Intrusive / Unwanted Thoughts Due To Low GABA Signalling

[Soren]

Any tolerance issues? also what dosage

I'm planning to phase out niacinamide due to homocysteine risks was thinking of substituting with tianeptine

What is a homocysteine risk? Never heard that before with regards to niacinamide.

 

[bdawg]

What is a homocysteine risk? Never heard that before with regards to niacinamide.

see @Travis post here

https://raypeatforum.com/community/threads/dopamine-agonist-raising-adrenaline.20665/page-2

 

[Greg says]

Any tolerance issues? also what dosage

I'm planning to phase out niacinamide due to homocysteine risks was thinking of substituting with tianeptine

I've used tianeptine daily for 3+ years, with the odd breaks of 2 months every so often. I use under 100mg daily to avoid any issues. I haven't had any major tolerance issues. There is a 3-5 day or so of minor withdrawal, but as far as I'm concerned no problem, just restless legs at night and difficulty getting to sleep. For me tianeptine is the only thing that truly helps for PTSD, an exaggerated stress response and learned helplessness.

 

[dookie]

@sladerunner69

Have you found any of the fat solubles in supplemental form - Vitamin A, D, K or E, to greatly reduce edema/gyno/estrogen?

 

[bdawg]

I've used tianeptine daily for 3+ years, with the odd breaks of 2 months every so often. I use under 100mg daily to avoid any issues. I haven't had any major tolerance issues. There is a 3-5 day or so of minor withdrawal, but as far as I'm concerned no problem, just restless legs at night and difficulty getting to sleep. For me tianeptine is the only thing that truly helps for PTSD, an exaggerated stress response and learned helplessness.

Thanks! how bad is the sleep effect?

 

[Mito]

What is a homocysteine risk? Never heard that before with regards to niacinamide.

https://raypeatforum.com/community/threads/niacinamide-increases-homocysteine.18528/

 

[Greg says]

Thanks! how bad is the sleep effect?

not too bad... just feel wired and unsettled but eventually get to sleep, things like niacinamide and theanine help. I think its due to tianeptines mild opioid effect.

 

[lampofred]

I am trying really hard to increase GABA without drugs...

only thing that works is meditation but only for like 2 minutes

 

[Regina]

I am trying really hard to increase GABA without drugs...

only thing that works is meditation but only for like 2 minutes

I'm pretty much the same. For me, a combo of meditation and reciting the heart sutra (and a couple of others) is the most reliable strategy. It takes about 20 minutes.

 

[johnwester130]

DHT is the most important neurosteroid. Many finasteride users commit suicide . This will sound controversial, but coconut oil should be avoided if you experience PFS and mild depression, it will suppress DHT.

"“In addition to its role in prostate health, DHT is an incredible mood booster and nervine [has a beneficial effect on the nervous system]. The brain relies on sex hormones, such as DHEA, testosterone, DHT and estrogen, for optimal functioning, but of all these steroid compounds, DHT reigns supreme. Buhner claims that DHT is more important for brain health than even testosterone. Where testosterone’s neural impact subsides after a few hours, DHT’s neural effect can last up to twenty-four hours.”

As for everything else,

b6,

tyrosine,
taurine,
theanine,

would be a fantastic combination. Maybe caffeine too. The more you boost dopamine, the more b6 you need.

B6 and dopamine

this supplement has the right idea, but bad execution. - I don't reccomend it.
Swanson Ultra GABAplex w/L-Tyrosine & L-Theanine 60 Veg Caps - Swanson Health Products

BRAIN NEUROTRANSMITTERS

 

[aguilaroja]

DHT is the most important neurosteroid. Many finasteride users commit suicide . This will sound controversial, but coconut oil should be avoided if you experience PFS and mild depression, it will suppress DHT....

Thanks for the perspective & suggestions. I am not aware of findings that suggest that coconut oil suppresses DHT. But then, many things not yet known to me.

On quick literature browse, a few items suggest that coconut oil supports testosterone function in the testes and is protective against prostate hyperplasia.

Dietary lipids modify redox homeostasis and steroidogenic status in rat testis. - PubMed - NCBI
“The oxidative stress in testes was higher with the grapeseed oil-supplemented diet and decreased with the other diets in this order: soybean oil > olive oil > coconut oil. Animals fed with the olive oil and coconut oil diets showed the highest testicular levels of antioxidants in addition to significantly high levels of testosterone and 3beta- or 17beta-hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase enzymes.”

Influence of commercial dietary oils on lipid composition and testosterone production in interstitial cells isolated from rat testis. - PubMed - NCBI
“…interstitial cells isolated from Wistar rats that had been fed semi-synthetic diets containing four different commercial oils (S soybean, O olive, C coconut, and G grape seed).”
“Testosterone concentration was higher in O and C groups compared with S or G.”

Effects of coconut oil on testosterone-induced prostatic hyperplasia in Sprague-Dawley rats. - PubMed - NCBI
“…this study shows that CO reduced the increase of both PW [prostate weight] and PW:BW [PW:body weight (BW)] ratio, markers of testosterone-induced PH in rats.”

 

[jyb]

For me tianeptine is the only thing that truly helps for PTSD, an exaggerated stress response and learned helplessness.

No permanent effect then? Always disappointing when something seems helpful but only because you keep taking it and if you don't you're back to where you were. All the psychoactive substances, antibiotics, etc.

 

[success23]

Sorry for stupid question but is gaba signalling the same as gaba boosting ?

 

[bionicheart]

I've used tianeptine daily for 3+ years, with the odd breaks of 2 months every so often. I use under 100mg daily to avoid any issues. I haven't had any major tolerance issues. There is a 3-5 day or so of minor withdrawal, but as far as I'm concerned no problem, just restless legs at night and difficulty getting to sleep. For me tianeptine is the only thing that truly helps for PTSD, an exaggerated stress response and learned helplessness.

I'm trying to come off benzos for PTSD/anxiety, would you say tianeptine would be helpful? Every time I taper down to a lower dose I get brain zaps and terrible intrusive thoughts, especially at night. Thanks..

 

[Jsaute21]

I'm pretty much the same. For me, a combo of meditation and reciting the heart sutra (and a couple of others) is the most reliable strategy. It takes about 20 minutes.

Do you find taking thyroid or progesterone, and or raising your metabolism has helped rid yourself of unwanted thoughts? My battles with this issue are rare but i certainly have days when this side effect is present.

 

[Regina]

Do you find taking thyroid or progesterone, and or raising your metabolism has helped rid yourself of unwanted thoughts? My battles with this issue are rare but i certainly have days when this side effect is present.

They are good but some days I need to chant heart sutra to let the unwanted thoughts go and to feel better.
But at the same, the thoughts that are persisting are telling me something.

 

[Frankdee20]

They are good but some days I need to chant heart sutra to let the unwanted thoughts go and to feel better.
But at the same, the thoughts that are persisting are telling me something.

What’s the best way to boost GABA then ? Like permanently ? Glutamic Acid ?

 

[Regina]

What’s the best way to boost GABA then ? Like permanently ? Glutamic Acid ?

I think everything that haidut said here about cancer applies:
"Inhibitory mechanisms like GABA, glycine, progesterone, pregnenolone, magnesium, vitamin E, DHEA, T, DHT, etc is what keeps cells from reverting into a shapeless, hungry mass that loses its morphostasis and consumes the host. Conversely, estrogen, cortisol, aldosterone, prolactin, serotonin, NO, etc are "growth" and de-differentiating agents. Stress, toxins, chronic infections and perceived inability to escape from restrictive environments is what activates the second group."
So many people want to de-sensitize themselves and increase their pain tolerance. At least that is what I see in aikido and I'm not even going to get into BJJ or MMA, etc.
I now train at a small place that combines zen/aikido. But sadly, the students never go out of the second group of de-differentiating agents. They (mis)-use zen as another avenue to increase pain tolerance to a world they perceive as arbitrary, capricious, hostile, cruel and unfair. City-dwellers, who ride their bike or nasty train to get about, way over-train in aikido, + gym, plus sitting zen in cold temps, + cover their bodies in tatoos and piercings, and going and going and going. More and more and more. I'm a badass. Nothing can hurt me. I can tolerate anything. I am numb to all of it. I am invincible. I am powerful. I am omniscient.

The endorphins and cortisol et al deform perception and act as temporary butress. They are self-trapping mechanisms.

In the long run, it is better to just face it all. I think you have to oppose these de-differentiating agents and build androgens and keep serotonin low.
I think the more you regain sensitivity the better. It's actually calming. The correct utilization of zen is turn its inexhaustible lamp on everything and realize, "oh, so that's what was making all that noise.".

 

[Jsaute21]

This is a topic that i think many need help with. I know that i am someone who has had on and off battles with OCD since i was 15. All symptoms completely went away in college and for a couple of years after. However, they returned again when i was 24 or so. My intrusive thoughts tend to be related to self doubt, which i personally believe has connections to metabolism. Theoretically if ones metabolism is working fluidly, one wouldn't have time to second guess ourselves.

For me, the debate is - is this a neurotransmitter issue? Or is this a metabolism issue, that gets transformed into a neurotransmitter issue? I took a big dose of cynoplus last night, and had some pretty brutal OCD this morning. As Peat often says, thyroid dysfunction can come in a myriad of forms. I couldn't look much healthier than i do, but my battle is more mental than anything else. Caffeine sometimes helps, and sometimes seems to make things worse.

I am curious to some of your opinions on this matter, and to see if other people who have found Peat have run into similar type issues.

 

[johnwester130]

Magnolia Bark (the real thing) is very pro GABA, as is Gotu Kola. Coffee seems to have indirect effects on neurotransmitters via its Adenosine blockade.

thoughts on this supplement?

True Calm™ Veg Capsules

Niacin (as Niacinamide) 45 mg 281%
Vitamin B6 (from Pyridoxine HCl) 8 mg 471%
Magnesium
(from Magnesium Bisglycinate) (TRAACS™) 6.5 mg 2%
GABA (Gamma-Aminobutyric Acid) 200 mg †
Glycine 200 mg †
Taurine 200 mg †
Inositol 100 mg †
Valerian (Valeriana officinalis) (Root)