CamphoSal - Liquid Camphoric Acid + Salol

Discussion in 'IdeaLabs' started by haidut, Oct 21, 2019.

  1. haidut

    haidut Member

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    As many readers know, Peat has written extensively on the benefits of antibiotics and on keeping the GI tract as free of bacteria as possible. Bacterial overgrowth in the colon alone is already a problem due to the production of endotoxin, but in hypothyroid people this bacterial overgrowth can extend into the small intestine. The latter condition is commonly referred to as SIBO, and it can lead to malabsorption, inflammation, bacterial translocation to liver / pancreas / gallbladder / spleen / heart / etc. As I posted in several other threads, the chronic inflammation and translocation can lead to a host of severe health issues including "autoimmune" conditions, diabetes, obesity, and even (liver/pancreatic) cancer(s).
    Gut Bacteria May Cause ALL Autoimmune Conditions; Antibiotics Can Cure
    All Gut Bacteria Dangerous, Its Endotoxin Drives Liver Cancer; Antibiotics Cure
    Pancreatic Cancer Driven By Bacteria/endotoxin; Antibiotics Can Prevent/treat
    Gut Bacteria Overgrowth, Regardless Of Type, Causes Obesity

    One of the approaches to keeping the GI tract as bacteria-free as possible is by using antibiotics. However, for most people those are not an easy option as they require prescription and some of them have severe side effects. Fortunately, there are some dietary methods that may provide similar benefits. Those methods including substances such as charcoal, fiber, anti-serotonin chemicals, aspirin, etc. Of these, aspirin has a very long history of usage as a disinfectant, including in the GI tract. However, the problem with regular aspirin (and its metabolite salicylic acid) is that it gets quickly metabolized and absorbed in the stomach before it has a chance to exert its anti-bacterial effects. It may have some effects in the upper portion of the small intestine but likely does not remain intact long enough to affect the colon. Cognizant of both the potential and limitations of regular aspirin, doctors as far as back as late 19th century came up with a modified version of salicylic acid. The molecule is rather simple and is just an ester of salicylic acid with phenol. The commonly used name of this chemical was Salol - i.e. a combination of (sal)icylic acid and phen(ol).
    Phenyl salicylate - Wikipedia
    "...It has been used as an antiseptic[5] based on the antibacterial activity upon hydrolysis in the small/large intestine.[citation needed]. It acts as a mild analgesic.[6]"

    This simple esterification allows salicylic acid to survive more or less intact until it reaches the small intestine and colon where it is metabolized by the microbiome and broken down into phenol and salicylic acid. As it turns out, the phenol portion is at least as potent an antibacterial as salicylic acid and possibly even stronger. This spurred the development of a special synthetic version of phenol called Dimol, which was shown to be remarkably beneficial in rheumatoid arthritis (RA). The benefits for RA were demonstrated to be due precisely to Dimol's effects on reducing bacterial overgrowth and thus endotoxin levels.
    Simple Intestinal Antiseptic As A Cure For Rheumatoid Arthritis (RA)

    Around the same time Salol was becoming popular, another common remedy used as intestinal disinfectant was camphoric acid.
    Camphoric acid - Wikipedia
    This is the dicarboxylic acid version of camphor, but unlike camphor is has no smell and its taste is tart/bitter similar to a combination of lemon and quinine. This allowed for the chemical to be orally administered and it was successfully used both as an intestinal disinfectant as well as for treating fevers due to various infectious diseases such as tuberculosis.
    Thus, we decided to release a combination of these two chemicals as a product for intestinal disinfection, and we called it CamphoSal - a combination of (Campho)ric acid and (Sal)ol. Below are some references related to the usage of both camphoric acid and salol as intestinal disinfectants, including comments from Peat on his usage of camphoric acid. It was his comments on the dosage (100mg-200mg daily) he used that influenced how much we formulated per single dose of our product.

    Ray Peat Email Exchanges - Ray Peat Forum Wiki
    "...[Tongue, teeth, gum problems] There are some strong nervous and circulatory interactions between the intestine and the mouth, affecting surfaces and periodontal health, tooth sensitivity, etc. I knew a dentist who stopped doing periodontal surgery when he found that his patients were more easily cured with a laxative. Camphoric acid has been used as an intestinal disinfectant to remedy problems such as coated or sore tongue or bad breath. The tetracyclines have similar effects. Vitamins D and K are important."

    Flowers Of Sulfur Aka Brimstone Logs
    "...Local bacteria are usually involved in the white tongue, but typically the problem is mainly in the intestine. I have experimented with the old-fashioned "intestinal disinfectant" camphoric acid (it used to be a common pharmaceutical, 80 to 100 years ago), and when I would swallow about 100 to 200 mg of it in the evening, I would wake up with a perfectly clean tongue, not a bit of the white. Bamboo shoots, raw carrot, and flowers of sulfur are other antiseptics that can reduce the white tongue."

    https://books.google.com/books?id=Q...amphoric acid intestinal disinfectant&f=false
    https://books.google.com/books?id=j...amphoric acid intestinal disinfectant&f=false
    https://books.google.com/books?id=5...amphoric acid intestinal disinfectant&f=false
    "...Camphoric acid is now an official drug duly recognized by the new pharmacopeia. The advisers acted wisely in accepting this drug as one of the additions for official recognition. Its place in therapeutics is firmly established. It has many used in medicine, but it is especially prominent as a remedial agent in combating the night-sweats of consumptives. The claim can safely be made that the use of no other remedy is followed by results so beneficial as follows the administration of camphoric acid in controlling the profuse night sweats of pulmonary tuberculosis. The controlling influence is also exerted in sweating from other causes. Locally, its action is that of a mild antiseptic. In one percent solution it is useful in the treatment of pharyngitis and laryngitis; in the same strength solution it has been used with benefit as a bladder irrigation in the treatment of chronic cystitis. Internally administered, camphoric acid gives good results as an intestinal disinfectant, proving beneficial in the treatment of diarrhea resulting from intestinal fermentation."


    https://books.google.com/books/about/Salol_in_the_Treatment_of_Diarrhea_Dysen.html?id=pxjntgAACAAJ
    https://salol.askdefine.com/
    "...Phenyl salicylate, or salol, is a chemical substance, introduced in 1886 by Marceli Nencki of Basel. It can be created by heating salicylic acid with phenol. It has been used as an intestinal antiseptic based on the antibacterial activity upon hydrolysis in the small intestine. Once used in sunscreens, phenyl salicylate is now used in the manufacture of some polymers, lacquers, adhesives, waxes and polishes.. Salicylamides are a type of drug."

    http://www.homeoint.org/clarke/s/salol.htm
    "...Salol was primarily used as an anti-rheumatic, especially in the treatment of acute cases. It was given as an antipyretic, in 30 to 45 grain doses, in powders or tablets. It is soluble in ether and petroleum spirit; very sparingly, if at all, in water. It does not disturb digestion because it passes through the stomach unaltered, being decomposed in the duodenum, by the ferments of the pancreas, into Salicylic acid and Phenol (it contains 38 per cent. of Phenol). These are excreted by the kidneys, and the condition of intestinal digestion has been estimated by the length of time required, after the ingestion of Salol, for them to appear in the urine. Upon this property also has been based the use of the remedy in acute diarrhœa, dysentery, cholera, and other diseases where intestinal asepsis is indicated, and also in affections of the bladder and urethra as a substitute for ordinary mechanical irrigations and injections. Its internal use in gonorrhœa (in 5-gr. doses three times a day) has met with much success (Helbing)."

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29000448
    "...Salol is an easily administered, safe drug in the first stage of acute gastroenteritis in children, and in the more chronic forms of entrorcolitis, accompanied by slimy, bad-smelling evacuations. In the acute condition, it is necessary to keep the stomach at rest and administer two or three doses of salol within five or six hours. For the more chronic state of catarrh it is best given in somewhat larger doses belore meals. In frequent serious discharges, and in colitis, the salol does not produce the same good results as in the cases mentioned above, and its effect is uncertain, not being so rapid or so sure as an opiate. In dysenteric disorders it cannot be relied on. It seems, then, that salol acts best in morbid conditions, due to fermentation and decomposition in the stomach and upper bowel, and that it diminishes in power as it passess through the large intestine."

    Disclaimer: The fact that this post and product description contain quotes from Ray Peat does not mean he endorses/approves of this product. His opinions on a chemical may change when new evidence becomes available in the future, so future inquiries about a chemical, solvent, ingredients, etc contained in this product may elicit a different response than his quotes included in this post. Please seek his opinion independently on any chemical, solvent, ingredient, etc that you may have concerns/questions about.

    The units listed on the label are just for measurement purposes. They do not indicate or suggest optimal dose. The product can be ordered from the link below:
    http://www.idealabsdc.com

    *******************************************************************************
    CamphoSal is a liquid product containing a combination of camphoric acid and phenyl salicylate (Salol). Both of these ingredients were widely used clinically in the late 19th and early 20th century as intestinal antiseptics / disinfectants when antibiotics were not widely available and barely known. There is some evidence that both may have beneficial effect beyond modulating the intestinal microbiome (e.g. gonorrhea), however there is no recent research in that area, and as such no definitive statements can be made.

    Serving size: 25 drops
    Servings per container: about 30
    Each serving contains the following ingredients:

    Camphoric Acid, FG: 200mg
    Salol (phenyl salicylate), FG: 100mg

    Other ingredients: add product to shopping cart to see info
    *******************************************************************************
     
  2. Inaut

    Inaut Member

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    Fresh out.

    I love camphor so I may need to try this product
     
  3. johnwester130

    johnwester130 Member

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    does this freshen breath ?
     
  4. Mauritio

    Mauritio Member

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    Ordered. Finally its here! Been waiting so long for an anti-biotic supplement from you:) plus my 100 bucks worth order of fish antibiotics got confiscated by customs :/ hope this wont happen with this one...
     
  5. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    It does but it does not give it a "flavor" like a chewing gum would do. It simply removes bad breath. Considering the solvent is ethanol and both ingredients are great antiseptics, it can actually be used it as mouthwash similar to Listerine but without the burn Listerine produces. Also, it may synergize with methylene blue when the latter is used as a mouth wash.
     
  6. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    It shouldn't get confiscated. As far as I can see, the ingredients are not listed as drugs or prohibited chemicals in most countries, but of course it is always up to customs to decide what they let in.
     
  7. Mauritio

    Mauritio Member

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    Yes , never had problems with your products . Even more controversial stuff , and it doesnt say antibiotic on the label so I think we should be good...
     
  8. Soren

    Soren Member

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    Looking forward to experimenting with this one.
     
  9. hmac

    hmac Member

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    Thankyou for the product Haidut. I'm keen to give it a try but have a few reservations.

    Firstly, I think aspirin can downregulate mucous production - if this is true is it possible that having salicylic acid in the gut could be damaging to the intestinal mucosa?

    Secondly, it mentions that phenol is excreted by the kidneys which means it gets into circulation. Given that phenol has been used to execute prisoners, is this a safe thing to have floating around inside us?

    PS - what kind of results have you seen during experimentation?
     
  10. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    Aminosalicylates are used for treating inflammatory bowel disease, so I doubt salicylic acid is dangerous, especially in the small amounts found in this product. Similar response to phenol - you ingest and absorb several times more phenol on a daily basis from food than what you'd get from this product. Did you check how much phenol is typically used to execute people? I highly doubt it is 40mg, which is what you get from a single dose of CamphoSal and how much is contained in every liter of human urine.
    Phenol - Wikipedia
    "...Phenol is a normal metabolic product, excreted in quantities up to 40 mg/L in human urine.[46]"
     
  11. amaranthine

    amaranthine Member

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    What would the dosage/amount of drops per day for intestinal disinfection be? Also can it have any effect on thinning the blood like aspirin would?
     
  12. jb116

    jb116 Member

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    Damn, I'm getting this for my relatives, etc but for myself I'm hesitant. Aspirin is great but for us small sect of crohns weirdos, we don't respond well to it, even if in remission like myuself. Aspirin is a great mystery to me and it confirms that there is still a missing piece of the puzzle when it comes to crohns that separates from "normal" people. Camphor on the other hand :) has been one of my secret weapons.
     
  13. LuckyCat

    LuckyCat Member

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    Excellent! Would this be a 2x a week kind of thing or a daily one?
     
  14. GAF

    GAF Member

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    Ordered 2.

    CamphoSal is in the "cosmetics" section. That means that we can apply it into or onto our human body in any way and any where that we choose. There is no need to purchase more lab "rats" in order to experiment with this product.
     
  15. ecstatichamster

    ecstatichamster Member

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    Thanks @haidut this is brilliant.
     
  16. Peat's coffee

    Peat's coffee Member

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    Ordered.
    I'm excited to try this as I've had a lot of benefits using other antibiotics (tetracycline and macrolide class).
    A couple quick questions,
    1. If you experimented with camphosal, what effects did you notice, and do you think that there would be any reason to use topically vs orally?
    2. Any opinion or research you've seen about bacteria adapting to either chemical in camphosal?
    Thanks very much for your thoughts, and thank you for all the good work you do!
     
  17. jaakkima

    jaakkima Member

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    +1 on blood thinning question, I would like to know if this would have a comparable effect to a similar amount of aspirin...
    Also, any advice on how best to ingest it so it best gets to the small intestine and colon, or does it matter? I'm thinking drink it in juice or what...
     
  18. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    Well, as Peat suggested 100mg-200mg camphoric acid daily should be enough. In our product 25 drops has 200mg camphoric acid, so I would start with say 10-12 drops and see how that goes and increase to 25 drops if no benefit is felt.
    In terms of blood thinning - the 100mg phenyl salicylate has abut 60mg salicylic acid, so this is about the same as a baby aspirin (80mg-100mg) would provide.
     
  19. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    Peat said even a single use of camphoric acid helped him and from what I can see based on the older studies it was used daily for a week and then sporadically as needed. So, maybe best to start with a week of daily usage and then fall back to 2x weekly or even more rarely if there are no signs of bacterial overgrowth.
     
  20. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    So, as I always do with any product before releasing, I used it for about 2 weeks continuously and then sporadically for another month. Initially, it sounds in the GI tract and stimulated bowel movement which I took as a sign that there was indeed some bacterial overgrowth that needed to be addressed. After the 4th day, the sounds subsided and I seemed to not get the serotonin/histamine symptoms after a high-starch meal. So maybe it strengthens the gut barrier somehow or the reduced bacterial count means less serotonin even if starch does absorb through the colonic wall. It also seems to increase tolerance to alcohol and improve cognitive performance, which I suspect is due to a mild direct dopaminergic or anti-serotonin effect.
    I can't legally discuss oral use, as all products are released as external formulations only. For what it's worth, both ingredients and the ethanol used are food-grade materials.
    As far as resistance - IMO not likely to develop as camphoric acid, phenol and salicylic acid all seem to kill bacteria through generations of ROS - a mechanism similar to the one of methylene blue (MB) when used with red light (photodynamic therapy). That's one of the reasons photodynamic therapy is so promising - no known resistance mechanism exists that the bacteria can reply upon. Initially, the bacteria can use reduced glutathione (GSH) to protect itself (just as cancer cells do) but over time GSH levels drop due to being used for neutralization of ROS and eventually the bacteria succumb.
     
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