

Aren't they called 'sweet breads' ?

Yes.

 

[tara]

Best ways to speed up thymus repair?

Refeed and rest? My guess is:
Meet all nutritional needs for minerals, vitamins, protein, calories, and get sunlight and sleep etc.
Avoid fasting, excessive exercise or overwork, and nail-biting stress.

Aren't they called 'sweet breads' ?

'Sweetbreads' seem to be either thymus or the pancreas.

 

[Goobz]

Please stop your plant-based propaganda. You go to Russia, Caucasian Mountains, and see your self how many 90+ and 100+ people there. They eat lamb every day. Diet is lamb meat, cheese, milk some herbs, wine, seasonal fruits. Some wheat based bread.

Look I don’t want to get into a petty argument, but I eat meat myself so I don’t have any plant based agenda. My whole point was to have multiple levels of evidence instead of a single study or anecdote, which is again what’s been provided here.

Once again, I would suggest you check this idea with multiple levels of evidence to see if it checks out - protein, methionine metabolism (Peat has written on this if you don’t trust more mainstream science) and critically - life expectancy statistics of the Russians (which I frankly can’t believe are being cited as an example of long life!)

 

[BigChad]

The ancestral one is of ovine source aka lamb. It reportedly contains only 250mgs of thymus, the other 250mgs is bovine liver. @LifeGivingStore contains 350mgs of ovine thymus only, no liver added.

I do.

Those products are tested for bacteria and COA can be provided from any reputable company. The many thousands of reviews online reporting the incredible healing capacity of organ and gland supplementation speaks for itself.

Oh Thats true, for other glands and organ supplements have you found another brand or is ancestral the best bet. Things like thyroid, brain, kidney, adrenal, bone marrow etc

 

[methylenewhite]

and critically - life expectancy statistics of the Russians (which I frankly can’t believe are being cited as an example of long life!)

They are not Russians there, there are tribes with other genetic makeup. They have 50 centuries for 2,5 million of population in Dagestan Republic for example.

Even NY Times has an article about longevity there.
Why They Live to Be 100, Or Even Older, in Abkhasia

 

[koky]

me:
hi ray
are sweetbreads (hypothalmus) of grass-fed veal beneficial for thyroid?

Ray:
Pancreas is the traditional sweatbread, thymus is sometimes sold as neck sweatbread. They aren't especially good for the thyroid