Antibiotics for sibo? Which one?

[youngsinatra]

What helped me in the long-term was improving stomach acid with high salt intake, raw ginger before meals, zinc supplementation and HDT (high dose thiamin therapy).
For clearing the SIBO itself, I‘ve successfully used oil of oregano softgels, raw ginger, neem and allicin.

 

[mostlylurking]

If i only knew

Did you try thiamine? If yes, can you describe what you took?

 

[Motif]

What helped me in the long-term was improving stomach acid with high salt intake, raw ginger before meals, zinc supplementation and HDT (high dose thiamin therapy).
For clearing the SIBO itself, I‘ve successfully used oil of oregano softgels, raw ginger, neem and allicin.

How long did you have the stuff like allicin etc? And what has improved from that ?


How much salt and thiamine? Did you really feel a difference from thiamine ?

 

[Motif]

Did you try thiamine? If yes, can you describe what you took?

Still taking some. Now thiamine. I think 100 mg?

I did take more , but never felt a difference

 

[mostlylurking]

Still taking some. Now thiamine. I think 100 mg?

I did take more , but never felt a difference

I found excellent results with high dose thiamine hcl. I take 2 grams/day. 100mg did nothing for me. The amount needs to be increased over some time, if doing this without a doctor, as some people experience possible cardiac symptoms; I spent 3 months working up to 2 grams. But I experienced good improvement in some symptoms at 300mg 2Xday; they didn't last though. So I increased the dose, again and again. Now 2 grams/day continues to work well; I've been on this dose for 8 months. In the past I suffered from gut disbiosis and SIBO for maybe 25 years. I'm fine now.

 

[Motif]

I found excellent results with high dose thiamine hcl. I take 2 grams/day. 100mg did nothing for me. The amount needs to be increased over some time, if doing this without a doctor, as some people experience possible cardiac symptoms; I spent 3 months working up to 2 grams. But I experienced good improvement in some symptoms at 300mg 2Xday; they didn't last though. So I increased the dose, again and again. Now 2 grams/day continues to work well; I've been on this dose for 8 months. In the past I suffered from gut disbiosis and SIBO for maybe 25 years. I'm fine now.

Abd why do you need this much ?

 

[mostlylurking]

Abd why do you need this much ?

I believe that I have suffered from a thiamine deficiency almost all my life, probably, caused by heavy metal toxins (mercury amalgam fillings when I was a kid and my mother's Club Aluminum cookware). Heavy metals block thiamine function, I've learned recently.

Then, last year, I took Bactrim antibiotic, which totally blocked what thiamine function I still had. I was very sick for months with lactic acidosis. I learned via Haidut that thiamine resolves lactic acid so I tried 250-300mg and my pain disappeared and my temperature increased a full degree, all within 45 minutes.

Here are some links to information for your consideration:

https://www.youtube.com/c/EONutrition

You searched for thiamine - Hormones Matter

www.hormonesmatter.com

 

[youngsinatra]

How long did you have the stuff like allicin etc? And what has improved from that ?


How much salt and thiamine? Did you really feel a difference from thiamine?

I took a combination of those for 4-5 weeks roughly. No more bloating and 90% less histamine intolerance + breath test returned to normal.

I only felt a difference when I finally got to the therapeutic doses of B1. I am currently taking 3 x 1 gram of thiamin HCL a day. I take 300 mg of magnesium with each dose.

 

[Motif]

I took a combination of those for 4-5 weeks roughly. No more bloating and 90% less histamine intolerance + breath test returned to normal.

I only felt a difference when I finally got to the therapeutic doses of B1. I am currently taking 3 x 1 gram of thiamin HCL a day. I take 300 mg of magnesium with each dose.

Thanks. That’s a lot b1.

 

[youngsinatra]

Thanks. That’s a lot b1.

It is indeed. I think the bioavailability is around 3-5% with thiamin HCL and thus higher doses are required. The 3 grams of thiamin HCL are probably equivalent to 100-150mg TTFD.

 

[mostlylurking]

Abd why do you need this much ?

I want to add some information regarding why I need 2 grams of thiamine hcl. Please note that when someone explains what works for them that it is not a blanket recommendation that everybody follow suit and do exactly the same thing.

I had been taking 100mg thiamine 2Xday for about 6 years and I felt pretty good. It is not the only thing I take. Summer of 2020 I got a bladder infection that was treated with different antibiotics over a 3 month period. One of the antibiotics was Bactrim which is known to block thiamine function. I got really sick. I was in trouble and in a lot of pain (lactic acidosis). I started increasing my thiamine hcl dosage October of 2020; Each higher dose would work for maybe a week and then stop working. I developed a tremor in my right hand. By January I was up to 1.5 grams/day and getting concerned that this high a dose would hurt me. So I researched thiamine some more.

I found Dr. Costantini's website: HDT Therapy and read everything on the site, including his published papers (hidden under Blog). Dr. Costantini successfully treated Parkinson's Disease patients with high dose thiamine. I had read that people who have a history of gut disbiosis are more likely to get Parkinson's as they get older. I'm 71. I had developed a tremor in my right hand. I was having a hard time rolling over in bed and walking across the room was very hard.

I decided to follow Dr. Costantini's protocol of high dose thiamine hcl. I read that my dose should be 2 to 2.5 grams/day. So I tried the 2 grams/day dose. After 2 days on this dose I experienced a really big improvement in my digestive tract which had been pretty much shut down for months. Things just got a whole lot better.

After a week of the 2 gram/day dose, I decided to try 2.5 grams. I did that dose one day. That night, when I went to bed, I experienced shooting electrical zapping pains in my thighs. I read that this is a sign that you took too much thiamine so I went back to the 2 gram/day dose. I've been taking this dose since the first of February and I've gotten my life back. I can actually walk down the road a mile (or two!) and have enough energy afterwards to do strength exercises for about 30 minutes.

 

[Cooper]

Rifaxamin works. Its the gold standard. Everything else is a poor mans effort.

How about Flagyl?

 

[mostlylurking]

How about Flagyl?

oh dear.... You searched for flagyl - Hormones Matter

this one in particular:

Metronidazole Toxicity, Thiamine Deficiency, and Wernicke's Encephalopathy - Hormones Matter

Does the antibiotic known as Flagyl or metronidazole induce encephalopathy? Is thiamine involved?

www.hormonesmatter.com

 

[ursidae]

no real test that doctors do.

What country do you live in?

1) Heidelberg test
2) gastric aspiration test (injection of gastrin followed by invasive sampling)
3) serum Gastrin, Pepsinogen I, Pepsinogen II
4) serum Iron, phosphorus, chloride, protein, BUN, B12
5) Stool testing for products of protein breakdown (marker or undigested protein reach the colon): Isovalerate, valerate, Isobutyrate; faecal fat, pancreatic elastase
5) stool test indicating elevated levels of species that are implicated in hypochlorhydria/thrive on undigested protein : Klebsiella, pseudomonas, H.Pylori, C. Difficile

 

[BrianF]

How about Flagyl?

Flagyl and Rifaxamin are often used together to maximise effect and tests have proved their combined efficacy.

 

[Sam321]

Hm, so what would be the best for methane sibo?

They say rifaxamin/neomycin combo or Allisin for a month. Both are wretched.

Id try the carrot salad and diet for a while before doing that.

 

[Mauritio]

I want to add some information regarding why I need 2 grams of thiamine hcl. Please note that when someone explains what works for them that it is not a blanket recommendation that everybody follow suit and do exactly the same thing.

I had been taking 100mg thiamine 2Xday for about 6 years and I felt pretty good. It is not the only thing I take. Summer of 2020 I got a bladder infection that was treated with different antibiotics over a 3 month period. One of the antibiotics was Bactrim which is known to block thiamine function. I got really sick. I was in trouble and in a lot of pain (lactic acidosis). I started increasing my thiamine hcl dosage October of 2020; Each higher dose would work for maybe a week and then stop working. I developed a tremor in my right hand. By January I was up to 1.5 grams/day and getting concerned that this high a dose would hurt me. So I researched thiamine some more.

I found Dr. Costantini's website: HDT Therapy and read everything on the site, including his published papers (hidden under Blog). Dr. Costantini successfully treated Parkinson's Disease patients with high dose thiamine. I had read that people who have a history of gut disbiosis are more likely to get Parkinson's as they get older. I'm 71. I had developed a tremor in my right hand. I was having a hard time rolling over in bed and walking across the room was very hard.

I decided to follow Dr. Costantini's protocol of high dose thiamine hcl. I read that my dose should be 2 to 2.5 grams/day. So I tried the 2 grams/day dose. After 2 days on this dose I experienced a really big improvement in my digestive tract which had been pretty much shut down for months. Things just got a whole lot better.

After a week of the 2 gram/day dose, I decided to try 2.5 grams. I did that dose one day. That night, when I went to bed, I experienced shooting electrical zapping pains in my thighs. I read that this is a sign that you took too much thiamine so I went back to the 2 gram/day dose. I've been taking this dose since the first of February and I've gotten my life back. I can actually walk down the road a mile (or two!) and have enough energy afterwards to do strength exercises for about 30 minutes.

Thanks for sharing.
On hormonesmatter they explain that at higher doses thiamine doesnt only work as a vitamin anymore, but as a metabolic enhancement, enabling crucial enzymes like PDH to work again and thus helping to rejuvenate one's metabolism .
Thiamine deficiency also impairs gastric acid secretion.

I really, really recommend those two articles. One is to understand why some people need such a doses of B1 and the other one is about why B1 deficiency can cause gut problems .
(Beyond Deficiency: Using Thiamine as a Metabolic Stimulant - Hormones Matter)
(SIBO, IBS, and Constipation: Unrecognized Thiamine Deficiency? - Hormones Matter)

 

[mostlylurking]

Thanks for sharing.
On hormonesmatter they explain that at higher doses thiamine doesnt only work as a vitamin anymore, but as a metabolic enhancement, enabling crucial enzymes like PDH to work again and thus helping to rejuvenate one's metabolism .
Thiamine deficiency also impairs gastric acid secretion.

I really, really recommend those two articles. One is to understand why some people need such a doses of B1 and the other one is ablut B1 and gut problems
(Beyond Deficiency: Using Thiamine as a Metabolic Stimulant - Hormones Matter)
(SIBO, IBS, and Constipation: Unrecognized Thiamine Deficiency? - Hormones Matter)

Thank you for this response. Your first paragraph sums it up so well! I think the idea that high dose thiamine acts as a metabolic enhancement is important.

Elliot Overton wrote both of the articles you provided links to. I really like his articles and also his videos on his youtube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/c/EONutrition/videos .

 

[Mauritio]

Thank you for this response. Your first paragraph sums it up so well! I think the idea that high dose thiamine acts as a metabolic enhancement is important.

Elliot Overton wrote both of the articles you provided links to. I really like his articles and also his videos on his youtube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/c/EONutrition/videos .

Yes, I think it can do a lot of things that thyroid can do, like increase PDH and CO2.

Yes! Great videos, @Lokzo has interviewed him as well.

Btw do you take any "co-factors" like magnesium other b vitamins ?

 

[mostlylurking]

Yes, I think it can do a lot of things that thyroid can do, like increase PDH and CO2.

Yes! Great videos, @Lokzo has interviewed him as well.

Btw do you take any "co-factors" like magnesium other b vitamins ?

Yes, I take a b-complex and also a little additional niacinamide and biotin, along with magnesium glycinate. I rely on orange juice for potassium. I added the biotin a couple of months into the high dose thiamine; I responded well to it so maybe my biotin function was also blocked. I also take progesterone, pregnenolone, some K, A, and D3. I also take aspirin.