Soluble Fiber Causes Liver Cancer, Insoluble And Antibiotics Prevent/stop It

[BigChad]

No, imagine it this way:

Your digestive secretions are intense, and transit time fast. No matter how intense your secretions are, some of the food will be left undigested. That will then foster SOME bacteria growth, even if you poop it out quickly.

Now imagine your digestive secretions are just as intense, but your transit time slow. In this case, since the food sits long enough in the small intestine/stomach, it will be completely digested. It will spend a much longer time in the colon, but because there's hardly anything left, you'll get no bacterial growth.

Now, if your digestion is very weak, then it's better to have a fast transit time, since there will be lots of leftover nutrients--better to get them out quickly before they cause harm. But that's planning for failure. If your digestion is weak, the proper thing to do would be try to improve digestion strength via physical activity, coffee, and other things that improve hunger.

Physical activity whether walking or lifting weights, increases stomach acid output? Or is it just due to general health improvement from exercise that digestion also improves

 

[Wagner83]

Hi, Wagner! Have you tried what was described in the last paragraph here? It has to be a digestible form of calcium to not bring new issues. If for some reason you find it too suppressive, you can start to counteract with fermentable compounds from the allium family (from discarding the solids after cooking to consuming them whole and raw).

Thanks for the suggestion, I have not tried calcium supplementation. I never saw someone report a benefit from it, perhaps I should try it anyway. What form would you recommend? I was interested in Parsifal's experience. There was an other guy who was doing well with legumes, fibers, starch. I can't remember his user name, the avatar was a comics hero.

 

[Amazoniac]

- Dysbiosis of the Duodenal Mucosal Microbiota Is Associated With Increased Small Intestinal Permeability in Chronic Liver Disease

 

[Advocate2021]

In light of the information in this thread, I wanted to get input on the following product. I was having fantastic results on the microbiome labs intestinal rebuilding program for a year and a half consisting of sporebiotics, mucosal boosting powder (megmucosa) and a prebiotic powder (info via below link), megaprebiotic.

After reading the info on this thread and others, I stopped the megaprebiotic due to the fructo-ologosacharrides in it and perhaps the other fibers--galacto and xylo oligosacharides- not even sure if these are all contraindicated since carrots have oligosacharides? although the product information says that the pecision of this product only feeds "beneficial bacteria" and lists three strains, none of which are lactobacillus bacteria. Since stopping it a week ago, my mobliity has changed for the worse, so evaluating. Any input on this? The stats from megpebiotic:
MegaPre™ | Precision Prebiotic™ to Support Healthy Microbiome

 

[Advocate2021]

quote from product description that assures that it does not feed detrimental bacteria:

"Prebiotics are non-digestible fibers that feed the bacteria living in your gut. However, most prebiotics on the market can feed both harmful and beneficial gut bacteria, which can exacerbate digestive issues. Keystone bacteria like bacterium Faecalibacterium prausnitzii, Akkermansia muciniphila, and Bifidobacteria are very important for human health, but their populations can be easily diminished by antibiotics, stress, diet, glyphosate, and other environmental toxins."

 

[Ben.]

In light of the information in this thread, I wanted to get input on the following product. I was having fantastic results on the microbiome labs intestinal rebuilding program for a year and a half consisting of sporebiotics, mucosal boosting powder (megmucosa) and a prebiotic powder (info via below link), megaprebiotic.

After reading the info on this thread and others, I stopped the megaprebiotic due to the fructo-ologosacharrides in it and perhaps the other fibers--galacto and xylo oligosacharides- not even sure if these are all contraindicated since carrots have oligosacharides? although the product information says that the pecision of this product only feeds "beneficial bacteria" and lists three strains, none of which are lactobacillus bacteria. Since stopping it a week ago, my mobliity has changed for the worse, so evaluating. Any input on this? The stats from megpebiotic:
MegaPre™ | Precision Prebiotic™ to Support Healthy Microbiome

Ive been testing thoose very products the last 2 months. The spores unlike other probiotics seemed to be okay for my body. The megaprebiotic however does not seem to be tolerated that well. The mega igg seems to be okayish, megamucosa on the other hand has many additional stuff for taste ... idk the citric acid and malic acid make me sceptical .. it doesn't feel well either drinking it (altho the proteins and Imunoglobulins may make it worth it) - like a cheap over flavoured protein shake.

I stopped the mega pre mid bottle as i didn't see much improvement from it. Rather try another prebiotic.
I've made good experiences the last two weeks with raw milk colostrum, tho i'd like to try inulin, pektin and fucoidan in the future. Some people experienced improvement with potatoe or bana starch. Idk things are so wierd, and i know these aren't peaty measures.

Motility not working may be due to your body being used to these kind of fibers you've been supplementing. Are you eating anything for stool bulk? Salads, carrots, resistant starches? anything?

What's confusing me is these products are supposed to help build a robust microbiome/gut lining until you don't need supplements anymore. You took it for over a year ... and within one week you already experience issues? ... that shouldn't happen imo.

 

[Advocate2021]

Ive been testing thoose very products the last 2 months. The spores unlike other probiotics seemed to be okay for my body. The megaprebiotic however does not seem to be tolerated that well. The mega igg seems to be okayish, megamucosa on the other hand has many additional stuff for taste ... idk the citric acid and malic acid make me sceptical .. it doesn't feel well either drinking it (altho the proteins and Imunoglobulins may make it worth it) - like a cheap over flavoured protein shake.

I stopped the mega pre mid bottle as i didn't see much improvement from it. Rather try another prebiotic.
I've made good experiences the last two weeks with raw milk colostrum, tho i'd like to try inulin, pektin and fucoidan in the future. Some people experienced improvement with potatoe or bana starch. Idk things are so wierd, and i know these aren't peaty measures.

Motility not working may be due to your body being used to these kind of fibers you've been supplementing. Are you eating anything for stool bulk? Salads, carrots, resistant starches? anything?

What's confusing me is these products are supposed to help build a robust microbiome/gut lining until you don't need supplements anymore. You took it for over a year ... and within one week you already experience issues? ... that shouldn't happen imo.

thank you good points. I just had such great results using the two powders and the probiotics, I kept going with them all that time and maintained effect. All was status quo until a series of events beginning of november-- fire evacuation aftermath , dental work gone awry -- the stress of it all triggered me I think and ended up with first sinus flareup in 4 years which I self-treated and ended up getting rid of but used grapefruit seed extract for 8 days and did a pinch of flowers of sulphur for 4 days on the last four days-- was fine until day 6 when bowel all of the sudden went spastic after what appeared to be improvement on those remedies. Then on day 7 -8 broke out in a horrid rash from below breasts to inner thighs- 11 days later it has dissipated although will be marked for some time. So, in all fairness to the microbiome products, there are other variables. Just trying to figure out what has shifted so; but the sinus incident (which probably stems from the intestine) really set all off. I am doing ample other fiber carrots, bamboo, mushrooms, etc. since stopping the prebiotic powder.

The reason for stopping the prebiotic was because I knew that even though the products had helped my mobility, they did not resolve my other symptoms of allergies and chemical sensitivities. When the sinus problem arose after many years, I thought I should look at the gut again as probably still an imbalance there, so i cut the megaprebiotic after learning it might actually create dysbiosis despite the improved overall functioning of my bowel on it. Seems antibiotics could be an option to try as well.

 

[Ben.]

thank you good points. I just had such great results using the two powders and the probiotics, I kept going with them all that time and maintained effect. All was status quo until a series of events beginning of november-- fire evacuation aftermath , dental work gone awry -- the stress of it all triggered me I think and ended up with first sinus flareup in 4 years which I self-treated and ended up getting rid of but used grapefruit seed extract for 8 days and did a pinch of flowers of sulphur for 4 days on the last four days-- was fine until day 6 when bowel all of the sudden went spastic after what appeared to be improvement on those remedies. Then on day 7 -8 broke out in a horrid rash from below breasts to inner thighs- 11 days later it has dissipated although will be marked for some time. So, in all fairness to the microbiome products, there are other variables. Just trying to figure out what has shifted so; but the sinus incident (which probably stems from the intestine) really set all off. I am doing ample other fiber carrots, bamboo, mushrooms, etc. since stopping the prebiotic powder.

The reason for stopping the prebiotic was because I knew that even though the products had helped my mobility, they did not resolve my other symptoms of allergies and chemical sensitivities. When the sinus problem arose after many years, I thought I should look at the gut again as probably still an imbalance there, so i cut the megaprebiotic after learning it might actually create dysbiosis despite the improved overall functioning of my bowel on it. Seems antibiotics could be an option to try as well.

Sorry to hear you are having these stressfull events. I didn't mean to bash microbiome labs, in comparison to other products i think they are pretty good and worth trying.

Another thing to mention would be HMO prebiotics which are found in the milk of humans. Some speculate, or even go as far to claim that hmo's are better than any other prebiotic since its basicly made to build a infants immune system.


But you are right, theoritcally everything you eat could potentially "feed bad" bacteria, if there even is such a thing. Maybe for you anitibiotics are the way to go. Have you tried methylene blue or cascara sagrada before?


Grapefruit extract works for you? i've used it for a while in the beginning of the year and it only helped like realy realy short term. I stopped using it due to data i found about it being problematic/unsafe for the body.

There is one guy who just posted yday here that the carrot salad/mushrooms cause complete blocking and results in insane gas formation.
Carrot salad with coconut oil induces fatigue and tiredness for me for example.

Do i understand you correctly ... stopping the microbiome labs ended in sinus flare ups, which then led to spastic bowels and now you are having bad rashes? what a rollercoaster of symptoms.

 

[Advocate2021]

Sorry to hear you are having these stressfull events. I didn't mean to bash microbiome labs, in comparison to other products i think they are pretty good and worth trying.

Another thing to mention would be HMO prebiotics which are found in the milk of humans. Some speculate, or even go as far to claim that hmo's are better than any other prebiotic since its basicly made to build a infants immune system.


But you are right, theoritcally everything you eat could potentially "feed bad" bacteria, if there even is such a thing. Maybe for you anitibiotics are the way to go. Have you tried methylene blue or cascara sagrada before?


Grapefruit extract works for you? i've used it for a while in the beginning of the year and it only helped like realy realy short term. I stopped using it due to data i found about it being problematic/unsafe for the body.

There is one guy who just posted yday here that the carrot salad/mushrooms cause complete blocking and results in insane gas formation.
Carrot salad with coconut oil induces fatigue and tiredness for me for example.

Do i understand you correctly ... stopping the microbiome labs ended in sinus flare ups, which then led to spastic bowels and now you are having bad rashes? what a rollercoaster of symptoms.

Thanks for all of this. Due to stress I think histamine went up mid november and had a series of allergic reactions that led to sinus issue. had not been taking my cyproheptadine so have been taking that and allergies have subided but due to the attacks sinus got inflamed and used grapefruit seed extract in netty pot and internally and think it got rid of the infection but 7 days into taking the GSE (and took flowers of sulfur pinches for days 4-7, errupted in a rash-- it was an allergic reaction to the GSE I think because I have used the sulfur for many years with no reaction. I too was concerned about GSE but it worked on the sinus I think but I will never take it again. What negative info did you find on GSE? would love to seet than. thanks!

 

[Happycat]

I have just read through this old thread and I am now quite confused.

I have heard Ray Peat say in interviews that wheat bran well cooked is ok and that oat bran is a known carcinogen.
I dunno, but I love wheat bran and I like how it solved some digestion issues I had, my gut seesm to like this fiber.
Raw carrot salad does absolutely nothing for me.

Someone mentioned in the thread that it would be impossible to eat 1/2 cup of wheat bran per day because it tastes so bad.
It depends how you cook it.
I make some wheat bran muffins with added egg, milk, sugar and coconut oil and they are very good.

 

[Advocate2021]

I have just read through this old thread and I am now quite confused.

I have heard Ray Peat say in interviews that wheat bran well cooked is ok and that oat bran is a known carcinogen.
I dunno, but I love wheat bran and I like how it solved some digestion issues I had, my gut seesm to like this fiber.
Raw carrot salad does absolutely nothing for me.

Someone mentioned in the thread that it would be impossible to eat 1/2 cup of wheat bran per day because it tastes so bad.
It depends how you cook it.
I make some wheat bran muffins with added egg, milk, sugar and coconut oil and they are very good.

Im excited to try wheat bran--getting it today from amazon-- no store in my area carries it which is interesting--tried 7 health and grocery stores!! May I have your muffin recipe please? Thanks!

 

[Happycat]

Im excited to try wheat bran--getting it today from amazon-- no store in my area carries it which is interesting--tried 7 health and grocery stores!! May I have your muffin recipe please? Thanks!

Sure, here it is:

1.5 cups wheat bran
1/2 cup plain wheat flour or other type, I even used masa harina flour
1 teaspoon bicarbonate of soda
1 teaspoon baking powder
1 whole egg
1 cup milk
Sugar, salt and spices to taste

Mix together and put into 6 silicone cases oiled with coconut oil. Bake at 200°C for about 20min.
Serve warm with plenty of coconut oil.

 

[Advocate2021]

Thank you so much!! Happy New Year!

 

[Vinero]

Overpopulation with the clostridia bacteria combined with soluble fiber feeding causes liver cancer. If we could get rid of the clostridia bacteria and replace it with a less pathogenic bacteria maybe soluble fiber will not be as harmful. Interestingly I found this thread:
(4) Coffee To Sterilize The Gut | Page 2 | Ray Peat Forum
From the study: "Bacteroides spp. and Clostridium spp. counts decreased in the proximal colon after coffee and GOS consumption compared with those in the control group. In contrast, Bifidobacterium spp. counts significantly increased after coffee and GOS consumption compared with those in the control group"

So we should be increasing our coffee and GOS consumption to replace the bad clostridium with bifidobacterium.
GOS are a product of lactose, so that means drinking milk will cause the production of GOS in the gut I think.
This means Ray was right when he said milk causes the growth of relatively safe bacteria in the intestine.

 

[SamYo123]

I can only have good bowl movements if I get enough souble fiber, say oats, but the oats cause me gas, so how can you get endotoxin while improved bowl movements?

 

[meatbag]

I can only have good bowl movements if I get enough souble fiber, say oats, but the oats cause me gas, so how can you get endotoxin while improved bowl movements?

Mushrooms ?

 

[TheBeard]

I can only have good bowl movements if I get enough souble fiber, say oats, but the oats cause me gas, so how can you get endotoxin while improved bowl movements?

Antibiotics + epsom salt is your solution.

 

[meatbag]

I can only have good bowl movements if I get enough souble fiber, say oats, but the oats cause me gas, so how can you get endotoxin while improved bowl movements?

how I prep mushrooms and why it’s worth the bother | The Nutrition Coach
"Benefits of well cooked white button mushrooms:

A great alternative to carrot salad. They lower excess estrogen, endotoxin and nitric oxide; when well cooked, mushrooms help move along in the intestine anything that will not be properly digested that could therefore potentially increase endotoxin and estrogen. Their fibers absorb toxins and disinfect the bowels in much the same way as those in bamboo shoots and raw carrots. And by this means they are very helpful in treating small intestine bacterial overgrowth (SIBO)."

 

[SamYo123]

how I prep mushrooms and why it’s worth the bother | The Nutrition Coach
"Benefits of well cooked white button mushrooms:

A great alternative to carrot salad. They lower excess estrogen, endotoxin and nitric oxide; when well cooked, mushrooms help move along in the intestine anything that will not be properly digested that could therefore potentially increase endotoxin and estrogen. Their fibers absorb toxins and disinfect the bowels in much the same way as those in bamboo shoots and raw carrots. And by this means they are very helpful in treating small intestine bacterial overgrowth (SIBO)."

tried mushrooms before but i need the soulable fiber in order to have a bulky poo, otherwise, it comes out hard pebbles, ive spent long timer boling the oats so their soft, only a bit of gas from them. Why would simple sugar, e.g white sugar, OJ, ketchup (sucrose) cause seb dermatitus, each time I stop these sugars and add soluable fiber, the redness/seb derm reduces on my face.

Simple sugars make me bloat, but dont give any gas, can you call that endotoxin?

 

[southcesar]

does anyone have any info on psyllium? People who have anal sex take this to get their rectum clean, without even having to wash it. Perhaps this indicates that the intestine is left with no stool residues? Maybe lower endoxin?